Red Sea alk crusting

[Walts O]

Been dosing red sea alk and calcium the other day went to refill dosing container and noticed a crust forming on bottom of container. Is this normal will it clog dosing tube. Should I shake container every couple of days?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

The crust is inside the container in the liquid? Just the alk part, or both?

Alk parts are often close to the solubility limit and can easily precipitate if they get cool.

 

[Walts O]

The crust is inside the container in the liquid? Just the alk part, or both?

Alk parts are often close to the solubility limit and can easily precipitate if they get cool.

 

[Walts O]

The crust is only in the alkalinity container its forming at the bottom of the dosing container about an 1/8 of inch thick my container is round and the crust or solids are round take up the diameter of the container

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

You can warm it and see if it stays dissolved, or dilute it with ro/di and then dose more based on the dilution

 

[Ryan Rosales]

Not advisable to put Alk solution in a doser unless you have an automatic stirrer in it.
Get a rectangular lock&lock container punch 2 holes on the top lid opposite each other. One hole for the doser intake and for the air pump to keep the liquid agitated and stirred.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Not advisable to put Alk solution in a doser unless you have an automatic stirrer in it.
Get a rectangular lock&lock container punch 2 holes on the top lid opposite each other. One hole for the doser intake and for the air pump to keep the liquid agitated and stirred.

What? Why would you want to agitate it? It definitely is not normally needed for any reason.

An air pump seems an unusual choice as it would drive evaporation. That seems worse than nothing to me.

 

[dhof]

What? Why would you want to agitate it? It definitely is not normally needed for any reason.

An air pump seems an unusual choice as it would drive evaporation. That seems worse than nothing to me.

I have hard precipitate on the bottom of both my calcium and alk containers for dosing (and in my bottles I receive as well).

Warming it up and stirring definitely resolves it for a while but it happens again in a week.

I’m in the midst of a trial to see if a 1:1 dilution of each in my reservoirs with rodi is gonna help or not. I’m hopeful this dilution is the solution to keep them in solution :). I just dose twice the volume so the calculations are easy if u do 1:1 dilution w rodi.

 

[Ryan Rosales]

I was talking about the carbonate-baring component (supplement B). That one you cannot use a doser on.
Evaporation wise, it won’t evaporate since it’s covered.

 

[Ryan Rosales]

I have hard precipitate on the bottom of both my calcium and alk containers for dosing (and in my bottles I receive as well).

Warming it up and stirring definitely resolves it for a while but it happens again in a week.

I’m in the midst of a trial to see if a 1:1 dilution of each in my reservoirs with rodi is gonna help or not. I’m hopeful this dilution is the solution to keep them in solution :). I just dose twice the volume so the calculations are easy if u do 1:1 dilution w rodi.

Those will precipitate in bottles when they’ve sit too long. Just have to give them a hard shaking.
That is also the precise reason you have to keep it agitated if you’re gonna use a doser specially with the Supplement B (carbonate-bearing solution.

 

[Ryan Rosales]

I have hard precipitate on the bottom of both my calcium and alk containers for dosing (and in my bottles I receive as well).

Warming it up and stirring definitely resolves it for a while but it happens again in a week.

I’m in the midst of a trial to see if a 1:1 dilution of each in my reservoirs with rodi is gonna help or not. I’m hopeful this dilution is the solution to keep them in solution :). I just dose twice the volume so the calculations are easy if u do 1:1 dilution w rodi.

Those will precipitate in bottles when they’ve sit too long. Just have to give them a hard shaking.
That is also the precise reason you have to keep it agitated if you’re gonna use a doser specially with the Supplement B (carbonate-bearing solution).

 

[Ryan Rosales]

What? Why would you want to agitate it? It definitely is not normally needed for any reason.

An air pump seems an unusual choice as it would drive evaporation. That seems worse than nothing to me.

Then use a small pump if you want as long as it fits the container. Eventually it’s rotor will get stuck due to precipitated calcium deposits along the impeller housing.
I use an air pump with a corse air stone to agitate the solution since it’s a suspension type of mixture (supplement B). It’s meant to be shaken before use.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Are you serious?

First of all, if you are agitating the solution by bubbling air into it, the solution is evaporating into that new air, changing concentration, and is more likely to cause precipitation in the alk part as it concentrates. VERY BAD PLAN.

Second, many people use two part solutions via dosers without agitating them,. In fact, before your post, I have never heard (that I can recall, anyway, it's hard to remember hundreds of thousands of posts)of anyone who did agitate them.

It just is not necessary.

Where did you ever hear this was desirable?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Then use a small pump if you want as long as it fits the container. Eventually it’s rotor will get stuck due to precipitated calcium deposits along the impeller housing.
I use an air pump with a corse air stone to agitate the solution since it’s a suspension type of mixture (supplement B). It’s meant to be shaken before use.

Two part dosing methods are not suspensions but dissolved solutions, and I can't see how you would precipitate calcium carbonate on a pump in either part since there's no calcium in the alk part and no carbonate in the calcium part.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I have hard precipitate on the bottom of both my calcium and alk containers for dosing (and in my bottles I receive as well).

Warming it up and stirring definitely resolves it for a while but it happens again in a week.

I’m in the midst of a trial to see if a 1:1 dilution of each in my reservoirs with rodi is gonna help or not. I’m hopeful this dilution is the solution to keep them in solution :). I just dose twice the volume so the calculations are easy if u do 1:1 dilution w rodi.

That sounds good. Dilution should work if warming it works, but if not, it may not be a chemical you want anyway.

Some two parts (especially DIY) may have traces of precipitates in them. A little dust on the bottom can be ignored. More precipitate than that (assuming you didn't cross contaminate them) will redissolve with more dilution. :)

For example, the magnesium part of my DIY can have a little bit of precipitate that is probably calcium sulfate. The calcium comes as a contaminant in the magnesium part and the sulfate is there, obviously, from the magnesium sulfate. It is fine or not to dose the calcium sulfate solids, and it won't noticeably impact the tank.

Also, some types of calcium chloride (e.g., Prestone Driveway heat) have a little precipitate in them that is not the calcium chloride. Just ignore it.

 

[dbl]

I have been using the RS program for years. I dose all three foundations via a GHL doser. In fact, I also dose all four colors via a GHL slave doser. I have never stirred or aerated any of them. I shake them well prior to pouring them in the dosing containers, but that's it.

As to the foundation B, yes, I've had some "settlement" or "dust" build up on the bottom of the dosing container, but never anything serious and I simply have not worried about it. I just clean the containers out once a year or so whether they need it or not!

 

[redfishbluefish]

I know the OP talked about alk, but others have mentioned calc. I commented on a white precipitate in my Calc container back in 2015. It is the DIY version made with Prestone, and the mother container does not have this precipitate, only the dosing container, which is a closed plastic cereal container. I thought it potentially was from CO2, but Randy poo-poo'ed that idea. HERE's the 2015 post.

Dosing containers:

 

[reeferfoxx]

Dependant on the doser(ex: cheap doser) and taking some recommendation from certain retailers, it is possible if the affluent Alk line is submerged into tank water has a back siphon. This would mix tank water into the container. Is the alk line in the tank water?

My Jebao DP-4 ran fine for nearly a year. I took it offline for about 6 months and once back on, it started having back siphon issues and other issues that resulted it going to the trash.

None the less the alk solution has been sitting in the acrylic container for a few months now without precipitation, evaporation, agitation.

Btw im using Seachem fusion A and B. Its not red sea but its a higher concentration compared to BRS and more similar to ESV.

 

[reeferfoxx]

 

[Ryan Rosales]

Two part dosing methods are not suspensions but dissolved solutions, and I can't see how you would precipitate calcium carbonate on a pump in either part since there's no calcium in the alk part and no carbonate in the calcium part.

I think you’re going more into your theoretical.