Selling bottled pathogens? Is it feasible?

[cacas]

Hi everyone. I do have an ethically questionable idea that I have been thinking about for quite some time. What if someone sold 'bottled ich + velvet + brook + uronema' and sold it online? I know that this isn't really ethical nor moral, but it would be interesting to see all the 'anti QT' people trying it out. I have no qualms with choosing to do what is best for your system (that includes not QTing), but the absolute mental gymnastics people use to deny the merits of QT is exhausting. Selling a starter culture of marine pathogens would be a fascinating way to test the theories of the crowd who insist parasites aren't a real threat and that a diverse diet cures all ailments.

Regardless, is there anyone out there knowledgeable on these diseases and if it would be feasible to sell them in a bottled form? Of course, the ethical implications are not ideal, and this is purely a thought experiment.

 

[winxp_man]

This gave me a chuckle! I have a group message going with a family member and a couple of close friends and we are all aquarium guys.

One day we got laughing about putting things in each others tank. I then went in with the threat of, “I’m going to dose some diseases in one of your tanks.”

 

[Jamie814]

is there anyone out there knowledgeable on these diseases and if it would be feasible

Feasible as to if you can even culture and bottle them or Feasible if there is a market for this?


I don't see a market for this, but what do I know???

 

[cacas]

Feasible as to if you can even culture and bottle them or Feasible if there is a market for this?

I'm mostly interested in your first point, however people may be open to selling them at a loss too just to make an argument.

 

[keagan]

There's people already doing something similar by throwing all kinds of stuff right out of the ocean into their tanks, using unfiltered NSW, etc. @Paul B throws mud he takes out of the ocean in his tank and that would likely contain some amount of pathogens.

 

[winxp_man]

Feasible as to if you can even culture and bottle them or Feasible if there is a market for this?


I don't see a market for this, but what do I know???

I have watched ich survive down to 65* +- under a microscope for at least, if I’m recalling correctly, 6 hours on a pin drop of water and some fish slim. As long as there is water they will live for a bit for sure.

It’s getting fresh specimens. Once the fish are gone they don’t live long, or have the ability to reproduce.

 

[EnterName]

Just buy a fish from Petco, it should contain pretty much the same from what I have heard

 

[winxp_man]

There's people already doing something similar by throwing all kinds of stuff right out of the ocean into their tanks, using unfiltered NSW, etc. @Paul B throws mud he takes out of the ocean in his tank and that would likely contain some amount of pathogens.

That would only be speculation. It’s know if pathogens involve actual ich, velvet, uronema, brook. Basically the big four that the aquarium trade has to deal with. The other versions are internal parasites.

Then we have to deal with region where mud is pickup from. Salinity changes based upon water temp and such.

And what I do know is that shallow water pathogens will be more affected by timp changes vs deep seas pathogens. This includes the issues of the sun and what it does to the surface of shallow water. I will try to find the document showing this if I get time. And post it. But there are some ins and outs when it comes to pathogens from different locations.

 

[winxp_man]

Just buy a fish from Petco, it should contain pretty much the same from what I have heard

Have petcos near me with plenty of disease and one of the larger LFS’s near me will guarantee you diseases of all sorts.

 

[keagan]

That would only be speculation. It’s know if pathogens involve actual ich, velvet, uronema, brook. Basically the big four that the aquarium trade has to deal with. The other versions are internal parasites.

Then we have to deal with region where mud is pickup from. Salinity changes based upon water temp and such.

And what I do know is that shallow water pathogens will be more affected by timp changes vs deep seas pathogens. This includes the issues of the sun and what it does to the surface of shallow water. I will try to find the document showing this if I get time. And post it. But there are some ins and outs when it comes to pathogens from different locations.

I don't disagree with the majority of what you say. I will say the gulf stream brings water up here from tropical areas and we even get triggerfish in Halifax harbor now so it's not a 100% that no tropical pathogens would be found in northern waters during the summer. Also I don't know much about pathogens in fish but most intertidal organisms are better adapted to swings in temp and salinity than deep sea organisms.

 

[cacas]

Hmmm. Considering that uronema can live without a host, that might be easier to culture/collect. However ich, brook, and velvet cannot survive without hosts. I wonder if they could be frozen or something to make them viable for longer outside their host? I know that ich can live without a host for up to 6 weeks. Perhaps it could go into a dormant state? Idk im just spitballing take this with grain of salt. Waiting for someone knowledgeable about this to provide insight.

 

[KrisReef]

Please delete this post after you read it.

I have seen LFS that were attacked with pathogens by people who wanted to do damage (never did get a clear reason why these farmers or LFS owners were targeted) and it is interesting that the targets in this hypothetical are folks that don't QT.

The motivations and destructive nature we carry about with us, it is an interesting thing.

Check out the old Vibrant discussion threads for more ideas?

 

[cacas]

The motivations and destructive nature we carry about with us, it is an interesting thing.

You're completely right that this is idea is extremely morally questionable and doing this in reality would be awful. Which is why this is strictly just a weird hypothetical thought experiment. It’s definitely not something anyone should actually do, I'm just indulging a weird curiousity.

 

[KrisReef]

Carry on.

You're completely right that this is idea is extremely morally questionable and doing this in reality would be awful. Which is why this is strictly just a weird hypothetical thought experiment. It’s definitely not something anyone should actually do, I'm just indulging a weird curiousity.

Mind experiments can help us understand the universe better.