Magnesium intake

[Shahin bahrami]

I have started a new aquarium. Today it has been 3 months. Magnesium consumption is 40 mg/L per day. Where does this amount go when there is no fish or coral?

 

[Shahin bahrami]

Don't even know why you are dosing anything in a 3 month old tank with no coral. Your testing is faulty. Your tank doesn't have anything in there to consume any alk, cal or mag.

My question is the same.
Let's assume I'm wrong and shouldn't dose. OK . Forgive me.

But where do these elements that are dosed go?

 

[I never finish anythi]

My question is the same.
Let's assume I'm wrong and shouldn't dose. OK . Forgive me.

But where do these elements that are dosed go?

How consistent is your salinity??

 

[Shahin bahrami]

How consistent is your salinity??

1.025 all time

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

My question is the same.
Let's assume I'm wrong and shouldn't dose. OK . Forgive me.

But where do these elements that are dosed go?

Most supplements should be dosed to a high flow area away from delicate organisms. Beyond that, location usually sides most matter.

I would not dose alkalinity directly into a pump inlet.

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

Most supplements should be dosed to a high flow area away from delicate organisms. Beyond that, location usually sides most matter.

I would not dose alkalinity directly into a pump inlet.

I think he was asking "where do they go" as in "what makes the level decline"...

 

[Joe31415]

Have you checked that the pump is actually pumping? Going through lots of Alk/Calc/Mag with the numbers not moving (or going down even though you're dosing more) is often a sign of a broken or clogged pump.

The next few times it doses, watch the mag exit the tube and go into the water. Physically make sure it's actually happening. Also, make sure it's ending up in a low flow area. My calc dosing tube shifted and started dosing behind the return pump. By the time I noticed it, there was a huge fluffy pile of it back there. I never would've guessed that area, or any area, would be that still.

Also, are you sure you're dosing magnesium, and properly mixed magnesium? It's not unheard of for people do get additives mixed up. Many of us have had problems where our parameters aren't acting correctly only to realize their alk and calc containers are backwards.

In addition to making sure your pump is actually pumping, I'd suggest run a test, then use a supplement calculator to figure out how much you'd need to add to bring it up by some known about, say 50 or 100ppm, add that, wait an hour or two for it to circulate and test again. Whether or not you see a difference in the results will give us some direction as to what's going on.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I think he was asking "where do they go" as in "what makes the level decline"...

Ah, ok.

 

[Shahin bahrami]

Have you checked that the pump is actually pumping? Going through lots of Alk/Calc/Mag with the numbers not moving (or going down even though you're dosing more) is often a sign of a broken or clogged pump.

The next few times it doses, watch the mag exit the tube and go into the water. Physically make sure it's actually happening. Also, make sure it's ending up in a low flow area. My calc dosing tube shifted and started dosing behind the return pump. By the time I noticed it, there was a huge fluffy pile of it back there. I never would've guessed that area, or any area, would be that still.

Also, are you sure you're dosing magnesium, and properly mixed magnesium? It's not unheard of for people do get additives mixed up. Many of us have had problems where our parameters aren't acting correctly only to realize their alk and calc containers are backwards.

In addition to making sure your pump is actually pumping, I'd suggest run a test, then use a supplement calculator to figure out how much you'd need to add to bring it up by some known about, say 50 or 100ppm, add that, wait an hour or two for it to circulate and test again. Whether or not you see a difference in the results will give us some direction as to what's going on.

I see that it is really pumping.
Also, I calculated the amount of the dose , with the calculator of the supplement manufacturer. I prepared the solution completely isolated and single element, with a magnetic stirrer. I gave the solution to the dosing pump and programmed the correct amount.

 

[Joe31415]

Also, make sure it's ending up in a low flow area.

Too late to edit, but that should be "make sure it's NOT ending up in a low flow area"

Also, I calculated the amount of the dose , with the calculator of the supplement manufacturer. I prepared the solution completely isolated and single element, with a magnetic stirrer. I gave the solution to the dosing pump and programmed the correct amount.

I understand that, but now we need to do a test to see what's going on. Right now there appears to be two main possibilities. Your tank is actually consuming an incredible amount of magnesium (a supplement many people don't need to dose in the first place) or it's not consuming all that magnesium and something else is going on.

Testing your magnesium level, deliberately bumping it up by a known amount, then testing it again after it's had time to circulate but not enough time to be consumed, will give us a lot of direction so we're not going down a bunch of unrelated rabbit holes.

So, lets say you did this.... You test your mag level and it's at 1300. You plug the numbers into a magnesium supplement calculator (like this one) and tell it you want to up your mag level from 1300 to 1400 and tell your pump to add the amount it instructs you to add. An hour or so later check the mag levels again. If you're still reading 1300, we need to look at the potency of the magnesium additive, the pump (is it moving liquid, is it moving the correct amount of liquid), the test kit(s) and if you're using them properly, where in the system the additive is being added (ie a dead zone vs a high flow area) and probably a few other things.

On the other hand, if the second test shows the levels have been raised, we need to look at some other things. Is something actually consuming all that mag? Is there something going on with your pump schedule? Etc.

Testing your mag solution (I know, you mixed it to manufacturer specs) might be necessary as well. I'm not sure if there's a way to test the potency of the additive, but you could pull a gallon of water (freshly made or from the tank), test it, use a calculator to calculate how much you need to add to raise it, say, 100ppm, then test again and see if you're within an acceptable margin of error. If nothing changes, it's likely a problem with the test (or test procedure) or the additive.

And, just to be clear, I'm not saying any of these things are actually what's happening, but at the very least, this will rule some of these things out.

By the way, can you link to the magnesium supplement you're using?
What were the three test kits that you used?
What are the actual readings that you're getting?
Do you have type of media that might be removing it from the water?
You said this is a new tank, if you're doing regular water changes, check the mag level of the fresh saltwater. If it's considerably lower than where you want it, that might be what's bringing it down.
Are you using dry rock? I believe dry rock will absorb magnesium (and phosphate, I think) for a while when it's new.
I don't recall off the top of my head if other parameters being really high or low can affect mag, but if you something else is out of whack, I'd correct that too.

Also, listen to what Randy has to say, he's going to be the expert when it comes to chemical type stuff.

I have some more thoughts, but running a test, adding the supplement and running the test again, is going to go a long way in diagnosing this. It sounds like you're already testing quite a bit to begin with, so I'm guessing this isn't too big of a burden.

 

[Lavey29]

My question is the same.
Let's assume I'm wrong and shouldn't dose. OK . Forgive me.

But where do these elements that are dosed go?

Looking at your tank photo, it does not look like a 3 month tank. I see no algae color variations in your rocks at all. Almost to sterile in my opinion. Have you left lights off the whole time? There is a tan hue on the rock and sand which may be diatoms but I can't tell for certain.

How do you check salinity? Calibrated refractometer? Milwaukee digital? Are you using RODI?

 

[Shahin bahrami]

Too late to edit, but that should be "make sure it's NOT ending up in a low flow area"


I understand that, but now we need to do a test to see what's going on. Right now there appears to be two main possibilities. Your tank is actually consuming an incredible amount of magnesium (a supplement many people don't need to dose in the first place) or it's not consuming all that magnesium and something else is going on.

Testing your magnesium level, deliberately bumping it up by a known amount, then testing it again after it's had time to circulate but not enough time to be consumed, will give us a lot of direction so we're not going down a bunch of unrelated rabbit holes.

So, lets say you did this.... You test your mag level and it's at 1300. You plug the numbers into a magnesium supplement calculator (like this one) and tell it you want to up your mag level from 1300 to 1400 and tell your pump to add the amount it instructs you to add. An hour or so later check the mag levels again. If you're still reading 1300, we need to look at the potency of the magnesium additive, the pump (is it moving liquid, is it moving the correct amount of liquid), the test kit(s) and if you're using them properly, where in the system the additive is being added (ie a dead zone vs a high flow area) and probably a few other things.

On the other hand, if the second test shows the levels have been raised, we need to look at some other things. Is something actually consuming all that mag? Is there something going on with your pump schedule? Etc.

Testing your mag solution (I know, you mixed it to manufacturer specs) might be necessary as well. I'm not sure if there's a way to test the potency of the additive, but you could pull a gallon of water (freshly made or from the tank), test it, use a calculator to calculate how much you need to add to raise it, say, 100ppm, then test again and see if you're within an acceptable margin of error. If nothing changes, it's likely a problem with the test (or test procedure) or the additive.

And, just to be clear, I'm not saying any of these things are actually what's happening, but at the very least, this will rule some of these things out.

By the way, can you link to the magnesium supplement you're using?
What were the three test kits that you used?
What are the actual readings that you're getting?
Do you have type of media that might be removing it from the water?
You said this is a new tank, if you're doing regular water changes, check the mag level of the fresh saltwater. If it's considerably lower than where you want it, that might be what's bringing it down.
Are you using dry rock? I believe dry rock will absorb magnesium (and phosphate, I think) for a while when it's new.
I don't recall off the top of my head if other parameters being really high or low can affect mag, but if you something else is out of whack, I'd correct that too.

Also, listen to what Randy has to say, he's going to be the expert when it comes to chemical type stuff.

I have some more thoughts, but running a test, adding the supplement and running the test again, is going to go a long way in diagnosing this. It sounds like you're already testing quite a bit to begin with, so I'm guessing this isn't too big of a burden.

Thank you very much for your time. Your instructions are like a college proposal. So I need to act like a careful student. I have done this and report back. Thank you again.

 

[Shahin bahrami]

Looking at your tank photo, it does not look like a 3 month tank. I see no algae color variations in your rocks at all. Almost to sterile in my opinion. Have you left lights off the whole time? There is a tan hue on the rock and sand which may be diatoms but I can't tell for certain.

How do you check salinity? Calibrated refractometer? Milwaukee digital? Are you using RODI?

I will send you a photo again. Algae has appeared on the sand and rocks. One of my salinity meters is refractometer and the other is HANNA model HI98319.

 

[Lavey29]

I will send you a photo again. Algae has appeared on the sand and rocks. One of my salinity meters is refractometer and the other is HANNA model HI98319.

Kind of a long read but may be applicable to your unbalanced situation.

https://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-07/rhf/index.php#:~:text=If%20the%20pH%20becomes%20elevated,(Figures%209%20and%2010).

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

"Right now there appears to be two main possibilities. Your tank is actually consuming an incredible amount of magnesium (a supplement many people don't need to dose in the first place) or it's not consuming all that magnesium and something else is going on.

Testing your magnesium level, deliberately bumping it up by a known amount, then testing it again after it's had time to circulate but not enough time to be consumed, will give us a lot of direction so we're not going down a bunch of unrelated rabbit holes.

So, lets say you did this.... You test your mag level and it's at 1300. You plug the numbers into a magnesium supplement calculator (like this one) and tell it you want to up your mag level from 1300 to 1400 and tell your pump to add the amount it instructs you to add. An hour or so later check the mag levels again. If you're still reading 1300, we need to look at the potency of the magnesium additive, the pump (is it moving liquid, is it moving the correct amount of liquid), the test kit(s) and if you're using them properly, where in the system the additive is being added (ie a dead zone vs a high flow area) and probably a few other things.

On the other hand, if the second test shows the levels have been raised, we need to look at some other things. Is something actually consuming all that mag? Is there something going on with your pump schedule? Etc.

Testing your mag solution (I know, you mixed it to manufacturer specs) might be necessary as well. I'm not sure if there's a way to test the potency of the additive, but you could pull a gallon of water (freshly made or from the tank), test it, use a calculator to calculate how much you need to add to raise it, say, 100ppm, then test again and see if you're within an acceptable margin of error. If nothing changes, it's likely a problem with the test (or test procedure) or the additive.

And, just to be clear, I'm not saying any of these things are actually what's happening, but at the very least, this will rule some of these things out.

By the way, can you link to the magnesium supplement you're using?
What were the three test kits that you used?
What are the actual readings that you're getting?
Do you have type of media that might be removing it from the water?
You said this is a new tank, if you're doing regular water changes, check the mag level of the fresh saltwater. If it's considerably lower than where you want it, that might be what's bringing it down.
Are you using dry rock? I believe dry rock will absorb magnesium (and phosphate, I think) for a while when it's new.
I don't recall off the top of my head if other parameters being really high or low can affect mag, but if you something else is out of whack, I'd correct that too.

Also, listen to what Randy has to say, he's going to be the expert when it comes to chemical type stuff.

I have some more thoughts, but running a test, adding the supplement and running the test again, is going to go a long way in diagnosing this. It sounds like you're already testing quite a bit to begin with, so I'm guessing this isn't too big of a burden.

It is not a possibility that one tank had hugely excessive magnesium consumption. It is never consumed faster than about 1:10th of the calcium depletion.

 

[Joe31415]

It is not a possibility that one tank had hugely excessive magnesium consumption. It is never consumed faster than about 1:10th of the calcium depletion.

That's why one small part of my post was 'are you actually consuming all this magnesium' and the entire rest of it is 'let's figure out what's actually happening'.

 

[brayden2980]

Just trying to help.
Like I said before something is off. No system can use that amount of mag in one day or even a week or month.
Someone else please confirm for the op.
What is you alk and ca levels and how much do they vary daily?
It would be almost impossible to see ca move in one day also.
Alk is the only one you can measure and get a difference in a day.