I think our stardust PE are dying

[mikesin]

Hello,
History - we got these guys in January. 2 polyps - put them in our 75G. It grew 2 more polyps and they were looking good. last week the 2 new babys were closed more than open - we figured no big deal, then 2 days ago the other 2 started closing more than they were open. I have not seen any of them open today and to me (an unexperienced observer) they don't look good. Our lighting is T5, 54WX6 - our water parameters are:
pH8.1
ammonia 0
nitrItes 0
nitrAtes 0
phos 0
mag 1380
calc 440

Also purchased at the same time were red PE and candy apple greens, they seem to be fine.

Any idea as to what is going on?
thanks much

 

[Christel Mei]

Sounds like a bacterial infection of some type. New polyps are always the first to close with the onset of an infection. On a small frag it is easy to observe this. This is a great way to identify a disease related problem, when a colony is clearly gorwing, and then BAM....They close up and look crappy.

Just to be sure, what type of test kits are you using?

If you dont have any other corals showing issues in the tank and good water for sure, that leaves two issues, disease or predators. Most zoa predators are visible, so it sounds to me like an infection.

I would do this ASAP:

Give them a full capsule furan II/1 cup of tank water dip for 10 minutes right after LIGHTS OUT. This will give them time to recover over night when they would be closed anyway, mainly from you touching them. See if they dont open the next day. If they are not open then dip them again that night.

It is imperative that you treat now, dont wait any longer.

 

[mikesin]

Thanks Cristel, we use mainly API tests. We currently don't have furan II, plans 2 get it tomorrow if the locals have it - we do have seachem's reef dip... so, we dipped them for 5 minutes and placed them back in the tank. Maybe we are looking to close but none of our corals are looking fully open to us. (torch - misc zoos/palys, hairy mushroom, trumpet) We have a water change scheduled for tomorrow (10% weekly).
We will let you know tomorrow if the PE's open - Thanks for your help

 

[Christel Mei]

Have you checked your alkalinity?

 

[mikesin]

Update - The alkalinity is 8 / 9 dkh. We dose with kalk every evening so dkh and calcium are almost always the same. The polyps did not open today. We did a 15% water change this evening. The water parameters are the same as posted earlier (we strive to NOT have fluctuations). We also found Furan II and have it, should we dip for 10 minutes after lights are out tonight considering we used seachems reef dip last night (not sure about chemical reactions)?
Thanks again.

 

[Christel Mei]

Yes, go ahead and dip now. I have dipped zoas in furan, taken them out and directly put them in reef dip. No harm, reef dip is gentle. So is furan.

 

[mikesin]

Ok, we diped them last night - how many times can one dip?

Thanks

 

[Christel Mei]

Any improvement?

You can dip them again tonight if you need to.

 

[mikesin]

no, no improvement with the polyps but the other corals are looking better since we did the water change. we will do another smaller water change tomorrow. We will probably dip again tonight - however, I think they are running out of time.
Thanks

 

[Christel Mei]

You may have waited to long to take action, of course as with all living things there is a point of no return.

You should always treat at the first sign of disease. I treat the first day I notice anything out of the ordinary.

 

[mikesin]

ya, I think you may be right. You said you "treat the first day I notice anything out of the ordinary" we assume you have an established tank - do you treat often? or more with new/quarantine?

** in other words - do you have this problem in your DT?


Thanks

 

[Christel Mei]

No, but on a rare occasion a frag will look a little sick. No matter how stable your system is you will always experience this. If I see an issue, I treat right away.

I never really QT stuff, but I always give it a dip when I get to get rid of anything nasty.

 

[mikesin]

thanks for taking the time to explain/help, we really appreciate it. The pe still hasn't opened but were not giving up...... the other corals are looking much better and the torch now has 4 heads and the the hairy mushroom split into 6 individuals, I think we misunderstood what was happening to them. Again, thanks for your time and help.

 

[ficklefins]

Great advice Christel!

PEs enjoy medium/high flow and medium light. That being said this would be my approach given the advice you mentioned so far.

Check around the polyps and under the disk for any predators, especially the grey colored asterina starfish. Place the frag somewhere out in the open or on a frag rack so that it is away from your rocks. Now place it in a location that has more flow and more light, but not too much light too quickly. The reason for putting it out in the open and under higher flow/light is that it will be easier for you to monitor.

I have had polyps move on me before without any issues, but this may be a sign that your current location is not ideal.

 

[mikesin]

Hello,
To recap, we have the following zoo's. stardust (closed for two weeks now) Red PE (closed for about 1 week), Candy apple green 7 polyps, 2 are baby/new have been there for two weeks and have NOT opened yet, other 5 open and close alot during the day), Blue tub (2 polyps, almost always open).
we looked again for critters. The two things we found are white bugs that seem to be more prevalent at night. They are on the substrate of the entire tank. They are too small for my camera to photograph (under 1mm), they move like ants. the second was this worm under our mushrooms rock (ie, pic#3) They don't appear to be eating the zoo's. our other corals are doing great. We mistook them splitting/dividing for being ill in earlier posts. Torch went from 2 to 4 heads, Trumpet went from 9 to 14 heads and our hairy mushroom divided into 6. All corals are spot and tank fed once a week with brine, coral frenzy & cyclopeeze.The water parameters remain the same, s.g. 1.026, ph 8.1, ammonia 0, nitrItes 0, nitrAtes - almost undetectable, dkh 8/9, mag 1300, mag 440, point of sale - 0. the lights are on 10 hrs a day.
most state that zoo's are "easy" to keep. few state they just cant keep them alive (they close up and melt away). We would like to be able to keep zoo's and find out the cause of why ours are doing well/dying. Does anyone supplement anything EX: iodine?
We moved these guys away from the rocks, in direct light, on the substrate.

will try to get better picts.

stardust:

Red PE:

worm aprox 1" long:

 

[Pufferpunk]

Try treating with Vitamin C.
https://www.reef2reef.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8931

 

[Christel Mei]

They are closed, but they dont look that bad to me. IMO there is still hope.

Zoas with disease deteriorate quickly, and start to look visually bad. your appear to be just "closed". This makes it tough. If I had to bet I would say it is water quality related.

If furan and iodine dips are doing nothing, I know what your tests are telling you, but it has to be the water.

 

[ficklefins]

Updates?