Dosing KNO3 and KPO4

[iiluisii]

So keeping nutrients at the right ratio also helps out combating unwanted algae and also would help sps with coloration and growth especially a tank with large colonies

 

[Griff]

I'm having a nitrate limiting issue. Phosphates spiked at .1 came down to .06 and now at .03.

My Sps are bleaching some and losing color.

Should I dose NO4 in some way?
Nitrates at 0 currently with redsea test kit

 

[iiluisii]

I'm having a nitrate limiting issue. Phosphates spiked at .1 came down to .06 and now at .03.

My Sps are bleaching some and losing color.

Should I dose NO4 in some way?
Nitrates at 0 currently with redsea test kit

I would say in your case you would have to dose nitrates

 

[dragon99]

@Randy Holmes-Farley What about Tricalcium Phosphate? Would that work to raise PO4 with some bonus Ca?

Edit: Found my own answer, not soluble.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

So keeping nutrients at the right ratio also helps out combating unwanted algae and also would help sps with coloration and growth especially a tank with large colonies

I do not agree with that statement. I do not believe the ratio is the key, just the levels.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I'm having a nitrate limiting issue. Phosphates spiked at .1 came down to .06 and now at .03.

My Sps are bleaching some and losing color.

Should I dose NO4 in some way?
Nitrates at 0 currently with redsea test kit

Do you use a phosphate export method that requires both? Some do not (GFO and other binders, for example).

 

[Griff]

Do you use a phosphate export method that requires both? Some do not (GFO and other binders, for example).

I use a skimmer carbon and fuge with a ball of cheato the size of a baseball. The cheato is turning white in places too.

I've turned off my skimmer for a couple days to try and get the nitrates up some. I set the carbon reactor so the flow is as slow as possible without being off.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I use a skimmer carbon and fuge with a ball of cheato the size of a baseball. The cheato is turning white in places too.

I've turned off my skimmer for a couple days to try and get the nitrates up some. I set the carbon reactor so the flow is as slow as possible without being off.

Turning off the skimmer would be, IMO, counterproductive if the goal is reducing phosphate. The chaeto might benefit from nitrate, or maybe iron, lighting changes, etc. Experimenting with nitrate dosing is a fine plan.

 

[Wesus]

I use a skimmer carbon and fuge with a ball of cheato the size of a baseball. The cheato is turning white in places too.

I've turned off my skimmer for a couple days to try and get the nitrates up some. I set the carbon reactor so the flow is as slow as possible without being off.

From my experience cheato doesn't turn white even with nitrates 0 and PO4 0. Iron deficiency was always the problem

 

[iiluisii]

So I already determined that my tank consumes .25 nitrates per day

But phosphates a different story
So the first time I dosed 1.75 ml and I got a reading of 1 phosphorous so I added 5.25ml and it went up to 5 phosphorous by the evening it went back down to 0 so then I added 5.25 again and last night i tested 51 phosphorous and by this morning it was back down to 8 phosphorous which is .02 phosphates so something is consuming phosphates at an extremely fast rate

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

So I already determined that my tank consumes .25 nitrates per day

But phosphates a different story
So the first time I dosed 1.75 ml and I got a reading of 1 phosphorous so I added 5.25ml and it went up to 5 phosphorous by the evening it went back down to 0 so then I added 5.25 again and last night i tested 51 phosphorous and by this morning it was back down to 8 phosphorous which is .02 phosphates so something is consuming phosphates at an extremely fast rate

Those 51, 8, etc. numbers are what? ppb phosphorus?

Consuming 0.02 ppm phosphate daily is not high, IMO. You likely add more than that in foods every day and it too gets consumed. You are just boosting the daily phosphate added to the water by a fraction. How big a fraction depends on how much you feed, but maybe 10-50% increase. I discuss phosphate additions via foods here:

Phosphate And Math: Yes You Need To Understand Both
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2012/3/chemistry

 

[iiluisii]

Those 51, 8, etc. numbers are what? ppb phosphorus?

Consuming 0.02 ppm phosphate daily is not high, IMO. You likely add more than that in foods every day and it too gets consumed. You are just boosting the daily phosphate added to the water by a fraction. How big a fraction depends on how much you feed, but maybe 10-50% increase. I discuss phosphate additions via foods here:

Phosphate And Math: Yes You Need To Understand Both
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2012/3/chemistry

The tank consumed 0.14 phosphates over night. And yes those are ppb numbers.

 

[iiluisii]

.14 phosphates consumption is a lot Randy.

 

[iiluisii]

The tank was at 51 ppb which is .16 phosphates and this morning the tank is at 8 ppb which is .02

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

.14 phosphates consumption is a lot Randy.

And what basis do you have for thinking that is high as opposed to normal for a first phosphate boost?

Higher phosphate will increase lots of processes that do not happen at lower levels, including biologic uptake (by organisms that may be phosphate limited before dosing) and binding to calcium carbonate surfaces.

 

[iiluisii]

And what basis do you have for thinking that is high as opposed to normal for a first phosphate boost?

Higher phospathe will increase lots of processes that do not happen at lower levels, including biologic uptake (by organisms that may be phosphate limited before dosing) and binding to calcium carbonate surfaces.

So you are agreeing with me about keeping at around .07 with above statement ?

Also that's not my first phosphate boost that's my 3rd one

I really think is the acros sucking it up.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I think 0.07 ppm phosphate is higher than I'd typically target, but if the tank appears optimal at this level, then by all means use it.

 

[mcarroll]

I do not agree with that statement. I do not believe the ratio is the key, just the levels.

Indeed!

The idea is balance folks – to keep any nutrient from becoming problematic.

So I already determined that my tank consumes .25 nitrates per day

But phosphates a different story

It's not a linear consumption, for one thing....when you spike nutrients (or any parameter, potentially) you're going to cause a shock to the microbial food web. That could be a spike in growth or crash. This is where algae blooms come from....and is the systems way of trying to re-balance.

Nitrate consumption is likely to be higher at a slightly elevated phosphate level, for example.

I haven't followed it up yet, but I read somewhere that "bacterial are high in phosphorus – even in phosphate-scarce situations."

So it seems sensible that you would get a big draw-down on phosphates if you successfully generated a bacterial bloom.

 

[mcarroll]

Randy already said as much, but Redfield is the ratio these nutrients are found within living bodies....not their environments. It's important, but not exactly in the way it's being thought of.

 

[iiluisii]

So just tested and got a reading of 0 phosphorous. Keep in mind that the levels were 52 last night which is .16 phosphates and by morning it was .02 phosphates so something is rapidly consuming the phosphates. On another note most of my pale acros are getting coloration on the tips so I guess I'm heading in the right direction