A recently discovered parasitic bacterium causes disease and impaired growth in corals

[AquaBiomics]

My understanding is that Chemiclean is an antibiotic, erythromycin (*).

I would be cautious about whole-tank antibiotic treatments. Most of these are pretty broad spectrum; few antibiotics have the specificity we'd really want in a case like this. Kind of like spraying herbicide on your garden to get rid of some weeds. A very extreme solution IMO.

I will be testing some whole tank antibiotic treatments, but until such data are in hand, I personally think its wise to avoid whole tank antibiotics.

Regarding possible probiotic treatments, I want to add a few thoughts:.

1. It's worth distinguishing between treatments claiming to contain live bacteria and treatments containing nutrients that promote the growth of certain bacteria. These are sometimes properly labeled as probiotics and prebiotics respecively, sometimes not. (Formally this distinction is used for human dietary supplements but is also useful here).
2. Less than 1% of marine bacteria can be cultured, and only a small fraction of bacteria can form cysts that allow long term storage. Please note that is not Zero -- some bottled bacterial products do in fact contain live marine bacteria. But as a general rule, we should all be very skeptical that any new product contains live bacteria, without evidence.
3. In both the human gut and the ocean, it is well established that the kind and amount of nutrients available play a huge role in shaping the microbiome. Its relatively easy to deliver nutrients, and we know they have a big effect.

IOW, out of bottled bacteria, antibiotics, or nutrients - I think nutrients are the safest and most effective way to go. These experiments are next on my list.

*Side note - I really wish the hobbyist community would insist on knowing ingredients; IMO we should refuse to buy additive where the ingredients are not disclosed. Secrecy by additive suppliers helps no one including the company. Patent protections exist for a reason, and there is nothing stopping a company from disclosing their ingredients and continuing to make a profit. OK, early morning rant over

 

[GlassMunky]

My understanding is that Chemiclean is an antibiotic, erythromycin (*).

I would be cautious about whole-tank antibiotic treatments. Most of these are pretty broad spectrum; few antibiotics have the specificity we'd really want in a case like this. Kind of like spraying herbicide on your garden to get rid of some weeds. A very extreme solution IMO.

I will be testing some whole tank antibiotic treatments, but until such data are in hand, I personally think its wise to avoid whole tank antibiotics.

Regarding possible probiotic treatments, I want to add a few thoughts:.

1. It's worth distinguishing between treatments claiming to contain live bacteria and treatments containing nutrients that promote the growth of certain bacteria. These are sometimes properly labeled as probiotics and prebiotics respecively, sometimes not. (Formally this distinction is used for human dietary supplements but is also useful here).
2. Less than 1% of marine bacteria can be cultured, and only a small fraction of bacteria can form cysts that allow long term storage. Please note that is not Zero -- some bottled bacterial products do in fact contain live marine bacteria. But as a general rule, we should all be very skeptical that any new product contains live bacteria, without evidence.
3. In both the human gut and the ocean, it is well established that the kind and amount of nutrients available play a huge role in shaping the microbiome. Its relatively easy to deliver nutrients, and we know they have a big effect.

IOW, out of bottled bacteria, antibiotics, or nutrients - I think nutrients are the safest and most effective way to go. These experiments are next on my list.

*Side note - I really wish the hobbyist community would insist on knowing ingredients; IMO we should refuse to buy additive where the ingredients are not disclosed. Secrecy by additive suppliers helps no one including the company. Patent protections exist for a reason, and there is nothing stopping a company from disclosing their ingredients and continuing to make a profit. OK, early morning rant over

Here’s the MSDS for chemiclean
Material Safety Data Sheet

CHEMI-CLEAN

Distributor: Boyd Enterprises
1670 NE 205 Terrace
Miami, FL 33179
Ph: 305-651-2496
Fax: 305-651-2496

Section 1---Ingredients



Section 2---Physical data

Appearance: White powder

Section 3—First Aid Measures

Inhalation: Remove to fresh air
Ingestion: Wash out mouth with water.
Skin contact: Immediately flush skin with copious amounts of water.
Eye contact: Immediately flush eyes with copious amounts of water

Section 4—Hazard Data

May Cause sensitization by inhalation and skin contact.
In case of accident or if you feel unwell. Seek out medical advice. Bring at least the label of product with you

Section 5---Fire Fighting Methods

Fire: Emits toxic fumes under fire conditions
Explosion: not applicable
Fire extinguishing Media: Water spray, or applicable foam.
Special information: Wear appropriate protective gear for toxic fumes.

Section 6---Accidental Release Measures

Remove all possible ignition sources. Ventilate are of leak or spill. Wear appropriate personal protective equipment as specified in Section 8
Spills: Sweep up, place in bag and hold for waste disposal. Avoid raising dust, wash spill site after material pickup is complete.


Section 7---Handling and Storage

Keep tightly closed. Store in a cool, dry place. Refer to Section 8

Section 8---Exposure Control / Personal Protection

Ventilation system: Mechanical exhaust required. Avoid Prolonged or repeated exposure.
Personal Respirators: Wear appropriate NIOSH respirator
Skin Protection: Compatible chemical-resistant gloves; lab coat; apron or coveralls; boots, avoid prolonged or repeated exposure. Wash thoroughly after handling
Eye Protection: Use Chemical safety goggles and/or full face-shield where dusting or splashing of solutions is possible.

Section 9---Toxicological Information

Acute effects: May be harmful by inhalation, ingestion, or skin absorption. May cause allergic reaction. Exposure can cause: stomach pains, vomiting, and diarrhea
To the best of our knowledge, the chemical- physical, and toxicological properties have no been thoroughly investigated.
LD 50 (oral – mouse) > 10 g/kg
Target Organ Data: Behavioral (ataxia)
Gastrointestinal (nausea or vomiting)
Liver (other changes)

Section 10---Ecological Information

Ecological Fate: No information found
Ecological toxicology: No information found


those don’t match the known info onerythromycin

 

[GlassMunky]

Granted it doesn’t actually say the ingredients but you can cross reference a few of the other things they do tell you with erythromycin and it doesn’t match
Granted they could have some other ingredients that combined somehow get there

 

[AquaBiomics]

Granted it doesn’t actually say the ingredients but you can cross reference a few of the other things they do tell you with erythromycin and it doesn’t match
Granted they could have some other ingredients that combined somehow get there

My understanding is based only on what I read on the forums at some point. I think someone had a lab attempt to ID it and concluded it contained erythromycin. Sorry, I should have stated my low certainty more clearly. I don't really know what's in it.

If we want to try antibiotic treatments for this or other unwanted microbes, there are quite a few antibiotics sold for use on fish that can be bought without a prescription. Speaking for myself, I'd test these before additives with unknown active ingredients. But we can test them all, its only a question of resources and priorities.

It would certainly be interesting to test a few of these widely used additives that appear to work through the microbial community, even if we don't know exactly what's in them!

 

[Hans-Werner]

I suggest to investigate the differences between tanks above and below a certain nitrate threshold, say something between 0.2 and 1 ppm.
It is possible to add nitrogen without adding nitrate. Does the nitrate addition have any really positive effect to the corals? If not, why does the widespread use continue?

 

[Cnidoblast]

Bob Stark (of B-IONIC fame) had the hypothesis that hard coral tissue necrosis syndromes were caused by overgrowth of Vibrio parahaemolyticus

I think he recently told me that researchers have been finding Vibiro species in reef tanks but that they have yet to isolate Vibrio parahaemolyticus

Vibrio parahaemolyticus dies fast from cipro so maybe somebody with a sick acro could try the nem cipro procedure?

 

[Huskymaniac]

A normal part of nature. There are probablly hundreds of different types bacteria in coral and under the right circumstances can become pathogenic. Sounds very similar to mycobacterium which most of us likely have in their tanks which under the right circumstance can infect you and wipe out your fish in time. I personally believe there is a balance of all these bacteria and they play an important role but when something gets out of whack a system can crash. For all we know this bacteria could actively feed on vibrio and myco and without it we could have levels in our tank that can cause disease in both us and our finned friends.

 

[AquaBiomics]

Bob Stark (of B-IONIC fame) had the hypothesis that hard coral tissue necrosis syndromes were caused by overgrowth of Vibrio parahaemolyticus

I think he recently told me that researchers have been finding Vibiro species in reef tanks but that they have yet to isolate Vibrio parahaemolyticus

Vibrio parahaemolyticus dies fast from cipro so maybe somebody with a sick acro could try the nem cipro procedure?

Several Vibrio species have been linked to White Syndrome, which is a natural syndrome that *appears to be* the same thing as RTN.

Reef tanks are FULL of Vibrio based on my recent survey, in a couple cases making up >10% of the microbial community. But I have yet to find any of the known pathogenic kinds of Vibrio in a reef tank. The only known coral pathogen I have found was the one discussed in the OP - Aquarickettsia rohweri.

But I've mostly received samples from healthy tanks so far I look forward to getting my hands on some tanks that are struggling so we can see if any of these known pathogens are involved...

 

[Cnidoblast]

Thanks for the input!!!!!! - I normally do stuff involving pathogenic fungi and ameba so this is a bit out of my league

Perhaps if the acro pathogen isn't a Vibiro species perhaps it's some funky Pseudomonas?

"Smells like grape juice!" - Bonus points if you know where this reference comes from (It was pretty recent)

 

[Will Wohlers]

This is totally anecdotal but i have a tank that's mostly sps and in this particular tank I use to put bubbletips I knew could be mixed. After adding a new bubbletip once I noticed the majority of them all started to decline in health. Being that there was roughly 25 btas in this tank I went against recommendations and did an entire 10 day cipro treatment. It was a ton of work having to change roughly 100 gallons of water a day but all anemones survived and despite believing it was crazy thinking all of the acros seemed to respond positively as well with better colors, thicker tissue and faster growth. Now I'm thinking maybe there is something there.

 

[jeffscooby13]

Hi everyone,

I'm posting to bring to your attention a fairly recent set of discoveries about a widespread coral pathogen.

This pathogen lives inside coral tissues, affects many species in the hobby, and causes diseases and reduced growth. The parasite can be transmitted by snail vectors and through the water. It occurs in about a third of corals in nature, and also occurs in hobbyist tanks.

I'm posting this here because it affects SPS and I think readers of this forum may be especially interested. [This came up in a discussion in another thread, and motivated me to do some additional reading about these recent discoveries. (thanks @reefwiser for first bringing this one to my attention, it has led to a lot of fun new reading.) ]

--

Microbiologists have recently discovered a parasitic bacterium that infects corals and other invertebrates. This is a member of the order Rickettsiales, most of which are parasites that can only survive inside the cells of their hosts. The order includes Wolbachia (a group of bacteria that occurs in the cells of most insects and nematodes) and several pathogens of human and livestock.

They've recently named this bacterium Aquarickettsia rohweri. Here I will summarize a few relevant facts about this recently described parasite that may interest keepers of SPS and other corals. There is obviously a lot that is still unknown about this bug, but here is what the research shows so far:

• It occurs in about 1/3 of wild corals sampled worldwide.
• It occurs in many genera that we keep as hobbyists, including Acropora, Montipora, Seriatopora, Stylophora, and Goniopora.
• It also occurs in anemones (including Aiptasia, as if you needed another reason to hate Aiptasia!) and Palythoa
• It causes White Band Disease in Acropora cervicornis.
• The pathogen can be transmitted by coral-eating snails, which also serve as a reservoir for the bacterium.
• The pathogen can also be transmitted through the water to injured corals. As someone who frags corals, this caught my attention.
• (Most interestingly of all) the parasite normally makes up a small part of infected corals' microbiomes, but nitrate enrichment leads to a bloom of A. rohweri and impaired coral growth in infected corals.
• Researchers hypothesize it directly steals ATP and amino acids from the host cells, sapping the host's energy.

References supporting these statements (open access peer reviewed journals):
Klinges et al. 2019 , Zaneveld et al. 2016 , Gignoux-Wolfsohn et al. 2012

Finally, is any of this relevant for us in the hobby? Well, I recently analyzed the microbiome of twenty hobbyist aquariums using similar methods as described in the 2016 reference above, and found this bacterium in 10% of tanks. Twenty aquariums is a small sample, but as the samples keep coming in we will learn more about its prevalence across hobbyist and aquaculture tanks. I don't think we've seen the last of it.

--

I speculate that this parasite which is so common in nature may contribute to the challenges of keeping freshly imported wild Acropora colonies.

And I wonder about possible treatments. Other members of the Rickettsiales respond well to some of the antibiotics marketed for managing fish diseases... I wouldnt want to treat every coral, but if I knew I had an infected coral I'd sure like to try it...

I'll be curious to hear your thoughts!

Human MD here. We frequently use doxycycline on rickettsial species. Any literature or data on safety in corals?

 

[AquaBiomics]

Human MD here. We frequently use doxycycline on rickettsial species. Any literature or data on safety in corals?

There is an embarrassing scarcity of "clinical" literature for corals, due to structural flaws in the funding agencies.. I'll spare you all that rant

In forums and a 2012 paper by Sweet and coauthors I can find anecdotal reports of doxycycline use by hobbyists, and I don't see any reports of safety issues. Administering antibiotics to corals comes with its own challenges (this paper does a good job of summarizing them) but can certainly be done.

I currently have corals, doxycyclin, 2 other antibiotics, and a bunch of swabs in hand I'll run an experiment over the next 2 days and analyze the effects on the coral microbiome in my next sequencing run. Who knows, maybe I'll get lucky and one of my imported colonies will have this bug...

Sweet, M., Jones, R., & Bythell, J. (2012). Coral diseases in aquaria and in nature. Journal of the Marine Biological Association of the United Kingdom, 92(4), 791-801.

 

[cvicente]

Hi everyone,

I'm posting to bring to your attention a fairly recent set of discoveries about a widespread coral pathogen.

This pathogen lives inside coral tissues, affects many species in the hobby, and causes diseases and reduced growth. The parasite can be transmitted by snail vectors and through the water. It occurs in about a third of corals in nature, and also occurs in hobbyist tanks.

I'm posting this here because it affects SPS and I think readers of this forum may be especially interested. [This came up in a discussion in another thread, and motivated me to do some additional reading about these recent discoveries. (thanks @reefwiser for first bringing this one to my attention, it has led to a lot of fun new reading.) ]

--

Microbiologists have recently discovered a parasitic bacterium that infects corals and other invertebrates. This is a member of the order Rickettsiales, most of which are parasites that can only survive inside the cells of their hosts. The order includes Wolbachia (a group of bacteria that occurs in the cells of most insects and nematodes) and several pathogens of human and livestock.

They've recently named this bacterium Aquarickettsia rohweri. Here I will summarize a few relevant facts about this recently described parasite that may interest keepers of SPS and other corals. There is obviously a lot that is still unknown about this bug, but here is what the research shows so far:

• It occurs in about 1/3 of wild corals sampled worldwide.
• It occurs in many genera that we keep as hobbyists, including Acropora, Montipora, Seriatopora, Stylophora, and Goniopora.
• It also occurs in anemones (including Aiptasia, as if you needed another reason to hate Aiptasia!) and Palythoa
• It causes White Band Disease in Acropora cervicornis.
• The pathogen can be transmitted by coral-eating snails, which also serve as a reservoir for the bacterium.
• The pathogen can also be transmitted through the water to injured corals. As someone who frags corals, this caught my attention.
• (Most interestingly of all) the parasite normally makes up a small part of infected corals' microbiomes, but nitrate enrichment leads to a bloom of A. rohweri and impaired coral growth in infected corals.
• Researchers hypothesize it directly steals ATP and amino acids from the host cells, sapping the host's energy.

References supporting these statements (open access peer reviewed journals):
Klinges et al. 2019 , Zaneveld et al. 2016 , Gignoux-Wolfsohn et al. 2012

Finally, is any of this relevant for us in the hobby? Well, I recently analyzed the microbiome of twenty hobbyist aquariums using similar methods as described in the 2016 reference above, and found this bacterium in 10% of tanks. Twenty aquariums is a small sample, but as the samples keep coming in we will learn more about its prevalence across hobbyist and aquaculture tanks. I don't think we've seen the last of it.

--

I speculate that this parasite which is so common in nature may contribute to the challenges of keeping freshly imported wild Acropora colonies.

And I wonder about possible treatments. Other members of the Rickettsiales respond well to some of the antibiotics marketed for managing fish diseases... I wouldnt want to treat every coral, but if I knew I had an infected coral I'd sure like to try it...

I'll be curious to hear your thoughts!

The parasite was named after Dr. Forest Rohwer, if you have the opportunity read his work on carbon sources and the coral holobiont. Very interesting findings.

 

[AquaBiomics]

The parasite was named after Dr. Forest Rohwer, if you have the opportunity read his work on carbon sources and the coral holobiont. Very interesting findings.

Yeah, Forest Rohwer is a giant in the world of marine microbiology. And also a very entertaining speaker if you ever have the chance to hear him give a research talk.

I sometimes wonder how people feel about having parasites named after them. I mean what a great honor, but wouldnt you rather it was some harmless little fish or beetle or something?

 

[cvicente]

Yeah, Forest Rohwer is a giant in the world of marine microbiology. And also a very entertaining speaker if you ever have the chance to hear him give a research talk.

I sometimes wonder how people feel about having parasites named after them. I mean what a great honor, but wouldnt you rather it was some harmless little fish or beetle or something?

Hahaha true !

 

[offtropic]

A normal part of nature. There are probablly hundreds of different types bacteria in coral and under the right circumstances can become pathogenic. Sounds very similar to mycobacterium which most of us likely have in their tanks which under the right circumstance can infect you and wipe out your fish in time. I personally believe there is a balance of all these bacteria and they play an important role but when something gets out of whack a system can crash. For all we know this bacteria could actively feed on vibrio and myco and without it we could have levels in our tank that can cause disease in both us and our finned friends.

Yeah it is an interesting article but I think that the bacterial world as it relates to coral health is incredibly vast and complex. We don't have a grasp of the interactions of billions of bacteria that make up our own gut (or even our own soil if eating is important to you) so my guess is there is similar complexity as it relates to corals. Also (and this doesn't relate to the person quoted here), the inner bio nerd in me is having a hard time with the use of 'parasite' as a descriptor for bacteria. Parasites are eukaryotic organisms (with protozoans being the smallest). Harmful bacteria are pathogens (or pathogenic).

 

[AquaBiomics]

I'm not sure about that, I frequently hear microbiologists describe prokaryotes as parasites, including in the title of the ISME publication. But I agree, important to clarify whether we are talking about a prokaryote or eukaryote.

Here I think its used to distinguish what kind of relationship exists between the bacterium and its host. Symbiotic relationships like this may be mutualism (where both partners benefit) or parasitism (where one partner benefits at the expense of the other). This appears to be the latter.

 

[topjimmy]

I often wonder if I have some bacterial problem that kills Sps. LPS do fine. BTA fine, zoa fine, fish and inverts fine. Stable parameters yup. Coraline algae grows like mad. Sps live in the tank for about a month sometimes less, stn over that time, then poof.

 

[shred5]

My understanding is that Chemiclean is an antibiotic, erythromycin (*).

I would be cautious about whole-tank antibiotic treatments. Most of these are pretty broad spectrum; few antibiotics have the specificity we'd really want in a case like this. Kind of like spraying herbicide on your garden to get rid of some weeds. A very extreme solution IMO.

I will be testing some whole tank antibiotic treatments, but until such data are in hand, I personally think its wise to avoid whole tank antibiotics.

Regarding possible probiotic treatments, I want to add a few thoughts:.

1. It's worth distinguishing between treatments claiming to contain live bacteria and treatments containing nutrients that promote the growth of certain bacteria. These are sometimes properly labeled as probiotics and prebiotics respecively, sometimes not. (Formally this distinction is used for human dietary supplements but is also useful here).
2. Less than 1% of marine bacteria can be cultured, and only a small fraction of bacteria can form cysts that allow long term storage. Please note that is not Zero -- some bottled bacterial products do in fact contain live marine bacteria. But as a general rule, we should all be very skeptical that any new product contains live bacteria, without evidence.
3. In both the human gut and the ocean, it is well established that the kind and amount of nutrients available play a huge role in shaping the microbiome. Its relatively easy to deliver nutrients, and we know they have a big effect.

IOW, out of bottled bacteria, antibiotics, or nutrients - I think nutrients are the safest and most effective way to go. These experiments are next on my list.

*Side note - I really wish the hobbyist community would insist on knowing ingredients; IMO we should refuse to buy additive where the ingredients are not disclosed. Secrecy by additive suppliers helps no one including the company. Patent protections exist for a reason, and there is nothing stopping a company from disclosing their ingredients and continuing to make a profit. OK, early morning rant over

Some red slime removers are erythromycin but according to the company that makes Chemi clean it is not.
They claim it is not a antibiotic at all..

 

[kireek]

Fascinated. Would the addition or regular dosing of Iodine impact these things?