Plumbing Quandary Please Advise!

[Reef4Rose]

Looking at plumbing options on an Elos tank. The tank has their quiet drain system, one in each corner. Elos supplies the fittings to go into bottom of the tank and are barbed for soft pipes. Supplied is soft tubing for drain and return. Drain is 1.5 ID ribbed tubing and return is 1" ID smooth silicone. There is not enough tubing to make the long run so will need to combine with rigid PVC. Elos recommends the flex tubing for noise control. I want to add ball valves in case I need to shut off flow. Do I ditch the Elos recommendation and hard plum or use a combination of soft and hard piping? Any advise or thoughts from more experienced would be appreciated.

 

[chefjpaul]

I hard plumbed mine.
Its just a matter of preference.

 

[Larry L]

Soft tubing is usually recommended between the return pump and tank to reduce potential vibration and noise, but the whole run does not have to be soft - as long as part of the run is soft, that will help isolate the return pump vibration from the the return plumbing.

 

[Reef4Rose]

I hard plumbed mine.
Its just a matter of preference.

Do you use the quiet drain dial to control exit volume or ball valves on your line?

 

[chefjpaul]

Do you use the quiet drain dial to control exit volume or ball valves on your line?

I control my return pump.
I have gate and ball valves, but leave them wide open on the drain.

 

[bblumberg]

^ this +1
Don't forget to put the return pump on a pad if it has any significant vibration.

I don't have an Elos tank but have now plumbed 3 tanks with BeanAnimal overflows and 1" returns. Only the return pipe needs a length of soft tubing. I usually put this between the pump and the return plumbing, which is otherwise all hard. For maximum flow, oversize the return pipe a bit. I have 1" pipe from the pump all the way to the 3/4" bulkheads at the tank and this gives significantly more flow than 3/4" all the way.

Bruce

 

[Reef4Rose]

Soft tubing is usually recommended between the return pump and tank to reduce potential vibration and noise, but the whole run does not have to be soft - as long as part of the run is soft, that will help isolate the return pump vibration from the the return plumbing.

I did just read that as well about the return side, thanks for the info. Want to maximize turnover and manage noise level.

 

[Reef4Rose]

For maximum flow, oversize the return pipe a bit. I have 1" pipe from the pump all the way to the 3/4" bulkheads at the tank and this gives significantly more flow than 3/4" all the way.

Great info as I do want to maximize flow. The return on the Elos has a standpipe with 2 output ports one at sand level and one at waterline. For power and redundancy I was going to have a pump to each return.

Speaking of pumps, Reeflo diagrammed a pump above waterline and an elbow going down into sump to draw water up into the pump with a foot valve to stop siphon in the event of power outage. Reeflo also diagrammed normal straight out of sump. My reading also said never to put pump above waterline? Any comments on pump above sump waterline?

 

[Reef4Rose]

This all helps greatly. Makes more sense to me now especially balancing with return dialed back as needed.

 

[Rip Van Winkle]

This is your tank?
http://www.aquariumspecialty.com/elos-diamond-series-200xl-aquarium-system-180-gallon-system
That's a $10,000.00 (basicially $11000) special order tank. And customers are not given plumbing options or supported with that? Wow.
The only reason I searched was because I was going to ask how big your tank was but I saw "Elos 200 XL ... build..." so I looked it up. That's a really beautiful tank btw. Congratulations but somehow I expected more from Elos.

I just looked at the Elos Quiet Drain information for your tank and it says its adjustable and can be set up to 11000 l/h (almost 3000 gph) depending on the drain kit you selected with your system. To answer your question, (as already suggested above) you can hard plumb your returns but leave a short section (like 12" or so) of flexible tubing connected to the pump. If barb fittings, heat the end of the flex tube in boiling water to soften it when fitting it, to get a solid connection & zip tie it. Personally, I'd forego the flex tubing and just hard plumb it directly. Then just put the pump on a neoprene pad. I think for a system that size you might want a manifold for your return pipes to have connection options in the future but not sure that's compatible with the Elos system.
Plumbing:


Return manifold:

 

[Reef4Rose]

I did get a good price on the tank. The 10k pricing is with stand, sump, controller and their return pump. The overflows I have are the standard ones rated up to 2500 gallons each and recommended is 1500 gallons each for silence. This would be well over 10 times turnover on the low side. Initially I want lots of flow out of the tank. I have a good sized sump; 60x15x16. LFS says low flow through Sump. Others here have high flow through Sump. Ultimately I will have a Refugium added later with slow flow for longer biological filtration. One part of me prefers easy plumbing and the other wants it hard plumbed with unions and ball valves for future additions. This may stay FOWLR but I am sure corals will start. Thanks for the video links, especially the MACNA link as I was going to go but Harvey had other ideas.

 

[Rip Van Winkle]

It's your build and I think most people on this forum, including myself, will support you with whatever direction you decide to go in the end. That said, I think that ultimately, although you're correct about soft tubing being fairly easier (and quicker & probably even cheaper) to do, in the end you will really enjoy looking at the finished job of your hard plumbed system. It takes more time and there is a learning curve if you haven't done that before (meaning it's possible to make mistakes - which might cost more) but there is nothing like the feeling you'll get every time you open your stand to maintain your system and see the awesome plumbing job you've completed. If you're not feeling that, it's fine, I'm just giving you my perspective. One more advantage of hard plumbing is that (for a job done correctly) it's very stable and secure. It's not going to leak or break on you. That's peace of mind. It also sends a message that you really care about your system. My advice to my friends is always take your time and do it properly. You'll be thanking yourself in the long run, I'm very sure of that.

Your flow turnover is okay. I think it's "the typical standard" of what most people have. Ultimately the amount of flow in your sump will be determined by your return pump's turnover ability. I've found that the higher the turnover rate, the more stable the entire system is because more nutrients are exported, the higher the turnover rate. It just makes it easier it to maintain the DT.

Just out of curiosity what size drains are on that system? One inch?

BTW, who is Harvey?? You lost me? :)

 

[Rip Van Winkle]

Oh just got it. You meant the storm. Sorry about that and hope you weren't badly affected. I'm overseas here and didn't feel that.

 

[Reef4Rose]

Yap Harvey is the hurricane that hit the area. I was not affected. Higher elevation so no flooding. Just lots of rain. My main quandary stems from the Elos coming with barbed fittings and soft hose. I will ditch the barbed fittings or I will attach over the barbed fitting with a slip end. The supplied fittings are very strong as they have several rims molded in for strength between threaded and barbed end. The ID dimension drain is 1.5 and ID on return is 1. My return pump is 1.5 so I will step down at the entrance to tank.