Can I keep a mandarin in a 32 gallon?

[Rodan]

I have a 32 gal bio cube running for a little bit over 10 months. I understand you need a lot of pods and I'm not sure how I would visually know. I can say that all over the glass I can see the paths of the pods eating algae. I added pods around like 8 months ago ,and then added more recently.

My fish are:
Midas blenny
clown pair
Diamond watchman goby

 

[blaxsun]

You don't have enough pods, no. A mandarin needs at least 60-80 gallons to be self-replicating.

 

[Rugops]

You don't just need a massive tank to be able to sustain or just to keep a dragonet because it doesn't always work. It usually comes from lazier reefers and I can understand where they are coming from, however, the concept of taking a hands-off approach with mandarins (as is to say, "good luck little fishy") is unethical.

With a smaller tank like yours, if you can get a mandarin that takes prepared foods would be better long term as you can more easily monitor and target feed it and even with a decent population of pods, the fish would be able to snack in between.

What is going to happen if a sudden event wipes out your inverts and you only have your fish left?

I am not saying it can't be done. I am not saying that but as I just said, I agree with the supplementary sustenance in between. But to leave it alone is based more off a hippie-like premise of "the reef will provide, man".

That being said, you would need to center your tank around your mandarin(s). Low-flow, target feeding (some who keep mandarins in smaller tanks feed a lot in one sitting so it can have constant access to food and adjust how much to give), and making sure it doesn't stress out.

I no longer have my dragonets due to a bacterial infection in one of my pair but I was able to get one to eat frozen brine. I was still training the other.

I have a friend who keeps them in a 20ish gallon tank and it looks like a sausage due to his constant monitoring.

See what works best for you of course. I just wanted to give a different perspective.

 

[Reef.]

The trails are more likely from snails as pods are so small I doubt you would see feeding trails…I would say no, your tank is far too small, they need to eat constantly, their stomach is tiny, feeding it large food is not going to work in the long run as it is too big for their stomach.

 

[Rugops]

The trails are more likely from snails as pods are so small I doubt you would see feeding trails…I would say no, your tank is far too small, they need to eat constantly, their stomach is tiny, feeding it large food is not going to work in the long run as it is too big for their stomach.

What would you consider large food?

 

[Rodan]

The trails are more likely from snails as pods are so small I doubt you would see feeding trails…I would say no, your tank is far too small, they need to eat constantly, their stomach is tiny, feeding it large food is not going to work in the long run as it is too big for their stomach.

no the trails are really tiny im 100% sure they are pods since Im able to see them eating the of the glass at night

 

[Propane]

You can but you need to find a reliable source for pods and be willing to continue feeding them. Also take into account that the mandarin won’t be the only fish enjoying them.

 

[Rodan]

You can but you need to find a reliable source for pods and be willing to continue feeding them. Also take into account that the mandarin won’t be the only fish enjoying them.

How often you think I would need to add pods? I'm assuming mine have been reproducing since around 8 months ago.

 

[Propane]

How often you think I would need to add pods? I'm assuming mine have been reproducing since around 8 months ago.

i don’t actually know to be honest. But since they constantly peck at the rocks and IF they only eat one pod a minute and only eat half the day that would be over a thousand a day.

 

[Uncle99]

Maybe consider a captive bred Mandy.
Then they eat frozen.
They are very small, grow slow and I think that would work in a 32.

 

[Propane]

I think @OrionN is into mandarins and he would probably have better info.

 

[Uncle99]

This spotted wild caught eats both pods and frozen.
Had her many years. Never added a pod once.
I find the spotted to be easier to keep.

 

[Rodan]

This spotted wild caught eats both pods and frozen.
Had her many years. Never added a pod once.
I find the spotted to be easier to keep.

yeah this is the one I want too very interesting it seems like everyone has different outcomes with them

 

[Propane]

This spotted wild caught eats both pods and frozen.
Had her many years. Never added a pod once.
I find the spotted to be easier to keep.

What is your tank size out of curiosity.

 

[Rodan]

What is your tank size out of curiosity.

32

 

[Propane]

32

sorry I meant to ask that of @Uncle99. I want a mandarin myself but after seeing my pod population get decimated by 2 mollies in a 25 lagoon that had an entire AIO chamber dedicated to their breeding grounds I didn’t think I should. At one point before the mollies I had so many pods my glass looked speckled 24/7.

 

[TheGrimReeferTx]

Also, I havent seen it pointed out but if you have a refugium this will help with the pod population a lot.

 

[fish farmer]

You don't just need a massive tank to be able to sustain or just to keep a dragonet because it doesn't always work. It usually comes from lazier reefers and I can understand where they are coming from, however, the concept of taking a hands-off approach with mandarins (as is to say, "good luck little fishy") is unethical.

With a smaller tank like yours, if you can get a mandarin that takes prepared foods would be better long term as you can more easily monitor and target feed it and even with a decent population of pods, the fish would be able to snack in between.

What is going to happen if a sudden event wipes out your inverts and you only have your fish left?

I am not saying it can't be done. I am not saying that but as I just said, I agree with the supplementary sustenance in between. But to leave it alone is based more off a hippie-like premise of "the reef will provide, man".

That being said, you would need to center your tank around your mandarin(s). Low-flow, target feeding (some who keep mandarins in smaller tanks feed a lot in one sitting so it can have constant access to food and adjust how much to give), and making sure it doesn't stress out.

I no longer have my dragonets due to a bacterial infection in one of my pair but I was able to get one to eat frozen brine. I was still training the other.

I have a friend who keeps them in a 20ish gallon tank and it looks like a sausage due to his constant monitoring.

See what works best for you of course. I just wanted to give a different perspective.

I agree with a lot of this. I would also like to add don't have tank mates that will compete with the mandarin.

I've had three mandarins throughout the years. One I had in a 38 gallon FO tank which had lots of fish and was fed heavily. I had seeded the tank with some local beach rock and got a good population of pods. It did very well and was fat for the year or so I had him, gave him back to the LFS.

The second attempt was with a tiny spotted one, light fish load in a 38 gallon reef, had a clown and a pygmy angel for a bit. I got the Mandy to chase and eat dead cladocerans. I was able to get her to eat frozen mysis. I had to target feed to get her to take prepared foods.

The third attempt was in my current 29 gallon with a pair of clowns. Tank raised spotted one, it did eat some prepared foods like mysis, but never really took off and died.

 

[Wallace11]

If you go with a captive bred (Biota) mandarin, which generally accept pellet foods, you shouldn't have a problem in a 30 gal tank. I have had my captive bred mandarin for 6 years now (was originally in a 90 gal, but for the last 3 years she has been in a 30 gal). She readily accepts pellets and frozen food. I do add pods every 2-3 months for a treat.

 

[Alexraptor]

Ah, the good old Mandarin debate. No matter how often it is rehashed, the age old "huge tank" myth just refuses to die.

A 32 Gallon is perfectly fine, and a single Mandarin can be kept in a system as small as 10 Gallons with proper planning and preparation.

People grossly underestimate the sheer quantity of microfauna that reef tanks are actually capable of generating and supporting. With the proper nutrient loads and adequate shelter we aren't talking about just a few thousand pods, we're talking hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of copepods, ostracods, worms and other assorted tiny invertebrates, all which make up parts of a Mandarin Dragonets diet. Though it is worth noting that these are NOT population densities you will find in a Ultra-Low Nutrient system.

That said, I do agree wholeheartedly with a hands-off approach to keeping Mandarins being unethical. Supportive feeding should always be a part of the strategy.

However, I will also recognize that my personal experiences are entirely based on systems set up with 100% live rock, and that it may not translate at all to systems set up with mostly, or entirely, dry rock. Obviously a 100% dry-dock tank is not going to have the same biodiversity, and will be entirely reliant on introduction and establishment of commercially available copepod cultures.