dkh question/story

[twentyleagues]

On my return to this hobby I remembered I had a tote of things that didnt get sold 14+ years ago. In this tote were 3 very old Hannah checkers with reagents (reagents went in the trash), a medical grade refractometer, and some other odds and ends oh a biopellet reactor from reef octo(does anyone even use biopellets anymore).
Hannah nitrate DOA battery leaked not save able.
Hannah alk seemed good to go with new battery and reagents.
Hannah po4 seems good havent messed with yet.
New refractometer calibration fluid good to go! maybe?
Cross checked sg with 2 lfs, off? purchased a new one from brs good to go? reads same as old one..... its fine.
Mixed up new salt (beginning of return) alk 10dkh rc salt ok good. Set up tank few corals checked weekly good a little use of alk. Weekly wc about 8g on a 30g tank. After wc back to 10/9.5 and held steady. Do wc on sunday check alk every sat at 8pm midday for tank. Some usage not much after wc back to near 10. This went on for months. About a month month and a half ago started getting weird readings on the checker tank went to 14dkh on one test checked my fresh sw bin gave a reading of 8. checked tank again 9 something checked bin again 10. Whats going on? maybe human error. Test again 12 on bin 8 on tank. Ok checker is probably bad or im messing it up. Put the tester away for the night put cuvettes in rodi like always. Held off on wc sunday until 8pm tested again weird inconsistent readings. Yes I wiped it down with the glass cleaning wipes, no finger prints. Alright checker is old probably bad. Changed water everything looks good still does. 2 weeks ago I went the cheep route bigbox had api test kits on sale buy1 get 50% off second, deal! I am not an api hater they have their uses I am cycling a new tank so other tests may be useful, had a new salifert ammonia test kit from 30g set up have a hard time reading this at under .5. The other day I decided to test alk on the 30g first time in a couple weeks, the new tank, and the bin, 30g was 8, new tank 7, bin 5. Test have been the same time and again. There is no precipitation in the bin. I am afraid to use it. New box of salt was used for new tank and to mix this bin. Mixed sg to 1.026 bin has heat and flow constantly. I know there is margin for error but 5? I ordered a new Hannah will be here on Wednesday. Thoughts?

 

[tbrown]

Mix the salt in the bucket/box before use. Sometimes elements can settle out and you can have inconsistent mixes as salt sits.

It's a possibility. I know my RC bucket does mix inconsistent with magnesium and alkalinity if I don't roll it around first.

 

[twentyleagues]

Mix the salt in the bucket/box before use. Sometimes elements can settle out and you can have inconsistent mixes as salt sits.

It's a possibility. I know my RC bucket does mix inconsistent with magnesium and alkalinity if I don't roll it around first.

I use the box with 4 bags. 1 bag gets me where I want to be. I do shake it around before I dump it in. Superstition or ocd maybe lol.

 

[twentyleagues]

Well this went nowhere fast.
Thanks for your post @tbrown

Ok so I dumped 40+ gallons of fresh saltwater down the drain. Must have gotten a bad box maybe just a bag or two in the box. The new hannah came in yesterday I tested and yup all low. But really close to api tests so api still usable. Broke into a new box and mixed up a new batch alk 9.2. Calc on what I dumped was 420ish new is 440ish (api test).

So heres the new questions
1) I tested my 30g reef not good I skipped last weeks wc because I didnt know for sure. Now I know. I did a 3g wc today on that. Figure I'll do some small wc 3ish gallons over the next week and test alk hope for best? Oh the alk was 5.2dkh btw. Corals look good 1 torch in between the other 2 not extended as far as normal. Looks like its splitting though.
2) New cycling tank 6.9 dkh not as bad no coral though. Still registering nitrite about 2.0ppm dont want to do wc and mess with cycle. Dose? Leave it be until cycle is complete do wc and be happy?

Lesson learned I dont care how long you have used your salt at least test each new batch with a known good test kit.

Sorry if my wordiness scares people off. Just want you to have the whole picture.

 

[tbrown]

You can raise alk a little at a time if you have some Sodium Bicarbonate (Baking Soda). Don't raise more than 1 dKh per day.

I use the BRS calculator. Remember it's based on water volume and not tank capacity. It's better to underestimate rather than overestimate just in case. 30 is probably 20-24 gallons max with rock and sand, new tank size?

Just as an example - my 125 with 40 gallon sump is 100 gallons of water almost exactly.

Alkalinity Supplement Calculator - Bulk Reef Supply

Bulk Reef Supply - Saltwater Aquarium Supplies for Reef Tanks

www.bulkreefsupply.com

 

[twentyleagues]

You can raise alk a little at a time if you have some Sodium Bicarbonate (Baking Soda). Don't raise more than 1 dKh per day.

I use the BRS calculator. Remember it's based on water volume and not tank capacity. It's better to underestimate rather than overestimate just in case. 30 is probably 20-24 gallons max with rock and sand, new tank size?

Just as an example - my 125 with 40 gallon sump is 100 gallons of water almost exactly.

Alkalinity Supplement Calculator - Bulk Reef Supply

Bulk Reef Supply - Saltwater Aquarium Supplies for Reef Tanks

www.bulkreefsupply.com

Tank is 82 gallons and sump is 75g I've measured the area water is in and it's roughly 117g subtract rock and sand so maybe 100ish. Currently rock and sand only in tank 40lbs sand and the rock not really sure weight on rock maybe 40-60lbs.

 

[tbrown]

Sounds about right then. I have 60 pounds of sand and about 100 - 120 pounds of rock, 165 total tank volume (maybe 175 as I've been told my tank is probably a 135, not 15?). Sump is only half full so probably close to 150 total volume with 50-60 gallons of displacement from rock and sand.

 

[twentyleagues]

Sounds about right then. I have 60 pounds of sand and about 100 - 120 pounds of rock, 165 total tank volume (maybe 175 as I've been told my tank is probably a 135, not 15?). Sump is only half full so probably close to 150 total volume with 50-60 gallons of displacement from rock and sand.

So you think dosing would be best? At least on the larger tank?
Do you think small water changes on the 30g will be ok or do you think dosing there too?

 

[tbrown]

So you think dosing would be best? At least on the larger tank?
Do you think small water changes on the 30g will be ok or do you think dosing there too?

Up to you. When you do a water change you still want to bring it up no more than. 1 dKh daily. Small water changes can accomplish this but Baking Soda is cheaper than salt. If you want to bring it up in between water changes, Baking Soda can accomplish that.

I rarely do water changes and just dose alk, calcium, and magnesium as needed. I also have to dose phosphates and trace minerals to keep my levels good where water changes would accomplish the same thing.

 

[twentyleagues]

Up to you. When you do a water change you still want to bring it up no more than. 1 dKh daily. Small water changes can accomplish this but Baking Soda is cheaper than salt. If you want to bring it up in between water changes, Baking Soda can accomplish that.

I rarely do water changes and just dose alk, calcium, and magnesium as needed. I also have to dose phosphates and trace minerals to keep my levels good where water changes would accomplish the same thing.

yeah you are correct. I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around the math for the water change numbers anyway. I still need to do water change on the 30g because I didnt do 1 on sunday. Worried about doing all 8or 9 gallons all at once though. I am pretty sure 3 gallons at 9.2 is still less then 1dkh per day. Ill know for sure in a few minutes as i was just about to test alk to check my math.

 

[tbrown]

Sounds good. Glad to hear you're getting it figured out.

 

[tbrown]

Keep asking questions too. I'm not sure why no one else chimed in here but there's lots of knowledge on Reef2Reef.

 

[twentyleagues]

So I was correct on my first try a mathing...lol. It took the alk up .3dkh. Dont know if I was correct at figuring it out or happy accident. I just divided the 9.2dkh by how many gallons 30 in this case came up with .301. I just figured that was to easy of an answer. Probably isnt right but it worked. I'd have to do 12 wc to get it to 9.2. I can do a 5g change sunday and be back on schedule. Time to get some soda ash possibly a magnesium test kit too. No idea what thats at if alk was messed up in that box. Calc was acceptable 420 lower then previous tests but not horrible.

 

[tbrown]

It's been a while since I've mathed like this. Let me think for a minute...

 

[tbrown]

Ok, had to look it up to make sure I wasn't crazy.

Current dKh * (total gallons of water - water change gallons) + water change dKh * water change gallons

Divide that total by the total gallons of water.

(5.2 * (30 - 5) + 9.2 * 5) / 30 = 176 / 30 = 5.8 assuming 30 gallons of actual water volume.

 

[twentyleagues]

Ok, had to look it up to make sure I wasn't crazy.

Current dKh * (total gallons of water - water change gallons) + water change dKh * water change gallons

Divide that total by the total gallons of water.

(5.2 * (30 - 5) + 9.2 * 5) / 30 = 176 / 30 = 5.8 assuming 30 gallons of actual water volume.

Wow omg that takes me back. Like I said my way probably was to easy and not correct but it worked. I used to drive my math teachers crazy. I'd have the right answer but didnt show my work and when I did they'd say thats not right. But the answer was so I dunno.
Thanks for the help! I really appreciate it. At least one person was willing to take the time.

 

[tbrown]

No problem. Glad I could be of some assistance.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I'm not sure why no one else chimed in here but there's lots of knowledge on Reef2Reef.

Thank you for helping the OP.

I can explain partly why, and it is worth knowing for the future. The OP did not follow my posted guidelines for how to post questions in this forum. He literally described it as a story, which was a large block of unparagraphed text, rather than something one can quickly look at determine if one has the knowledge to help,

It may sound harsh, but many of us have way more threads asking for help than we can get to, and if we cannot easily tell what the issue is in a couple of minutes, we may move along to other threads to maximize our ability to help in our limited time available.

Tips on how to ask questions!

Here are some tips on how to ask questions at Reef2Reef most effectively. :) 1. Put the question, or at least the detailed topic in the thread title. Most people do this already, but it's the top way to attract the right kind of people to answer your question. Bad examples: Quick Question...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[twentyleagues]

Thank you for helping the OP.

I can explain partly why, and it is worth knowing for the future. The OP did not follow my posted guidelines for how to post questions in this forum. He literally described it as a story, which was a large block of unparagraphed text, rather than something one can quickly look at determine if one has the knowledge to help,

It may sound harsh, but many of us have way more threads asking for help than we can get to, and if we cannot easily tell what the issue is in a couple of minutes, we may move along to other threads to maximize our ability to help in our limited time available.

Tips on how to ask questions!

Here are some tips on how to ask questions at Reef2Reef most effectively. :) 1. Put the question, or at least the detailed topic in the thread title. Most people do this already, but it's the top way to attract the right kind of people to answer your question. Bad examples: Quick Question...

www.reef2reef.com

I get that and stated it. I have also seen people not give enough info and they have to get asked 15 times You did what? when? how? I wasn't directly asking you. I value your input and things you've done in this hobby. TBH this question is below your pay grade anyway. If I thought it needed your attention id have @ you and followed your rules. In no way is my reply negative or angry. I reread it a few times its hard to tell. I was surprised that only tbrown replied though.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I get that and stated it. I have also seen people not give enough info and they have to get asked 15 times You did what? when? how? I wasn't directly asking you. I value your input and things you've done in this hobby. TBH this question is below your pay grade anyway. If I thought it needed your attention id have @ you and followed your rules. In no way is my reply negative or angry. I reread it a few times its hard to tell. I was surprised that only tbrown replied though.

Yes, I understand. Since I am responsible for this specific forum, I was just explaining why I hadn't answered it yet. I know I came to it several times, started to read it, and then skipped away to something else. It would not surprise me if some others did the same, but I cannot know that.

In any case, is it resolved know or is there more to discuss?