ALGAE OR BACTERIA?? microscope pics

[reef_4_ever]

So I have been battling some sort of nuisance algae/bacteria in my tank.

I believed it to be Lyngbya as none of my CUC (urchin, lawnmower blenny, turbo/margharita/nerite snails) would touch it. however now that I have close up pics of it it does not seem to match what I am finding on google searches.

I know i have LCA Dino on the slide. Been dosing Silicates and it is almost gone from my sand bed.

It spread very quickly and had initially treated with combo of chemiclean and reef flux for 2 weeks with a 48hr blackout period mid treatment. This knocked it back substantially. But as I did water changes to remove the chemicals it has been slowly creeping back and spreading. It is very difficult to remove from the rock. Scrubbing with stiff brushes does little to dislodge. ended up using tweezers to pull the samples i used for the photos attached.

Considering trying the H2o2 dosing 1ml/10gal treatment. I would like to avoid more chemicals in the tank if I can help it.

Appreciate any information or guidance.

Current tank parameters:
SG 1.025
PH 8.1-8.35
Nitrate 5
Phosphate .12 <- working on lowering
Alkalinity 9.1
Calcium 425
Magnesium 1350

Thanks,

Chris

 

[Dan_P]

So I have been battling some sort of nuisance algae/bacteria in my tank.

I believed it to be Lyngbya as none of my CUC (urchin, lawnmower blenny, turbo/margharita/nerite snails) would touch it. however now that I have close up pics of it it does not seem to match what I am finding on google searches.

I know i have LCA Dino on the slide. Been dosing Silicates and it is almost gone from my sand bed.

It spread very quickly and had initially treated with combo of chemiclean and reef flux for 2 weeks with a 48hr blackout period mid treatment. This knocked it back substantially. But as I did water changes to remove the chemicals it has been slowly creeping back and spreading. It is very difficult to remove from the rock. Scrubbing with stiff brushes does little to dislodge. ended up using tweezers to pull the samples i used for the photos attached.

Considering trying the H2o2 dosing 1ml/10gal treatment. I would like to avoid more chemicals in the tank if I can help it.

Appreciate any information or guidance.

Current tank parameters:
SG 1.025
PH 8.1-8.35
Nitrate 5
Phosphate .12 <- working on lowering
Alkalinity 9.1
Calcium 425
Magnesium 1350

Thanks,

Chris

Microscope photo looks like a hair alga.

 

[reef_4_ever]

Microscope photo looks like a hair alga.

After searching on here more I finally found a similar post with microscope pics identifying it as Derbesia. From what I have read it lines up perfectly to what I am experiencing.

Now question is to try ReefFlux again which did have a noticeable impact but for a longer duration as I only did 2 weeks of it prior to large water change. and ensuring it is 100% gone from the tank prior to water change

OR

Try H2O2 dosing at 1ml/10gal daily. My fear with this is the possible impact to corals and inverts. seems like there is conflicting information on whether this dose really dose have a harmful impact or not

 

[MnFish1]

Most people use no chemicals to deal with algae. I would look for natural predators

 

[reef_4_ever]

Most people use no chemicals to deal with algae. I would look for natural predators

I did start that route with a variety of different CUC that i Have listed. NONE touch it. When you look up Derbesia specifically many state there is no natural predator which initially let me down the rabbit hole of it not being an algae and it looks visually like LYNGBYA but after getting a microscope to identify the type of DINOs i had I found the cell structure is most certainly NOT a type of bacteria.

 

[DaJMasta]

What's the magnification? You're not going to be seeing individual bacteria unless you're on a higher magnification, they're much smaller. At least the green stuff is definitely algae, Lyngbya would have visible striations because those are the individual bacterial cells, and the brown moving one is too fast/dynamic to look like bacteria to me (plus too large, by a guess at the sharpness). It doesn't really look like Derbesia to be, either, but you can take a look at the tips of some strands and see if the tips have the white/clear end or look for other distinguishing features. Keep in mind that most of the easy-to-solve algae found in tanks don't get pictures taken of them, so while what you have may resemble some of the bad ones, it probably also resembles some of the algae aren't a problem. Don't assume a bad one unless you really can distinguish some features from other kinds, because most of the time it won't be, and because a lot of stuff can resemble other things at the very small scale.

How old is your tank? Your phosphate is likely fine, it probably doesn't need to be lower. Nitrate is on the low side, raising would be my personal preference but so long as you can detect it, it should be alright. For algae related issues I've gone with fluconazole (reef flux, flux rx) and had pretty reliable results with very few side effects, but if your tank isn't so old and you're in the middle of correcting another issue (dinos), I would just keep up that treatment as needed and wait for the ecosystem to step up and balance again. Just changing more things quickly can just cause it to veer somewhere new, and it could be that with some balancing out time, where you're at is actually fine.

 

[reef_4_ever]

What's the magnification? You're not going to be seeing individual bacteria unless you're on a higher magnification, they're much smaller. At least the green stuff is definitely algae, Lyngbya would have visible striations because those are the individual bacterial cells, and the brown moving one is too fast/dynamic to look like bacteria to me (plus too large, by a guess at the sharpness). It doesn't really look like Derbesia to be, either, but you can take a look at the tips of some strands and see if the tips have the white/clear end or look for other distinguishing features. Keep in mind that most of the easy-to-solve algae found in tanks don't get pictures taken of them, so while what you have may resemble some of the bad ones, it probably also resembles some of the algae aren't a problem. Don't assume a bad one unless you really can distinguish some features from other kinds, because most of the time it won't be, and because a lot of stuff can resemble other things at the very small scale.

How old is your tank? Your phosphate is likely fine, it probably doesn't need to be lower. Nitrate is on the low side, raising would be my personal preference but so long as you can detect it, it should be alright. For algae related issues I've gone with fluconazole (reef flux, flux rx) and had pretty reliable results with very few side effects, but if your tank isn't so old and you're in the middle of correcting another issue (dinos), I would just keep up that treatment as needed and wait for the ecosystem to step up and balance again. Just changing more things quickly can just cause it to veer somewhere new, and it could be that with some balancing out time, where you're at is actually fine.

Magnification was at 500x. I struggle to get a clear pic at higher mag.

The fast moving cell is LCA Dino. Almost completely gone been hard to find one on a slide.

I ruled out the bacteria when I saw they all have visible striations. I had other pics from slide that do have white/clear ends.

Tank is 6 months old.

I did dose some NeoNitro to bump up nitrates as they were a little low. Tank was stable when it was between 10-15

I did go through a Flux RX treatment for 2 weeks last month which i thought got rid of this completely. But as I resumed my weekly 10% water change regimen it has slowly started to reappear which coincides with what i have read others post in regards to derbesia.

I hesitate to hold off treating this as it did engulf a few frags prior and manual removal was difficult and ended up killing a few frags. It is starting to show within a few zoa colonies and at the base of a few hammers.