A few new ones to be critiqued please

[drainbamage]

I know that the frag plugs still have a bit of nuisance algae going on, which is clearing up as I get the mag levels raised up finally, but looking for tips on how to improve the pictures technique wise (as opposed to purchasing new equipment,) or just anything in general you think I could be tweaking a little better.

Still trying to dial in color balance, having a tough time with some, especially photoing blue things and getting a white balance that still shows off the blue of the coral. Not sure how to post specifics of each picture as someone did last time, so if you have that software, please feel free to do so.

Also-any suggestions on how to dial in the camera settings? Right now it's take a picture, take out the mem card and upload pic to computer, then transfer file and pull it up on the screen to check out what it looked like- obviously a bit on the tedious side. The display on the back of the camera is ok, but not great for figuring out color balance, metering, depth of focus, etc, so any suggestions would be appreciated.

%<- GPS

These guys are more blue than showing here

but capturing under actinics washes them out in another way

Similar problem with these guys who contain a lot of blue-any suggested whitebalance range to try out?

also having issue with random orange blob going on- was there in the raw pic, and not tweaking anything in post-editing beyond cropping/resizing/exposure balance, so where is the blob-o'-doom coming from?

Another blob of doom on the right side, plus some general graininess-do I need to tweak down the ISO some? I think I had it set at 800 for these.

Next one is these jawbreakers- these are a smaller polyp, is it going to be possible to capture them with my 14-42mm non-macro lense? Or do I just need to accept getting only more far-away shots than closeups?

Thanks in advance, really appreciate all the advice you guys have been giving, and I believe it's paying off (even if some of these may not show it :tongue: )

 

[returnofsid]

Your EXIF Data is viewable. A little later, I'll spend some time on this thread, looking through the pics a lil' more closely, and comparing the pics to the EXIF Data. In the meantime, does you camera offer you an option to set a Custom White Balance? Typically, most cameras will have 6-8 preset white balance settings, such as cloudy, sunny, fluorescent, halogen, etc. Among those, there may be an option, in the settings, to chose a custom white balance. Let us know if your camera gives you that option. Then I can walk you through HOW to set up a custom white balance.

 

[returnofsid]

According to this, Archived Products &gt EVOLT E-510 , you do have a little custom white balance control. Reading up on it now, to see just how much customization you have, and the steps on how to set your custom white balance. If you see any Kelvin options, in your white balance settings, try 14K or 20K, to see if it helps. Still reading up on the specs of your camera.

 

[returnofsid]

Okay, let's start with the photos you took.

The first photo shows EXIF Data of:


* Exposure Time (1 / Shutter Speed) = 1/25 second ===> 0.04 second
* Lens F-Number / F-Stop = 9/1 ===> ƒ/9
* Exposure Program = aperture priority (3)
* ISO Speed Ratings = 800
* EXIF Version = 0221
* Original Date/Time = 2011:03:07 12:55:18
* Digitization Date/Time = 2011:03:07 12:55:18
* Components Configuration = 0x01,0x02,0x03,0x00 / YCbCr
* Exposure Bias (EV) = 0/1 ===> 0
* Max Aperture Value (APEX) = 5357/1482 ===> 3.61
Max Aperture = ƒ/3.5
* Metering Mode = spot (3)
* Light Source / White Balance = other (255)
* Flash = Flash did not fire, auto mode
* Focal Length = 42/1 mm ===> 42 mm
* User Comment (Hex) = 0x41,0x53,0x43,0x49,0x49,0x00,0x00,0x00
User Comment Character Code = ASCII
User Comment =
* FlashPix Version = 0100
* Colour Space = 65535
* Image Width = 800 pixels
* Image Height = 654 pixels
* Image Source = digital still camera (DSC)
* Colour Filter Array (CFA) Geometric Pattern = 0x02,0x00,0x02,0x00,0x00,0x01,0x01,0x02
* Custom Rendered = custom process (1)
* Exposure Mode = auto exposure (0)
* White Balance = manual (1)
* Digital Zoom Ratio = 1/1 ===> 1
* Scene Capture Type = standard (0)
* Gain Control = high gain up (2)
* Contrast = hard (2)
* Saturation = high (2)
* Sharpness = hard (2)
* Gamma = 11/5 ===> 2.2

Most of this isn't important, so for the remaining photos, I'll limit the EXIF Data to what matters...lol.

You're shooting in AV (Aperture priority) Mode. This allows you to choose a specific Aperture and the camera automatically adjusts everything else, according to what the camera "sees," to give a proper exposure. This works well, unless the camera is automatically adjusting the shutter speed to too slow or adjusting the ISO too high.

In the case of the first image, you set the aperture at F9, which is okay, as it offers a fairly good depth of field, keeping a larger portion of the image in focus.

In this case, your camera set the shutter speed at 1/25th of a second, which may be a little slow, if there's any movement in the frame or if you're hand holding the camera.
The camera set your ISO at 800, which is probably a lil' high and will result in grain, in the darker areas of the photo.

It appears you had the camera set for a Manual White balance #1. I'm not sure what the #1 refers to.

The picture actually looks really good, though you say it's not quite true to color. Our lighting can be very confusing to cameras and it's quite normal for them to not be able to get the color right. Our cameras have an even more difficult time with Actinic lighting, as you've noticed, in your second photo.

Also, if we under expose our photos, slightly, this sometimes helps bring out colors that are otherwise washed out. To do this, you'll need to be shooting in Manual Mode. In your view finder, you should see a scale, that may look something like this. -----------+---------- The center is supposed to represent "Proper Exposure." Now, on this scale, you'll also see an arrow or another cross, that represents the exposure you'll get, according to the current settings. As you move the camera from areas of light, to areas of darkness, you'll see that mark move. You can control that mark, by adjusting settings. To the left of the center, is under exposure, to the right of center is over exposure. A step or two, under exposed, might give you better color rendition. I almost always shoot a couple of steps "Left of Center."

In Manual Mode, set an appropriate shutter speed, for your shooting conditions. Fast enough to stop movement, if there is any, and fast enough to eliminate any movement from you, if you're hand holding. From here, now set your aperture, while watching the scale. What you're aiming for is to move the "marker" a step or two "left of center." Oh, set your ISO at no more than 400. If your Fstop number is real high, at the point, 2 steps left of center, you can speed up your shutter, and lower your Fstop number, to compensate.

To start with, retake the first photo, and try F9, shutter 1/25th again and lower your ISO to 400 or even 200. This will result in a lil' darker photo that the first one. All settings will be the same except the ISO. See if this gives you a more accurate color rendition. It could be that the blue is getting slightly washed out. Higher Fstops will result in less washing out of colors. But may also result in the need for a slower shutter speed.

I sure hope this is making sense...lol.

On to your second photo.

Let's talk about your white balance. It appears your camera does give you the ability to set a Custom White Balance. In order to do this, you're going to need something that's either true white or gray scale, that you can put IN your tank, under the lights. A white styrofoam plate works great. Ya see, us humans, when we see a white piece of paper, lit with unnatural lighting, such as fluorescents, in an office, are still able to adjust and see a true white piece of paper. Our brain filters out the green cast, from the lighting. Our cameras aren't as "smart," so sometimes we have to tell our cameras what "white" is.

Place a white styrofoam plate in your tank, under your lights. You're going to take a picture of it, filling the frame with the white and making sure it's in focus. Then, you're going to go into your Custom WB settings and, using that photo, tell the camera what "White" is. Now your camera will "filter" out the blue, in the right amount, showing true colors. I'm unsure of the exact steps, of setting a CWB, with your particular camera, but the instruction manual should show you the steps. You will need to do this, for Actinic shots, especially. Setting a CWB for actinics and full light, will be the best solution.

Your camera is trying to "filter" out blue, but isn't filtering it out correctly.

Alternatively, some cameras allow a CWB to be set, based on Kelvin temperatures. If yours allows this, you need to adjust it, based on the Kelvin of your lights.

These steps should help, with Actinic only shots!

 

[returnofsid]

Sorry I'm so long winded!!

Let's skip to photo #4 and #5.

You mention "orange blobs." I'm not seeing anything at all, that matches your description...lol. In pic #4, I do see something orange, to the left and behind the zoanthids. This appears to be a coral, out of focus. In pic #5, I see something orange, to the left of the left hand zoanthids, which appears to maybe be a piece of shrimp?

The "general graininess" seen in the darker areas and out of focus areas, is definitely due to the high ISO of 800.

EXIF Data shows that the only change was a faster shutter speed. I assume the camera saw more light, and adjusted the shutter speed accordingly. It can't adjust the aperture, because you're shooting in Av mode, again, meaning that you're telling the camera to give priority to keeping a specific Aperture, of F9.

The last photo:

As far as your question, regarding the lens, Yes, it is still possible to capture them, using your existing lens, BUT you'll need to do a few things. Find out the closest focusing distance, with your particular lens. This distance will be the distance from the object, to the camera sensor. You'll need to be no closer than this distance. Next, make sure you are achieving good focus. In your last photo, the camera appears to have focused on a few tentacles, to the right, on one of the zoanthids towards the back of the frag. Because of this, most of the photo is out of focus. When you're looking at focus, think in distances. When your camera focuses on something, everything that's the same distance from the camera, will be in focus. So, find the distance that has most of the coral, and focus at that distance. If you get a nice photo, in focus, but not close enough, you can always crop the image, making it appear closer. Cropping will enhance any mistakes though, so it's important to have a well focused shot, with no, or low graininess. Again, I hope this is making sense...lol.

All in all, I'd suggest you consider using Manual Mode. In Manual mode, you have complete control over all of the settings. Make sure you're aware of how to adjust each setting, and how each setting effects what the camera sees. In general:

Aperture: a faster aperture (lower Fstop) will result in more light, but a small field of focus. Less of the object will be in focus.

Shutter: a faster shutter speed will stop movement, but allow less time for light to enter the lens, resulting in a darker image.

ISO: A higher ISO will make the sensor more sensitive to light, but result in more grain.

All 3 of these settings effect light and amount of focus and are very important to understand.

 

[EliteReefs]

holy crap thats some serious feedback. GREAt JOB

 

[soccerbag]

holy crap thats some serious feedback. GREAt JOB

Agreed! Thanks returnofsid for the good info. I know it took a lot of time to gather that info but I think a lot of us can learn from it. Very much appreciated!

 

[drainbamage]

Wow Sid- you've stunned me with how much info you put up there, can't say thanks enough-

Not going to reply in full right now as I need to get some other things done, but wanted to throw up a thank you real fast just to say well, thanks! All you photo guys on here have helped me considerably and I really appreciate it

 

[returnofsid]

You're welcome and again, sorry I am so long winded...lol. I'm notorious for doing that, as my family will confirm!! I truly hope that I at least was long winded, in an understandable way!!

Please don't hesitate to question anything that I failed to explain, in a way you understand. I'll do my best to either explain it better or send you some great links, to photography forums, that have some awesome tutorials!

 

[drainbamage]

Sid, just got a chance to read that all through- and wow, thanks a ton!

To answer a few basics- yes, the camera does have a semi-adjustable white balance, and I think that's what the #1 referred to, been playing with it a bit and starting to find a few that I like and not having to adjust post-processing.

I've noticed the under-expose trick, but only been able to figure it out in post-processing, so going to play with that more on-camera. I started with Macro mode, and started experimenting with aperture (only using a tripod, anything hand held still just use macro mode,) pure manual seems a bit beyond me still as playing with shutter speed was whole new territory (still figuring out f-stops) but I'll start playing with it and see what I can get. I know I cranked the ISO up too high in a few of those photos, went back and retook some after but wanted to see what else I could find out.

The orange blobs of doom are indeed out of focus pieces, I just know in reading sometimes people refer to highly colored blobs as proof of excessive photoshopping, so I was worried that I was doing something wrong, as I was getting those blobs before post-processing of any sort. I like that I'm learning how to take some ok photos, don't want to get a reputation of being one of "those" people that over-manipulates the photo, so wanted to make sure I was correcting that quickly.

That info about the depth of focus was great, I never really thought in those terms and always just force-focused on the center of the thing I was shooting without giving though to its relative depths.

To start playing in manual mode, should I stay in the 1/25th setting for shutter speed?

But please, nothing but thanks for that long-winded post, it was nothing but useful information and you got it dumbed down to my level pretty well, so I really appreciate that! I've avoided some of the photo forums just because of the learning curve I wasn't quite ready to jump into, plus as you said, our lighting is sort of unique compared to what many people are working with.

Here's a few new ones I'm really pretty happy about, mostly because I got the white balance pretty dialed in, but the top-down ones were taken in macro mode so wasn't as hard of work :tongue:

%<- GPS

 

[returnofsid]

Very nice!!!

The reason you're having troubles figuring out how to "under expose," is because you're shooting in Ap mode. The camera won't let you under expose, in that mode...lol. It's automatically making changes to shutter speed, and ISO, in order to get, what it things is, proper exposure. In manual mode, you'll be able to force the under exposure, without the camera overriding your settings.

Your latest pictures are very good!