Sandbed Algae Id? Black Sand

[tutmatt3]

Never knew we had an algae forum! Well here is my old thread, but I'll sum it up as well:
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/alright-alright-i-give-up-help-to-id-sandbed-algae.322887/

Essentially, I can't get rid of this, or properly ID it. Been some months now (before I had a tank leak, as well as in the new tank I transferred things to)

It's too difficult to get out the tank and 'test' with the hydrogen peroxide method, etc. If I try and remove it from the tank, it disintegrates. If I hit the whole sand-bed w/ turkey baster, it'll go from 80% coverage to clean for a few hours, then 20% coverage hours later, then 40% hours after. As if they just 're-attach' together on the bed. Also, when I hit it w/ the baster, it just dusts up into the water column. Does not ever stay clumped

Another interesting note - I hit the tank w/ baster with all motion stopped, and they appeared as 'slimy strings' all throughout the tank. Kind of like when SPS slime - that look, but just floating, and more transparent.

This is what I've done w/ no success thus far:

1) Diatoms? - Treated tank w/ yeast as per vivid aquariums video. 5+ days of proper dosing every other day
2) Algae fixed by peroxide? - 1ml of 3% peroxide per 10gallons, nothing to this stuff. That DID hit any bit of other algae (mainly hair types) in the tank, and there was nothing 'flowing in the wind' on the rocks during that period. 7x+ days, nothing
3) Cyano/Spirulina? - Tried Chemiclean, w/ UV off & Carbon out. Nope
4) Various snails - nada
5) Full tub of Rowa gfo - no. Phos was .03 (hanna ulr) always, and after gfo it hit <.01, so I pulled gfo
6) New RODI canisters/membrane
----
Things I have yet to explore with
• Lights off for 3x days
• Adding crabs / additional snails (last time I tossed in a bunch of ceriths, my wrasses went bananas. Not sure if some of their deaths could have escalated this issue?
• Suggestions??

Thanks again! looking forward to help w/ ID & possible treatment. This stuff drives me insane, and it's not helping convince me the joys of the hobby xD

 

[Bonfish]

It appears to me to be Cyanobacteria. I have red, brown, and green versions of this. I had to be really aggressive to get rid of it. Everyday I vaccumed the rocks and substrate with just the gravel vacuum hose. I did suck up some of my substrate but after about three weeks I was able to completely remove all of it for good.

The other option that has worked well for me was adding a diamond goby. He has kept the gravel churned and my substrate is always pristine. Unfortunately this does not help with rock work.

 

[nautical_nathaniel]

I agree that it looks and acts like cyano.

I got rid of mine with frequent (every three to four days) water changes with almost all the water I was taking out coming from siphoning my sand bed. Before changing out filter media, I would always blast my rocks with a powerhead or turkey baster to blow off all the cyano I could and then allow the siphon or filter media to catch it. I also limited feedings to once or twice a week and only fed what I felt like was the bare minimal. Your fish will hate you, but eventually you will start to stunt the growth of the cyano and it will go away.

I also used Seachem SeaGel to remove silicates in my tank but there's little proof that removing silicates actually does anything to cyano. Always use fresh filter media with every water change too, no rinse and repeat until the cyano is gone. Some folks also use a UV filter like you did, but again, no solid proof that it does much.

Those products that claim kill cyano can throw off your cycle and cause other issues; they're not worth it in my opinion and only ever seem to work once in a while.

 

[tutmatt3]

It appears to me to be Cyanobacteria. I have red, brown, and green versions of this. I had to be really aggressive to get rid of it. Everyday I vaccumed the rocks and substrate with just the gravel vacuum hose. I did suck up some of my substrate but after about three weeks I was able to completely remove all of it for good.

The other option that has worked well for me was adding a diamond goby. He has kept the gravel churned and my substrate is always pristine. Unfortunately this does not help with rock work.

Thanks for the input. Would do a goby, but my substrate is way too thick imo. And rock work is actually... really good. Maybe once a week hit it w/ the baster. This stuff only collectes on the sand. Annoying.

I agree that it looks and acts like cyano.

I got rid of mine with frequent (every three to four days) water changes with almost all the water I was taking out coming from siphoning my sand bed. Before changing out filter media, I would always blast my rocks with a powerhead or turkey baster to blow off all the cyano I could and then allow the siphon or filter media to catch it. I also limited feedings to once or twice a week and only fed what I felt like was the bare minimal. Your fish will hate you, but eventually you will start to stunt the growth of the cyano and it will go away.

I also used Seachem SeaGel to remove silicates in my tank but there's little proof that removing silicates actually does anything to cyano. Always use fresh filter media with every water change too, no rinse and repeat until the cyano is gone. Some folks also use a UV filter like you did, but again, no solid proof that it does much.

Those products that claim kill cyano can throw off your cycle and cause other issues; they're not worth it in my opinion and only ever seem to work once in a while.

Yeah I wasn't sure about Cyano & Silicates as well. I would have assumed one of the earlier methods, such as the chemiclean, woulda done something to cyano.

I know the peroxide actually irritated my fish quite a bit since after day 2 of doing it, I had an ich outbreak - so it's difficult to cut back on feedings while trying to build back my blue tangs immune system. Limiting frozen to 1x cube every other day for 7x fish in a 75gallon tank, and a few pieces of seaweed soaked in selcon everyday for all.

On my old tank before my transfer, this problem seemed to arise when I turned my UV OFF and forgot to turn it back on. It's been on this whole time (besides chemiclean treatment), so I'm not sure.

Blah

 

[tutmatt3]

Was able to siphon some out, and this is what it looks like. I also tried the 'paper towel siphon' method to test for Dinos - based off a thread I found here - but the water remained clean after filtering through a papertowel- so I'm going to ignore Dinos for the moment.
Levels of Nitrate are 1.5, and Phos are ~.04-.05

Going to try the peroxide test on this containers worth & see whats up, if it'll turn pink!

 

[Bonfish]

You could try to confirm if using microscopy. There are many photos online of cyano bacteria.

 

[Travis Stewart]

I hate the black sands consistency, might as well call it black rocks. It tends to hang on and catch algaes from my experience.

 

[tutmatt3]

Yeah I'll try and see if I can find anyone local with a microscope

And tell me about it I'm really annoyed with it as well. When I first put into the tank I was so excited but then there was such a drastic increase on the size of each pebble.... no idea how or why. Mainly the top layer that is

Dr. Tim got back to me suggesting that it might be a type of Dino, even though I did try the dyno test to filter through a paper towel into a cup and see if it would reform which it did not. The cyano test also did not produce red water or green collection of algae

Tim suggested I do a complete three day blackout with each of the three days dosing refresh and then on the 4th day to dose waste away for another 4 days

Before I keep tossing more and more and more products into this tank, I'm going to try a three day blackout without any products and see what happens. Since I'm not overly excited for blacks and anyway anymore, it would make more sense two use the money I would have spent on products trying to fix the issue and just get some white sand.

Some new LED diodes come in this weekend as well, so who knows, maybe the new Spectrum I'm about to introduce will make a big impact on getting rid of this as well. Ditching most of my warm white LEDs and also introducing a bunch of UV

 

[tutmatt3]

Funny enough, I seemed to have mis-tested to see if they were Dinos.

I did not shake the container PRIOR to pouring through the papertowel filter. Therefore I never broke up the algae to see if they could squeeze through the filter.
Well, since I'm currently doing blackout for 3x days, we'll see what happens afterwards, and I'll report back.

If they do come back, and if they fail the proper dino-test, I may try the microscope method.