Hanna a reagents are horrible

[Scdell]

. This isn’t something that you can expect to be scientifically precise, it’s a $50 tester and the reagents are some mere $7. It will vary batch to batch if you like it or not. I think we can all agree that things, in not ideal conditions, don’t last as long as they should. If you expect a precise tester with lab grade results, buy a trident or an all Alkatronic.

Then why are you so adamant about throwing user error out there? Along with a lot of other people?

 

[Scdell]

Why does everything turn into an argument about who's right and who's wrong? Just like Facebook. This is supposed to be a discussion group. Not an attack group. There's apparently people that are running into problems and people that aren't. That doesn't mean either concern is not valid.
All I ran into in the beginning of this thread was "user error". This one says test this way, another says test this way. And on and on.Maybe Hanna had a bad batch because of Covid? I don't know. It's just been the last six months or so. Otherwise its been fine. I'm not the only one seeing this.

 

[Thespammailaccount]

Here's the deal. As I use the test kit and the reagent gets older my alk climbs. I test at least three times a week.
This am I tested and got a 9.0 result. I opened a new reagent and re tested. 7.6. That's a huge difference!!!!
If I need a tester to check my tester, then what good is having it????

Same thing happened to me. When the bottle was running out it was reading alk much higher than normal which I thought was odd since I dose the same amount daily. Got a new bottle and right on point to where my alk normally is. I read somewhere that this happens when the bottle runs low and should be tossed

 

[KrisReef]

Stop gaslighting people and actually read the posts.

The bottle of reagent I just threw out:

Was open less than 20 days, and was kept sealed, and foil wrapper was removed properly.
Had an Expiration Date of 01/2022.
Batch 8966
Drifted from testing 8.3 to 6.9 over the course of those 20 days, despite tank being a solid 8.0.

The current bottle, which I opened yesterday:
Batch 8876
Exp Date: 11/2021
Currently reading a predictable .3 dkH high, at 8.3.

The previous bottle to 8966, I did not record the batch number, but it was not expired - and it again read 8.3, and drifted down to about 7 dkH by the end of the bottle. It also was only open about 2 and a half weeks.


I'm testing multiple tanks pretty much daily, and going through a lot of reagent here - and this effect is both predictable and consistent, across batches.

This is very interesting. You are getting repeatable results, with similar drifts across the different bottles. Something is going wrong, but you seem to be consistent.

I use the Hanna dKh meter but I do not experience what you have. If I didn't like my meter I'd offer to trade to see how our experiences would change, or not with different meters in different hands?

 

[45ZoaGarden]

I said it’s margin of error for the tester, bad reagents, or user error. And no, I’m trying to be as polite as possible. As soon as I decided to be nice and say what I’ve experienced, I was berated by both you and the other gentleman. Instead of admitting that it could possibly have been user error, you both went on the offensive and condescended me. Please don’t act like everyone else is being awful and not listening because we are.

Then why are you so adamant about throwing user error out there? Along with a lot of other people?

 

[Scdell]

Same thing happened to me. When the bottle was running out it was reading alk much higher than normal which I thought was odd since I dose the same amount daily. Got a new bottle and right on point to where my alk normally is. I read somewhere that this happens when the bottle runs low and should be tossed

This I learned through this thread. I test for phosphate at the same time I test Alk. 25 Tests in the phosphate kit. I throw the rest of the Alk reagent away now.

 

[45ZoaGarden]

Same thing happened to me. When the bottle was running out it was reading alk much higher than normal which I thought was odd since I dose the same amount daily. Got a new bottle and right on point to where my alk normally is. I read somewhere that this happens when the bottle runs low and should be tossed

This is very interesting. You are getting repeatable results, with similar drifts across the different bottles. Something is going wrong, but you seem to be consistent.

I use the Hanna dKh meter but I do not experience what you have. If I didn't like my meter I'd offer to trade to see how our experiences would change, or not with different meters in different hands?

What is interesting is some are experiencing higher results with low levels and other are experiencing lower results. I think it has something to do with the concentration of the reagent possibly due to evaporation or chemical separation.

 

[45ZoaGarden]

Just curious, do you shake the bottle before use?

 

[KrisReef]

I keep my bottle in my pantry away from the tank. When I open it I remove all the foil (otherwise I'd knock the whole thing off the counter trying to get a syringe fill. I close the bottle shortly after pulling a 1ml tube sample, and the reagent goes back in it's box and into the cupboard. It's kind of a pain in the procedure, but I'm actively trying to reduce error that I might introduce.

I sometimes do back to back tests (to check resultant numbers) and when I am done I rinse syringe and bottles in ro, and then rodi water. I take the little syringe tube off the syringe afterward so it will dry out between tests. I store the Hanna bottles with RODI in them, full, no bubbles. I forget who on here mentioned that was a good method to keep the vials clean? (Thanks again to whomever, )

When my tank is dialed in I get similar/ the same numbers each day for dKh & ULR phosphate. OR- When I'm changing media in the calk or GFO reactor, or as stuff grows, and when I overfeed, I use these meters to keep me aware of the direction the numbers are going.
Are they spot on? Ask The Lord, He knows, I don't.

I do need to send off an ICP to get a second opinion. I use Salifert to check my Hanna every now and again, and the results between the two methods compare well.

Hint: I use my phone to take a picture of my meters when I test so I can look at past pictures to see if I am drifting and what direction.

Too lazy to write it down, too sloppy to read my own writing.

 

[KrisReef]

Oh, and no shaking.
I have never heard I was supposed to shake the dKh reagent bottle? Now I have to go read the instructions to see if that's a thing I'm missing. I would be afraid to shake it, I'm kinda clumsy. I would also think that could increase degradation, but if the reagent is settling shaking is probably called for. Oh, the mystery.

 

[Scdell]

I started shaking the bottle. It helps with the stringy things. I shake it real good before I even open it. Then I shake it a little after each test.

 

[KrisReef]

I started shaking the bottle. It helps with the stringy things. I shake it real good before I even open it. Then I shake it a little after each test.

I do not believe that this reagent is supposed to contain "stringy things." I read that a while back and forgot about that issue. I think you need a new bottle without strings?

I just went and watched this video that shows how HANNA things this should be done.

Note: I am too cheap to use a microfiber cloth and substitute Costco Paper Towels instead of tiny pieces of cloth that gather smudge and slimy things based upon my eyeglasses experience with microfiber. The video does not shake!

I can measure dKh in under two minutes. I do use a 10ml syringe to pull my sample. I wipe empty the vial of RODI water, (that I shake to throw water drops out!) same as the cap. Then I empty 10 mls from a syringe (so I don't have to try and read a miniskirt thing- I have eyeglasses and can't see a minicuss either).
His tube on the end of reagent syringe looks dirty, and he didn't remove the plastic (foil) like I do. I can't see to get a syringe in a torn hole so I remove the plastic and don't shake. If I shake I will knock over the reagent vial.

Once that is done, I wipe with a paper towel, align the sample ml mark to edge reader to get the same alignment each time (to reduce error from glass imperfections).
Push the buttons, once empty, once sample present, and then remove and add reagent (without strings) to the vial, realign load and press the button.

I do most of these last steps with a paper towel in my hand to hold the bottle as it goes in and out. The video, this guy is wiping, and greasy fingering, and then wiping again. SMH!
If my mother saw this guy at the table she would have taught him some manners and how to use a napkin and keep his grimy fingers off the vial, and the wall, and to put the seat down,..RIP Mom.

All those steps have to be clean, but if your reagent is stringy use the taste test for dKh it will probably be a lot more accurate than trying to coax a good reading out of these finicky testers that don't like fingerprints or improperly cleaned vials or haphazardly filled samples & reagents. Any deviation will show up on the number board at the end of the journey.

It took me a long time to believe that these meters could work. My mom could have made a lot of improvements in their video.

 

[Markxc]

not sure if it was mentioned already, but i remember reading about this a while back and people were having an issue when they stored the bottle on its side (i.e. in the hanna checker case). i think the guess was that the reagent was reacting to that plastic thing on the top of the cap but dont think this was proven.

 

[scardall]

Here's the deal. As I use the test kit and the reagent gets older my alk climbs. I test at least three times a week.
This am I tested and got a 9.0 result. I opened a new reagent and re tested. 7.6. That's a huge difference!!!!
If I need a tester to check my tester, then what good is having it????

I use hanna alk. dkh model with accurate results. Reagent is liquid not dry. It is possible for alk. to drop as much as 1.4dkh in 24 hours. Also check your expiration date on your reagents. Good luck

 

[Joe31415]

I just went and watched this video that shows how HANNA things this should be done.

I know this is an old thread, but does it bug anyone else that these syringes are labeled backwards/upside down? Is that a lab syringe thing? I've never seen a medical syringe with 1ml at the bottom and as you draw the plunger up, the numbers count down. I know that caused me to use the wrong amount the first few times since I was drawing the plunger back to the 0.1 line instead of the, for some odd reason, unlabeled 0.0 line.

The only reason I can see for a syringe to be labeled this way is you want to draw once and dose multiple times. ie draw up 1ml of fluid and dose .2ml into each of a 5 vials. But that's not the way any of the Hanna checkers I've seen work. Why not just send a standard (WRT markings on the side) syringe? A quick glance on google suggests accidentally using .9ml instead of 1ml is a pretty common occurance until people, myself included, realize they're doing it wrong.

 

[robbyg]

I know this is an old thread, but does it bug anyone else that these syringes are labeled backwards/upside down? Is that a lab syringe thing? I've never seen a medical syringe with 1ml at the bottom and as you draw the plunger up, the numbers count down. I know that caused me to use the wrong amount the first few times since I was drawing the plunger back to the 0.1 line instead of the, for some odd reason, unlabeled 0.0 line.

The only reason I can see for a syringe to be labeled this way is you want to draw once and dose multiple times. ie draw up 1ml of fluid and dose .2ml into each of a 5 vials. But that's not the way any of the Hanna checkers I've seen work. Why not just send a standard (WRT markings on the side) syringe? A quick glance on google suggests accidentally using .9ml instead of 1ml is a pretty common occurance until people, myself included, realize they're doing it wrong.

If you are doing tests with multiple kits on a regular basis you can save yourself a lot of headaches and time by just getting a proper pippete. It's not cheap but after you use it you will never go back to regular syringes.

Here is one on Amazon but I would not get this brand due to the head fitting issues. I don't see the one I bought listed anymore but it is a 1ml-10ml model similar in appearance to this but cost maybe $10 more.



I use the same pippete and bought 5 heads so that I can use it across all my test kits without any fear of reagent cross contamination.
One head is reserved for drawing sample water.

 

[Joe31415]

I actually have that same one, but the 1-5ml version. Both their accuracy and precision leave something to be desired, but for $40 I can't complain. Since I'm still cycling and I'm more concerned about trends than actual numbers, it works. And, yes, it's a whole lot faster than using the little bulb syringe API gives you.

I got the idea because one of the Hanna testers comes with a little tiny one and it seemed convenient so I picked up this one to fill the 5ml API vials and 10ml Hanna vials. However, I've only been using it for tank water. I use the included syringe/tip for the Hanna reagents and I have a bunch of 1000ml squeeze bottles (like these) that I keep full of RODI water for rinsing everything and filling any vials that need RODI.

 

[jimk60]

Totally dissatisfied with the reagent again. I opened up a new bottle of alk reagent which arrived this week. First test performed and I get a syringe full of the floating crud. This is an on going problem for way too long. The results were considerably lower than the last bottle but I expect that now.

 

[Scdell]

Totally dissatisfied with the reagent again. I opened up a new bottle of alk reagent which arrived this week. First test performed and I get a syringe full of the floating crud. This is an on going problem for way too long. The results were considerably lower than the last bottle but I expect that now.

I got a new bottle last week. It seems to mix a little slower when adding it to the vial. Maybe they've addressed the issue???.It seems to be reading better. Still a good 7 DKH higher than Salifert though. At this point it trust the Salifert more than the Hanna.

 

[jimk60]

I'm more concerned with the floating crud. I jump through all the hoops with the microfiber cloth and the same orientation of the sample but what's the use if the reagent is contaminated?