Experience Doesn't = Facts

[Liquid360]

I keep butting heads with people who have had certain experiences and based upon those experiences they draw conclusions they then believe to be facts. Specifically they claim carpets will always consume your fish. Clown fish can't be kept more than two in a tank. They immediately discount my own experience. I'm ALWAYS careful to say "in my experience" and "others have had very different experiences". Yet they continue to fight claiming opinions to be facts. I'm not sure why but it angers me greatly. People who believe their own experience dictates facts... it's ego in all its glory. The arrogance involved in claiming your way is the best way is just irritating in the extreme. In this hobby there a million paths to the same place. Let others find their way and share our experiences but don't go around spouting opinions disguised as facts.

 

[cymaster007]

Ive talked to a few people who "know it all" and visited them later on only to find out their livestock & tanks look to be in terrible condition.
They usually have a multitude of excuses as to why they are not having any success. Usually after that I take all advice they give with a grain of salt

 

[Eienna]

A modicum of success (short-term, at least) seems enough to convince some people that they're doing it right.

 

[Mhsbrian]

This hobby is plagued with people who thrive of anecdotal information and pressure it onto other people.

 

[Liquid360]

It's even those who've had long term success and learned their own lessons. Fellow members with good knowledge and info to share. However others have had experiences of their own which may have taught them differently. This draws a battle of credentials trying to convince me they know better and they claim facts. My experiences have shown me different things but I NEVER claim them as facts and I NEVER discount another's experiences.

 

[Aquaph8]

You butt heads with people cause your always trying to stir the pot, take peoples posts as advice and quit trying to argue all the time.

 

[Liquid360]

Not at all. I'm a fan of stirring the pot but here I'm speaking of something else.

 

[McAllyn]

How is this different than every other thing in our world today? Religion, politics, hobbies, sports, vehicles (ever recommend a Ford to a Chevy guy???) Some people are adamant in their ideas and will argue till their death trying to convince others that they have it right, regardless of the validity of their argument. Maybe I'm not "cutting edge" enough, maybe I'm apathetic, but basically, I don't have time to argue with anyone over any thing, in this hobby or otherwise. I know what I know, and I'm comfortable with that. If you know something different, don't tell me I'm wrong, and I won't tell you you're wrong. Do what you want and leave me to my ideas.

 

[Liquid360]

That's good advice though!! Seriously. Thanks.

 

[Liquid360]

Again good advice! See this is why I post here.

How is this different than every other thing in our world today? Religion, politics, hobbies, sports, vehicles (ever recommend a Ford to a Chevy guy???) Some people are adamant in their ideas and will argue till their death trying to convince others that they have it right, regardless of the validity of their argument. Maybe I'm not "cutting edge" enough, maybe I'm apathetic, but basically, I don't have time to argue with anyone over any thing, in this hobby or otherwise. I know what I know, and I'm comfortable with that. If you know something different, don't tell me I'm wrong, and I won't tell you you're wrong. Do what you want and leave me to my ideas.

 

[mi_chael3]

In my experience almost everything in the saltwater hobby is just an opinion. After all we are dealing with wild animals which don't always fit into their species supposed cookie cutter mold.

 

[Mike J.]

Just had to read this to see what you were up to now. I like McAllyn's post. Reef tanks are no different than religion or politics; and if discussing either upsets you or makes you combative you need to steer clear of it. I can talk reef tanks with friends from our reef club and we don't get into it. He does it that way and I do it this way. I'll listen to his way, but it doesn't necessarily mean I'm going to do it. Then again, maybe I will change a few things. Just advice.

 

[Liquid360]

Lol thanks mike! I really do appreciate the advice. Of course ill still get into trouble... My religion requires it. All hail Banzar, the twelve eyed goat!
but I understand what you're saying. I let things bug me way too much.

Just had to read this to see what you were up to now. I like McAllyn's post. Reef tanks are no different than religion or politics; and if discussing either upsets you or makes you combative you need to steer clear of it. I can talk reef tanks with friends from our reef club and we don't get into it. He does it that way and I do it this way. I'll listen to his way, but it doesn't necessarily mean I'm going to do it. Then again, maybe I will change a few things. Just advice.

 

[Eienna]

The way I see it, someone's gotta speak up. The fish sure can't. You just can't take things too personally.

 

[Zero Nitrates]

There are so many different ways to set up and keep a tank that it is impossible to state experience equals fact. I really do appreciate all of the people like yourselves who share their experiences.

 

[glb]

I keep butting heads with people who have had certain experiences and based upon those experiences they draw conclusions they then believe to be facts. Specifically they claim carpets will always consume your fish. Clown fish can't be kept more than two in a tank. They immediately discount my own experience. I'm ALWAYS careful to say "in my experience" and "others have had very different experiences". Yet they continue to fight claiming opinions to be facts. I'm not sure why but it angers me greatly. People who believe their own experience dictates facts... it's ego in all its glory. The arrogance involved in claiming your way is the best way is just irritating in the extreme. In this hobby there a million paths to the same place. Let others find their way and share our experiences but don't go around spouting opinions disguised as facts.

I agree that you always say 'based on my opinion' or 'in my experience'. I also agree that some people come across as 'I'm right and you're wrong' in response to your posts. That being said, I wouldn't get into it with them. It's not worth the rise in blood pressure.

 

[GHill762]

I think I've butted heads with you a couple times liquid :p

Remember it's just a forum and people are here to learn.. Sometimes disagreement can be good, different points of view are a good thing, but all too often it end up in ******* matches..

There's always more than one way of doing things, those willing to experiment and try new things shouldn't be shot down by those who "know everything"..

 

[pickupman66]

My beef??? KIDS who have kept a tank for a year, maybe less, spouting that they know everything and even posting "articles" that they try to write about a subject, then dont listen to a seasoned vet when their advice and experiences are offered. Fortunately, I have pretty much put these folks on the IGNORE list. Ive been dabbling in this hobby for 15-18 years. I've seen alot come and go. My first REEF was a 29 gallon tank in college lit by NO flourescent bulbs. I had a bubble wand in the back and live rock. thats it. kept seahorses and a few corals. meagerly. NOW, there are many who have been doing it longer. Listen to those folks. Learn from them.

remember, there is ALWAYS more than 1 way to skin a cat.

 

[Mhsbrian]

I simply don't debate people if I know what I do works for me.

 

[glb]

My beef??? KIDS who have kept a tank for a year, maybe less, spouting that they know everything and even posting "articles" that they try to write about a subject, then dont listen to a seasoned vet when their advice and experiences are offered. Fortunately, I have pretty much put these folks on the IGNORE list. Ive been dabbling in this hobby for 15-18 years. I've seen alot come and go. My first REEF was a 29 gallon tank in college lit by NO flourescent bulbs. I had a bubble wand in the back and live rock. thats it. kept seahorses and a few corals. meagerly. NOW, there are many who have been doing it longer. Listen to those folks. Learn from them.

remember, there is ALWAYS more than 1 way to skin a cat.

Fair enough, but I think it's condescending to call new aquarists 'kids'. Yes some new to the hobby are know-it-alls who don't know anything, but everyone was a beginner at some point. Just saying.