Zoas being wiped out

[RedG]

Hello we need help find out out what is wiping out our Zoas, we lost two euphylias Hammers (but torches seem to be doing fine)

It started probably 3-4 weeks ago, and it seems to affect a colony at a time.

We were also dealing with Cyano issue (no red, green) and we just did the ChemiClean last week.

My parameters below, our system used to be more rich on Nitrate and Phosphate, but we been trying to get it more under control and the numbers are a bit better; however it seems corals used to like it more before because we didn’t have this problem, only the green sand bed.

We added a little refugium which to us was hard to manage and lasted only about a month (will like to try this again on the future), we do weekly water changes of 30 gallons on a 155 gallon system including sump.

Filter socks changed at every water change, and UV light is on.

Current Levels:
Nitrate 9.5 via Hanna
Phosphate .08 via Hanna
DKH 8.6 via Hanna
Calcium 370 via Redsea
Magnesium 1240 via Redsea
Salinity 1.024
PH 8.15 via Salifert
Ammonia 0 via Salifert

Thank you for your advice.

 

[Lavey29]

So everything started happening after the chemiclean treatment? Did you skim out left over harsh chemical and water change after the treatment? Running carbon?

Do you have leather corals? Did you have dinos?

 

[RedG]

Nope it was there before the chemi-clean. We did the chemi-clean because wanted to clear out the sand bed, and some corals that had it on top. Don’t really think it was dynos

 

[RedG]

He is a vid of how loose pieces of the colonies get leaving the rock, whatever it is it attacks one colony at a time it seems

Zoas problem

 

[Lavey29]

Nope it was there before the chemi-clean. We did the chemi-clean because wanted to clear out the sand bed, and some corals that had it on top. Don’t really think it was dynos

Euphyllia can get bacteria infection but not typically affecting zoas. Have you done a recent ICP test to look at everything?

 

[Lavey29]

He is a vid of how loose pieces of the colonies get leaving the rock, whatever it is it attacks one colony at a time it seems

Zoas problem

What fish do you have?

 

[RedG]

Tangs, wrasses, blenny, dottyback, flamehawk, diamond gobby, clowns, fox face, yeah a flame angel (but never seen him picking at the coral)

 

[mfollen]

Zoa get affected by bacterial issues. Possibly fungal, or other pathogens, but there are a wide reports of suspected bacterial issues for a long time with zoa.
Unfortunately it is a black box as of now.

 

[907_Reefer]

Just to add to the list, my asterinas eat them faster than I can remove the asterinas.

 

[RedG]

Can this bacteria just grow out of nowhere?
Any treatment that can boost them up to give them a better chance?
I almost sure is the same thing that killed the Hammers, and will hate to see the Zoas go and not able to do anything for them.

We haven’t added anything to tank in well over 8 months

 

[Lavey29]

Tangs, wrasses, blenny, dottyback, flamehawk, diamond gobby, clowns, fox face, yeah a flame angel (but never seen him picking at the coral)

Well probably not but if flame angels don't have sufficient sponge in their diet they will go after softs and even euphyllia.

 

[Lavey29]

Can this bacteria just grow out of nowhere?
Any treatment that can boost them up to give them a better chance?
I almost sure is the same thing that killed the Hammers, and will hate to see the Zoas go and not able to do anything for them.

We haven’t added anything to tank in well over 8 months

The bacterias are already in the tank but coral immune systems keep them at bay. When a stress event occurs it can cause coral immune systems to be compromised thus allowing the bacteria to invade. This is how BJD attacks corals.

 

[littlebigreef]

Can this bacteria just grow out of nowhere?
Any treatment that can boost them up to give them a better chance?
I almost sure is the same thing that killed the Hammers, and will hate to see the Zoas go and not able to do anything for them.

We haven’t added anything to tank in well over 8 months

As Mark pointed out bacterial and protozoans are extremely common and in my experience are probably the #1 killer of zoas in most displays (#2 is malnutrition). Usually its through the introduction of new corals that something rides along and then sets up shop and starts knocking zoa colonies out. The possibility something can jump from a euphyllia to a zoa? Uncertain.

It's been my experience that infections can arise in stable closed systems that haven't had any new introductions. This is usually when you have poor water flow and detritus, dinos, etc start festering between polyps. Alternatively, I've had issues come up when you have a significant one time even shock the system (profound dip in salinity, spike in alkalinity, significant temp swing).

What I think is more likely is that, if not the flame, then your fox face is chewing on them. Fox face are great for algae control (especially bubble) but time and again I've had them go rogue in friend's aquariums. Quite honestly either of them are a strong candidate to be a culprit.

Back to the task at hand. If we were to suspect a bacterial infection chemi-clean is the only good 'in-tank' system-wide treatment.

If you can grab some additional daylight pics of affected colonies I'd be happy to take a look.

 

[RedG]

Thanks for the feedback, I will grab some better pics and post. Out of all those possibilities mentioned I would go with the dKH swing and sometimes our system has seen 2-3 point change over a few days that we were not home and couldn’t supplement. There I have to say we could probably do a bit better.

The Foxface is so chilled he is usually never by that area of the tank, I was suspect more the Angel (but even him I doubt it) never seen any of the fish messed with the coral we usually feed them twice a day.

 

[mrpontiac80]

I am kinda in the same situation. My thoughts lean towards chemiclean changing the microbiome or bacteria’s in the tank. I am currently seeing the same stuff in my system. For a solid year I’ve seen nothing but good things happening in the tank and started noticing cyano. It got to where it was starting to cover lots of areas and I have tons of flow with 4 gyres.

I did the chemiclean treatment and it worked as it had before with great success. But a few weeks later I noticed some zoas (Mohawks or nirvana ) started melting away. Didn’t really think much of it as they are a weed I wish I never put in the tank. But then a couple of acros browned out and then I lost a dragon soul torch that had been growing very well with multiple heads. Now I’m seeing a 24k torch looking worse than normal.

I don’t have anything factual or evidence but I really wonder if something changed after chemiclean in terms of the bacteria. Maybe it upset the balance.

 

[RedG]

That is scary for sure. Mine started before the chemi clean though. I used it for the first time a week ago, but the Zoas issue and Hammers were gone already so I doubt that was the cause.

 

[mfollen]

Chemiclean is proven to reduce diversity, including wiping out some major bacterioplankton.
Acros can get stressed from chemiclean too.
It can help some of these zoa issues such as brown film, but it creates other issues with system treatments.
It’s best for a dip IMO

 

[vetteguy53081]

Often when zoas do this, it can be as simple as elevated phos despite your reading from Hanna as well as low nutrient levels, use of NoPox and other forms of vodka dosing and target feeding which can upset them.
Any fish you have noticed at feeding which may be chasing the food that lands on top of their polyps?

 

[Peair]

Also check for pests on the zoas, sometimes there is eggs that hatch months later that cause problems, keep an eye on them for small sea spiders, they are common with zoas and impact the growth of coral.

 

[VintageReefer]

Have you dipped an affected colonies for pests ?

Have you waited until a few hours after lights out, complete darkness, and looked with a flashlight ?

You could have zoa eating nudibranch or you could have those tiny white starfish eating them. Both happened to me. Within the last year