I think I got it!....wait no I don’t...

[Deiblerj]

so after many posts and hours of aimless research on the internet ive finally discovered, to the best of my knowledge, I have an imbalance in my tank.

New to the hobby I was naive about proper parameters and only knew that ammonia, nitrates, and phosphates should be low. Sounds easy...Lets roll baby! Little did I know that when people said low they didn’t mean 0 ppm. Ha! Jokes on me for trying to have a perfectly clean tank.

After a few Dino outbreaks and countless attempts to correct my system (hand scrubbed every rock in that sucker) I’ve come to the realization that I am my own culprit. So now I must, as much as it pains me, make my tank “dirty”.;NailbitingNOOOOO!!

I shut off my skimmer temporarily and removed the carbon/GFO bag - both of which my LFS insisted I have (gee, thanks man - not helping the issues).

I was also swindled into buying an autodoser and aquaforest component 123. Stillllll collecting dust next to tank until I get my other parameters in check.

Back to my research! “Feed more, turn off skimmer, dose this, dose that, don’t do that, do this!” Holy crap!! There are a lot of different opinions out there (ironically I say that as I type this up in an online forum, DOH!)

However, my back is against the wall and I’m running out of steam (my girlfriend is also losing patients quickly with me and this sometimes god forsaken hobby I got myself into).

So my fellow reefmates, aquarist, friends-of-the-fish, coral collaborators, and sandsifting scholars, please help me!!!!!!!

I’m very hesitant on starting AF 123 until I get my nitrates and phosphates in check, however, I’m not sure what the best approach to do that is. I feel like feeding more or turning off my skimmer is like putting a band aide over a Kill Bill victims minor flesh wound...it’s not going to do much in the long run.

I only have a 40breeder with 2 clowns, YWG, green clown goby, critron goby, and a royal gramma, I have a few inverts, RBTA, and some zoas that are barley hanging on.

I run a HOB fuval 70 along with a skimz HOB skimmer. Have 2 Kessil A360s, MP40 across front, hydor 850gph on back and 250gph back to front.

I feed a frozen cube a day pretty much (brine shrimp or marine cuisine <love that name!) occasionally I’ll throw some pellets or flakes on but the fish don’t seem to enjoy those as much. Since I feed daily my tank looks like a freaking snow globe of fish poop when I turn the blowers on high! This requires more water changes which I don’t think is helping either (both the tank and my stomach - price you pay for cutting your siphon hose to short!)

I feel like I shouldn’t have to dose nitrates since my tank is smaller, but that could just be my lack of knowledge and unwillingness to purchase more equipment/supplies at the moment.

How does one walk the proverbial nitrate/phosphate line? What’s the best ratio to manage? Am I missing something or doing something wrong??

Eventually I want to upgrade to a bigger tank with a sump but I’m pretty sure my girlfriend will literally smash the tank overnight my head since I can’t even get my 40b under control!

For the love of the reef and my personal safety (kidding obvisouly), give your boy some pointers!

....dang, I should have paid more attention in science class!

 

[Geebs19]

In this hobby keeping it stupid simple is the best approach I believe. Can you provide us with your tank params as of now? Sounds to me like the LFS had you chasing numbers instead of just letting the tank do its thing and ride out.

I just recently saw this link and I highly recommend the read.

https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/tank-parameters-of-some-masters.263/

 

[ihavecrabs]

So where are your NO3 and PO4 readings now and what test kits are you using?

Once we know where you are starting from, it'll be easier to help you get to where you want to be

 

[Deiblerj]

So as of two nights ago (I’ll check again tonight when I get home) and prior to me turning off my skimmer, I was at:

Ammonia: 0 ppm
Nitrates: 0 ppm
Phosphates: 0 ppm
PH: 7.8ish

Using your good ‘ol standard API test kit. Probably not the best or most accurate ;Dead

 

[IslandLifeReef]

I agree with @Geebs19, keep it simple and take it slow. For now, I would just feed your fish normally. One cube per day for six fish seems like a little to much. Turn your skimmer back on. Find a good schedule for your lights. Then, wait......your tank will settle down. Don't chase numbers and don't change too many things at once. It makes it hard to figure out what worked when you change five different things at once.

 

[Deiblerj]

In this hobby keeping it stupid simple is the best approach I believe. Can you provide us with your tank params as of now? Sounds to me like the LFS had you chasing numbers instead of just letting the tank do its thing and ride out.

I just recently saw this link and I highly recommend the read.

https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/tank-parameters-of-some-masters.263/

This will most certainly be read this evening

 

[Deiblerj]

I agree with @Geebs19, keep it simple and take it slow. For now, I would just feed your fish normally. One cube per day for six fish seems like a little to much. Turn your skimmer back on. Find a good schedule for your lights. Then, wait......your tank will settle down. Don't chase numbers and don't change too many things at once. It makes it hard to figure out what worked when you change five different things at once.

Lights are on a timer so those have been pretty consistent. I’ll turn the skimmer back on. And keep an eye on parameters.

 

[Deiblerj]

Should I resist the temptations of doing a water change through this painful waiting process? I’ve been trying to clean the Dino’s off the glass in hopes they get sucked into the filter and destroyed!;Punch;Rage;Punch

 

[Deiblerj]

Current battle...

 

[Shinte122305]

OH boy lol. The classic over cleaned tank. I recently helped a friend with a dino outbreak and he had 0 Nitrates 0 phos. Its not as scary as you think or as annoying.
This is the only product i made him buy https://www.amazon.com/Brightwell-A...38680420&sr=sr-1&keywords=brightwell+nitrogen

Dont turn off your skimmer, if you want to skim less just remove the cup or lower the water volume in the skimmer. Skimmers have a huge role when it comes to PH in a tank due to aeration so just make it skim less or none but dont turn off.
Use the calculator at the back of the brightwell bottle to get nitrates anywhere between 2-5 ppm do this slowly dose every day eventually it will balance out and with food you should be able to maintain it at 2-5ppm with the occasional dose here and there for you over cleaners xD. Test nitrates daily until you learn your tank.

Remove GFO for now but not carbon. make sure to use a little lower amount of carbon for now than recommended but dont remove it. carbon helps with a lot of things and it wont touch nitrates or phos. Test phosphates daily until you see you need to put GFO. again learn your tank.

Tank will get a little "dirty" beef up the cleanup crew. eventually itll settle and youll slowly see everything coming to life. stability is key happy reefing xD

 

[Teri NewbieReefer]

Hi. You say you're doing a cube of shrimp a day plus some pellets & flakes for the 6 fish. I think that you might be overdoing it a bit. For my similar stocked 30, I take a red solo cup with a few ounces of RO/DI water, throw a cube and 1/4 tsp reef chili in it, and once it's defrosted and stirred up, I have at least 3 days of easily digested food to broadcast and target feed. The rest of the cup gets covered with plastic wrap and goes in the fridge for the next days' feedings. (The fact that you have a cloud of fish poo when you turn up the pumps says "yikes" in my book.) I would say back off on the feeding and give your tank some time.

 

[Deiblerj]

OH boy lol. The classic over cleaned tank. I recently helped a friend with a dino outbreak and he had 0 Nitrates 0 phos. Its not as scary as you think or as annoying.
This is the only product i made him buy https://www.amazon.com/Brightwell-A...38680420&sr=sr-1&keywords=brightwell+nitrogen

Dont turn off your skimmer, if you want to skim less just remove the cup or lower the water volume in the skimmer. Skimmers have a huge role when it comes to PH in a tank due to aeration so just make it skim less or none but dont turn off.
Use the calculator at the back of the brightwell bottle to get nitrates anywhere between 2-5 ppm do this slowly dose every day eventually it will balance out and with food you should be able to maintain it at 2-5ppm with the occasional dose here and there for you over cleaners xD. Test nitrates daily until you learn your tank.

Remove GFO for now but not carbon. make sure to use a little lower amount of carbon for now than recommended but dont remove it. carbon helps with a lot of things and it wont touch nitrates or phos. Test phosphates daily until you see you need to put GFO. again learn your tank.

Tank will get a little "dirty" beef up the cleanup crew. eventually itll settle and youll slowly see everything coming to life. stability is key happy reefing xD

So this may be a dumb question haha but does it ever get to a point where it stabilizes itself? Meaning I won’t be having to manaully dose and/or check parameters daily? If that’s the case I’m for sure buying a Hanna checker because these API test kits blow.

So my carbon and GFO are in the same bag. I’ll pick up a new bag of just carbon tonight and replace in my tank. I’ll also turn the skimmer back on but move the cup up so it’s not pulling as much.

This is the part where I feel like I am going in circles!!

 

[Deiblerj]

Hi. You say you're doing a cube of shrimp a day plus some pellets & flakes for the 6 fish. I think that you might be overdoing it a bit. For my similar stocked 30, I take a red solo cup with a few ounces of RO/DI water, throw a cube and 1/4 tsp reef chili in it, and once it's defrosted and stirred up, I have at least 3 days of easily digested food to broadcast and target feed. The rest of the cup gets covered with plastic wrap and goes in the fridge for the next days' feedings. (The fact that you have a cloud of fish poo when you turn up the pumps says "yikes" in my book.) I would say back off on the feeding and give your tank some time.

Hahah I might have over exaggerated a bit, but yeah my fish should be on an Activia commercial for their healthy bowel movements

 

[Geebs19]

I agree with turning the skimmer back on and leaving everything else out. Feeding that much food, I cant imagine all of it is consumed so you

So this may be a dumb question haha but does it ever get to a point where it stabilizes itself? Meaning I won’t be having to manaully dose and/or check parameters daily? If that’s the case I’m for sure buying a Hanna checker because these API test kits blow.

So my carbon and GFO are in the same bag. I’ll pick up a new bag of just carbon tonight and replace in my tank. I’ll also turn the skimmer back on but move the cup up so it’s not pulling as much.

This is the part where I feel like I am going in circles!!

The stabalizing question is really going to depend on what you are doing with your tank. The more corals, specifically SPS you have the more dKH, Calc, and Mag you will have to monitor and potentially dose. Your ammonia, nitrite and nitrates should eventually stabalize and most dont test for those unless something is wrong.

 

[Shinte122305]

So this may be a dumb question haha but does it ever get to a point where it stabilizes itself? Meaning I won’t be having to manaully dose and/or check parameters daily? If that’s the case I’m for sure buying a Hanna checker because these API test kits blow.

So my carbon and GFO are in the same bag. I’ll pick up a new bag of just carbon tonight and replace in my tank. I’ll also turn the skimmer back on but move the cup up so it’s not pulling as much.

This is the part where I feel like I am going in circles!!

lol youll get it quicker than you think. Use Hanna tester for Phosphate. buy https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/phos...eter-hi736-hanna-checker-hc-marine-water.html
its a bit pricey at first but you can get reagents later for it on amazon and its really cheap.

for Nitrates ive tried them all and i have always loved Saliferts nitrate test. pro tip measure the test by the side and divide by 10. youll know what i mean when you buy it lol its hard to see the low range colors by the top for the salifert one so use the side, read instructions youll see.

YES the tank will stabilize itself once you learn how to do it xD. i check parameters every 2 weeks now when i do my water change and occasionally dose just nitrates. the only thing i check almost daily is ALK with the Hanna checker because i dose 2 part for my SPS but thats a whole different subject. just worry about getting your tank stable for now with the basics. keep it simple is key.

 

[Deiblerj]

I agree with turning the skimmer back on and leaving everything else out. Feeding that much food, I cant imagine all of it is consumed so you


The stabalizing question is really going to depend on what you are doing with your tank. The more corals, specifically SPS you have the more dKH, Calc, and Mag you will have to monitor and potentially dose. Your ammonia, nitrite and nitrates should eventually stabalize and most dont test for those unless something is wrong.

Plan is to eventually add some corals but don’t want to get ahead of myself. Want my tank parameters to be under control. I bought a few frags a while ago before I really knew what I was doing...ha, still don’t entirly know. They are there...but on their way out I think

 

[Deiblerj]

lol youll get it quicker than you think. Use Hanna tester for Phosphate. buy https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/phos...eter-hi736-hanna-checker-hc-marine-water.html
its a bit pricey at first but you can get reagents later for it on amazon and its really cheap.

for Nitrates ive tried them all and i have always loved Saliferts nitrate test. pro tip measure the test by the side and divide by 10. youll know what i mean when you buy it lol its hard to see the low range colors by the top for the salifert one so use the side, read instructions youll see.

YES the tank will stabilize itself once you learn how to do it xD. i check parameters every 2 weeks now when i do my water change and occasionally dose just nitrates. the only thing i check almost daily is ALK with the Hanna checker because i dose 2 part for my SPS but thats a whole different subject. just worry about getting your tank stable for now with the basics. keep it simple is key.

Much appreciated advice. Thank you, sir

 

[Shinte122305]

Plan is to eventually add some corals but don’t want to get ahead of myself. Want my tank parameters to be under control. I bought a few frags a while ago before I really knew what I was doing...ha, still don’t entirly know. They are there...but on their way out I think

My bet is on the corals starving. Ive seen this a million times. Theres a lot of bad info out there with ultra low nutrients being the thing to do but what they dont tell you is that those ULN thriving systems with 0 phosphatea and 0 nitrates is that those guys dose amino acids and waterchanges for trace elements or dose trace elements for the corals to receive the nutrients they need. a lot of behind the scenes things that arent mentioned and people over purify their tanks and end up with corals bleaching or dull colors. I was one of these people myself. i wish i had before and after pics of my SPS from when i ran 0 nitrates to 2-5ppm like i do now. literally 5 times the color.

Honestly this approach is very annoying and more and more people are realizing that just maintaining a proper nitrate and phosphate level along with constant/proper water changes is part of the key to a successful tank.

 

[Geebs19]

Plan is to eventually add some corals but don’t want to get ahead of myself. Want my tank parameters to be under control. I bought a few frags a while ago before I really knew what I was doing...ha, still don’t entirly know. They are there...but on their way out I think

I have the Hanna ULR Phosphorus and really like it. I would recommned that. Just got the Salifert for Alk, Mag and Calc and they are easier then the red sea that I had. There are some easy soft corals and lps that wont require you to moniter everyday. I have 2 Hammers and a Torch and just check weekly.

 

[Deiblerj]

I have the Hanna ULR Phosphorus and really like it. I would recommned that. Just got the Salifert for Alk, Mag and Calc and they are easier then the red sea that I had. There are some easy soft corals and lps that wont require you to moniter everyday. I have 2 Hammers and a Torch and just check weekly.

Cost aside, Hanna for alk, mag and calc or salifert?

I forget what brand I have now for those tests but I feel like I’m back in chemistry class when I’m doing them! Beakers, vials, syringes!