Is this Dinoflagellates or something else?

[OhDumb]

My skimmer died last week on my nano and while I've been slow to replace do to life my nitrates have spiked. I've started to get this stringy algae or bacteria on a lot of my corals. It doesn't seem to be on the rocks as much. This weekend I'm setting up a refugium as a replacement export system on my nano. But, would like to get an ID on what I'm battling in the mean time.

Quick video of the suspect.

 

[JaimeAdams]

Can't tell from your video. Did you read the main dino thread? It has testing methods or buy a cheap microscope.

 

[mcarroll]

If you have a new tank that was started with dead rock that you ran GFO and/or carbon dosing on to the point that you had no nitrates and/or phosphates in the system, then you probably have dino's.

If that doesn't describe your tank at all, then it's probably something else.

Losing a skimmer for a week doesn't cause any kind of algae.

Can you tell us more about the tank? How old? Recent test results? Anything else interesting?

 

[OhDumb]

If you have a new tank that was started with dead rock that you ran GFO and/or carbon dosing on to the point that you had no nitrates and/or phosphates in the system, then you probably have dino's.

If that doesn't describe your tank at all, then it's probably something else.

Losing a skimmer for a week doesn't cause any kind of algae.

Can you tell us more about the tank? How old? Recent test results? Anything else interesting?

This is a Fluval 13.5g nano that I've had setup for over year. I no longer carbon dose, but continue small amount of GFO but not to the point of unmeasurable PO4. I stopped carbon dosing about 6-months ago. I do 20% water changes weekly and have allowed my Nitrates to climb up to 10-15PPM. I stopped pushing my tank into parameters that forced dosing anything and only add Vibrant at recommended dose weekly. I'm starting a small refugium in the chamber that held the skimmer for small nutrient export and pod production this weekend.

I started reading through your big thread on Dinos. One thing that might have led to this (if it is Dinos) is I had a bad incident about a month ago where I didn't rinse thoroughly enough some coral frags I had dipped with Bayer. I lost my Emerald crab and Cleaner shrimp. I did a large water change and have run a large amount of GAC. I saved my hermits and Pistol shrimp, but I believe this could have nuked my pod population. This could have given a foothold to nuisance algae/dinos.

Parameters...
Nitrate 10-15
Phosphate .02
Calc 400
Alk 8 dKH
pH 8.2
Temp 81F
Salinity 1.024

 

[OhDumb]

Can't tell from your video. Did you read the main dino thread? It has testing methods or buy a cheap microscope.

Going through it now. I have a microscope and will get some ID going tonight.

 

[mcarroll]

This is a Fluval 13.5g nano that I've had setup for over year.

I stopped carbon dosing about 6-months ago.

Sounds like your tank WAS a candidate, but if dino's never showed up until now I'm slightly doubtful that's what you have. Scope will tell for sure.

I do 20% water changes weekly and have allowed my Nitrates to climb up to 10-15PPM.

You may be zero'ing out the tank's PO4 level with every water change. If you have to keep doing water changes for other reasons, I'd add some phosphate fertilizer like Flouraish or NeoPhos to your water change water so that PO4 levels do not dip.

You might even want to supplement current PO4 levels up to >0.03 or even >0.10 for the short term. Phosphate limitation might be part of the reason your NO3 is climbing but PO4 is not.

only add Vibrant at recommended dose weekly

Is this necessary? I'd stop for a while.

I had a bad incident about a month ago where I didn't rinse thoroughly enough some coral frags I had dipped with Bayer.

This could have given a foothold to nuisance algae/dinos.

Yikes! Some die-off is a great place to find algae growing...they love a disturbance.

And it obviously caused some die-off – safe to assume there was a lot more die-off at the microbial level that's essentially invisible.

This isn't really a dinos-in-the-making kind of scenario though...

Nitrate 10-15
Phosphate .02
Calc 400
Alk 8 dKH
pH 8.2
Temp 81F
Salinity 1.024

Looks OK overall with the exception of my comments on PO4 earlier. I'd take care that PO4 goes no lower.

Going through it now. I have a microscope and will get some ID going tonight.

Pics!!

 

[OhDumb]

I'll try and get some pics tonight through the microscope. It's my sons microscope I got him and is decent, but getting pics is kind hard.

To answer some of your points/questions....

PO4 - I'll look at dosing to get it up to where it needs to be for now and remove the GFO. I'm mainly zoas, chalices, favites so higher PO4 won't matter and probably benefit.
Vibrant - I had some bad Bubble Algae and used the combo of manual removal, Vibrant, and the Emerald crab to knock it out. I still have a few spots and was going to replace my Emerald to help keep it in check.
Water Changes - I don't dose so weekly water changes have kept everything stable including pH, Alk and Calc.

Thanks for you help so far! I'm crossing my fingers it's not Dinos and you've giving me hope.

 

[OhDumb]

I did my best trying to get some video under the microscope. Check the link for a 40X and 20x version. Doesn’t look good.

https://imgur.com/a/UqxFVuD

Here is a photo of the 20X

 

[mcarroll]

Tank pic of it too please?

How often do you test vs how often do you change water?

Adding Po4 is probably not a bad idea at this point.

 

[Anthony123coral]

Looks like Dino’s to me I fought those for months. I was dosing amino acids when I didn’t really need them. I used vibrant to get rid of them also stopped dosing all unnecessary stuff. As soon as I stopped dosing AA they pretty much dissolved. It was horrible though. Weird that you have them with a maintenance dose of vibrant. Vibrant really helped me get a grip on the problem. I believe the strain is ostreposis. I could be completely wrong though hopefully others will chime in. I spent around 3 months battling them and haven’t seen anything resembling them for around 4 months. My problem was my water chemistry was out of whack as soon as I solved that problem they vanished.. Usually water changes flare them up even worse. good luck they can be beat.

 

[Ecvernon]

It looks like ostreopsis dinoflagellates to me. If so it could be killed with raising nutrients and UV sterilizer.

 

[OhDumb]

Tank pic of it too please?

How often do you test vs how often do you change water?

Adding Po4 is probably not a bad idea at this point.

I test weekly and do weekly water changes.

Lights are off now. I blew off the rocks and corals with a turkey baster last night. It’s getting slightly worse.

Review my plan and let me know what else I should do/don’t do.

Skip water change this week
Increase PO4 to between .03-.1 and remove GFO.
Continue to run GAC
Add the fuge I had already been planning this weekend
Look for some pods to add to jumpstart population

 

[OhDumb]

Update:

I have Nitrate levels at 20ppm and PO4 at .1-.2 (salifert colors are hard for me to read but it’s elevated for sure).

I have started my refugium with Cheato and some LR rubble from the bottom of my LFS bin. I’m focusing on getting my pod population up.

I have been doing the micro bubbles thing to help suspend the mucus nets or whatever the Dino’s clusters are for my overflow to catch in a sock.

Now we wait I guess.

 

[OhDumb]

Update:

I went ahead and added a UV Sterilizer. It seems to be doing a good job keeping the Dino’s reduced after the first night.

Water chemistry is still high nutrient levels.

Dino’s not as thick.

 

[mcarroll]

I have started my refugium with Cheato and some LR rubble from the bottom of my LFS bin. I’m focusing on getting my pod population up.

Generally this is what you'd do last – after the dino's had been cleared up for a while. Chaeto might never be needed and the rubble rock is only worthwhile if it was really live.

I have been doing the micro bubbles thing

Sounds harmless enough, if it seems to work. It might be worth linking this thread in case it can save some effort:
Dinoflagellates – Are You Tired Of Battling Altogether? has pretty much all of the info you'll want to follow in getting your tank back. The vast most of what you don't already have here in your thread is right in the first post of that one.

There are a virtually unlimited number of other ways that folks have tried to approach dino blooms like yours, but results are very mixed in all other cases....most are a waste of time even if they aren't harmful.

Diatom/micron filtration is something else to consider if you feel you need more than what you have going on now.

Keep PO4 ≥0.10 ppm if dino's seem to be hanging on and nothing else (cyano, green hair algae, etc) seems to grow. Often levels under 0.10 aren't sufficient to get momentum in your direction.

 

[OhDumb]

I’ve been following the main thread and others. The main thing I’ve avoided is messing with the water chemistry beyond nutrients.

The refugium decision was based on nuking my pod population and microfauna and what I suspect started the Dinofest. The live rock was from the bottom of my LFS LR tub. It’s alive. I was really wanting fauna than anything.

So far so good. Seeing less Dino’s already and more open coral polyps.

 

[OhDumb]

Update:
I'm only seeing Dinos on my sand now. No more stringy mess on rocks or corals. I was having corals showing signs of stress as my pH and Alk were dipping, so I went ahead and did my first water change. I had no more Dino's than I did the day before. Things seem to be heading in the right direction.

Moving forward I'll be maintaining Nitrates between 10-20 and PO4 <.1. The refugium is doing okay and the Cheato isn't really doing anything, but I am getting my pod population back up and that was the goal. I plan on running the UV another week and then taking it offline. I'll continue to monitor for signs of a come back.

 

[OhDumb]

My Alk and pH were still suffering so did another 20% water change. All things look great so far. All my corals are back to being open and looking good. The only signs of Dinos are a few spots in low flow areas on the sand. It's not a mat, but looks more like Diatoms. I have kept the UV on for the time being and might remove after I confirm the water change hasn't caused a bloom. Still keeping Nitrate and PO4 up. My nitrates stay around 20ppm and my PO4 around .03. I am going to test today and have the Brightwell PO4 to dose if it drops too low after water changes.

 

[OhDumb]

Update:
I've been relatively Dino free for a week. I took the UV sterilizer off line and did a 20% water change to see what effect it would have. I have seen no explosion of Dino on the rocks or corals. There has been a slight dusting on the sand, but it hasn't spread. I will continue to maintain Nitrate and Phosphate at current levels, dose weekly Vibrant at the normal dosage, and keep an eye on things. But, for now I'll say that I won the battle, but I give it some more time to determine if I won the war.