Need input - Torches / LPS receding despite stable parameters & lighting

[Reef Knub]

Hey all, looking to get input on why my torches / LPS are consistently receding early in the afternoon about 3 hours before lights off, and generally shrunk over the last 3 weeks since i've purchased them. They have all definitely closed up a bit since i've bought them about 3 weeks back, and given my tank parameters (below) have been stable for months along with my new reefled G2 115s, i cannot determine at this point what may be wrong. See a recap of tank notes / parameters / routine below:

• - 90 gallon display, with sump below containing octo protein skimmer & filter floss
• - 2 new Reefled G2 115s , running for 8 hours each day (starting at 11 AM, off at 7 AM. starts at 15k, then 23k last 2 hours)
• - Water parameters from a API aquaspin digital test. The below parameters have been right around these values for 2 months
  • Salinity 1.025
  • pH 8.1
  • Alkalinity 188 ppm / 10.5 dkh
  • Calcium 504 ppm
  • Magnesium 1305 ppm
  • nitrate 12 ppm
  • Phosphate 0.2
• Have one wavemaker for surface agitation, and another wavemaker on other side of tank blowing torches with slight flow
• Measured PAR, and the torch placement is right at the ~100 par area
• Dosing regimen:
  • All for reef 40 ml / day
  • Topic Marin bacto balance 3 ml / day
  • quantum bioenhance 4 ml/day
• My next consideration is to start dosing soda ash (instead of kalk, as i can dose with less volume since i don't have much room under my tank).

Any & all input is welcome, as this is my 2nd round of buying some LPS with similar tank parameters, and having them die off. Can't tell what i'm doing wrong anymore!!

Attached some pics of tank (one of which from 3 weeks back when torches were fuller)

Thanks!

 

[bubbgee]

We need a video of the torches under flow to troubleshoot since all other parameters are fine.

 

[kingranch2003]

Hmmm.. your parameters DO look good. I know some will say api isn't the most accurate test. I use it sometimes myself too. Is it only euphyllia? Have you checked around for flatworms? And I have to ask if you have any shrimp in the tank.

 

[kingranch2003]

We need a video of the torches under flow to troubleshoot since all other parameters are fine.

Agreed. It'd be good to see a video.of your flow to the euphyllia.

 

[legionofdoon]

Maybe your ALK is too high for that lvl of nitrate.

 

[ReefQuestCorals]

Have you tried decreasing the alk? I personally like to run alk around the 8-9 dkh area, and seemed to struggle with lps when higher than 10 dkh.

 

[Reef Knub]

I haven't tried decreasing alk - will keep that in mind. Will take a video tomorrow and post.

I have looked closely for flatworms and nothing noticable. I did dip them in coralrx prior to glueing them in as well.

No shrimp in the tank

 

[Reef Knub]

To add - below is my dosing routine. Will also update original post:

• All for reef 40 ml / day
• Topic Marin bacto balance 3 ml / day
• quantum bioenhance 4 ml/day

 

[ReefQuestCorals]

To add - below is my dosing routine. Will also update original post:

• All for reef 40 ml / day
• Topic Marin bacto balance 3 ml / day
• quantum bioenhance 4 ml/day

Do you have a lot of coralline algae or something im not seeing? 40ml a day of afr seems like a lot for a tank with a few torches struggling which I doubt they are using much.

I would suggest going and getting your parameters checked at a lfs that uses salifert or another higher quality test kit. I have a feelings your readings are off

 

[troublemaker]

Check for flatworms. They hate Melafix and the corals barely notice it.

 

[Reef Knub]

Do you have a lot of coralline algae or something im not seeing? 40ml a day of afr seems like a lot for a tank with a few torches struggling which I doubt they are using much.

I would suggest going and getting your parameters checked at a lfs that uses salifert or another higher quality test kit. I have a feelings your readings are off

I do have a lot of coralline, sorry may be tough to see in blue light. i have a rock back wall, which at this point is all coralline purple.

 

[ReefQuestCorals]

I do have a lot of coralline, sorry may be tough to see in blue light. i have a rock back wall, which at this point is all coralline purple.

Yes very hard to see with the blue light, I would still suggest getting a 2nd opinion from a lfs.

Also I think best next steps would be to lower your dose of AFR until you get down around 9dkh, try to lower no more than .5 dkh a day. Fast adjustments can lead to more issues

 

[Reef Knub]

Thanks, will try lowering the AFR a bit from tmrw

 

[bubbgee]

I still think it’s a flow or light issue. Alk can be tolerated by most LPS unless it’s excessive above 12 dkh.

Tissue recession, in my experience, is caused by flow or pests. Since you were saying it recedes in the afternoon, it probably coincides with the schedule of your light or pump. After lowering the dose of Afr and if you see no changes, reduce your light or flow intensity in the afternoon by 20% and see if there’s any improvement.

 

[Shirak]

How much power are you running on the lights? 115w each with only 2 on a 90g tank seems underpowered even though you mention 100 par. My torches did best at 150-200 par. If slow recession is a problem on lps and water, nutrients and pests are all good it’s usually a lack of sufficient light.
8hr/day is also a little short imo. I would go at least 10 -12. If you go 12 you could do a 30 min ramp up 1hr ramp down.

Nitrates at 12 is a little on the low side but not bottomed out. I would try raising that a little.

 

[Reef Knub]

Lights are running at max power, 100% at peak hours after ramp up.

@bubbgee @kingranch2003 - see attached video of flow. polyps are kinda short in current state, so they don't flow around too much but i do feel like they're getting decent bi-directional random flow.

I'm going to try doing a 30 ml/day drip of soda ash from tomorrow onwards as well to see if that changes anything. A lot of what i'm reading / seeing online implies that growth improves with higher alk / pH than i currently have (and stabilizing that), and given AFR doesn't include those thinking that could help.

Additionally, wanted to get your thoughts on if the red banding under the head of the torch implies some kind of damage? Or what it is? I don't think it was there when i got the torch, and my other torches don't have the same red band under it's heads.

Thanks again for everyone's input!

 

[bubbgee]

Lights are running at max power, 100% at peak hours after ramp up.

@bubbgee @kingranch2003 - see attached video of flow. polyps are kinda short in current state, so they don't flow around too much but i do feel like they're getting decent bi-directional random flow.

I'm going to try doing a 30 ml/day drip of soda ash from tomorrow onwards as well to see if that changes anything. A lot of what i'm reading / seeing online implies that growth improves with higher alk / pH than i currently have (and stabilizing that), and given AFR doesn't include those thinking that could help.

Additionally, wanted to get your thoughts on if the red banding under the head of the torch implies some kind of damage? Or what it is? I don't think it was there when i got the torch, and my other torches don't have the same red band under it's heads.

Thanks again for everyone's input!

Could use a little more flow, it looks weak compared to the light it's under. Just increase by 25% and see how it looks. This is what mine looks like for reference

 

[Shirak]

You already have a pH of 8.1 and Alk at 10.5 There isn't any point in dosing soda ash IMO. Your pH is fine and you don't need more Alk.

Not sure what you mean AFR doesn't include those things. AFR covers everything including Alk. It won't change your pH but you shouldn't be worrying about that anyway. I have never checked pH in 40yrs and my corals are fine.

I really think you need to address the light situation. 100par and you are running at 100% power. 8hrs/day is not long enough I would go at least 10 at max power. You are running 6hrs at 15k and 2hrs at 24k so you are dropping out the white significantly. Guessing there is also a par drop there also, so now you are less than 100par for the last 2 hours of the light cycle.

 

[Shirak]

Torches. 200par under 3 Hydra32 running at 80% power 15k or so. Over a 55gal tank 6" off the water.