SPS and Leather coral?

[Yevoc]

Hello all,
Wondering what the current thoughts on keeping leather corals and SPS together? I've heard of the toxin issue however I've always had some leathers in my tanks.

Researching this. AKA Googling this I found articles detailing this. However noticed something else. Almost all the buzz around it was from 2010 to 2013. Filtering for this year it is almost like this ideal was forgotten.

Did this become accepted fact that no one questions any longer?

or

We never really considered this as factual and people moved on?

Also if you believe this as fact is this all leathers? It is a fairly large group.

 

[Marine Life]

Hello all,
Wondering what the current thoughts on keeping leather corals and SPS together? I've heard of the toxin issue however I've always had some leathers in my tanks.

Researching this. AKA Googling this I found articles detailing this. However noticed something else. Almost all the buzz around it was from 2010 to 2013. Filtering for this year it is almost like this ideal was forgotten.

Did this become accepted fact that no one questions any longer?

or

We never really considered this as factual and people moved on?

Also if you believe this as fact is this all leathers? It is a fairly large group.

I feel that as long as you keep a carbon media reactor in the tank and replace the media very often such a once a week or so. You should be good but be wary.

 

[jda]

Toxin issue is a myth from long ago. You will be fine.

The genesis goes back to probably a magazine article about how some "corals" play chemical warfare - I remember the article before even dial-up BBs (raise you hand if you know what a BB is?). "Corals" is a pretty broad term. There is no evidence that this happens in our tanks or that it is an issue at all. It was just easy to grasp onto when people failed like "bad salt," "neighbor sprayed for bugs," "something on my hands," "N or P too low" or some other hot topic of the day.

 

[jda]

The toxins are organics. Organics do not maintain form for long in a living ecosystem with bacteria, microfauna and filters all waiting for them. While I am not disputing that some "corals" do play toxic warfare, it seems that for them to have an effect, there has to be SO many and the tank so not-well-run for it to be an issue. If this were true, then you would have other problems and blaming the leather coral would be pretty dumb and foolish.

 

[kenchilada]

Toxin issue is a myth from long ago. You will be fine.

The genesis goes back to probably a magazine article about how some "corals" play chemical warfare - I remember the article before even dial-up BBs (raise you hand if you know what a BB is?). "Corals" is a pretty broad term. There is no evidence that this happens in our tanks or that it is an issue at all. It was just easy to grasp onto when people failed like "bad salt," "neighbor sprayed for bugs," "something on my hands," "N or P too low" or some other hot topic of the day.

I know what a BB is. :(

 

[DanConnor]

Yeah- with no good evidence either way, I decided to not worry about this. My display tank has mostly acroporas, but the connected frag tray contains large colonies of xeniids, sarcophytons and other leathers, zoanthids and mushrooms. The acros are growing well and have good color.

 

[uhgster1]

i have both in mine. I’ve noticed over the years that whichever is dominant tends to do better than the other. That sinularia near the bottom of the picture is a couple of years old and is growing super slow. I’ve seen them in other aquariums twice as large in half the time. I don’t think they appreciate the water conditions we make for SPS.

 

[Yevoc]

i have both in mine. I’ve noticed over the years that whichever is dominant tends to do better than the other. That sinularia near the bottom of the picture is a couple of years old and is growing super slow. I’ve seen them in other aquariums twice as large in half the time. I don’t think they appreciate the water conditions we make for SPS.

Yeah if my leather can survive 100x turn over and 300+ PAR I think it is allowed to stay. I am currently keeping a large chunk of it on the back side of my rock work as a fish hideout as it is larger than my SPS so far.

 

[FenrirAysen]

Necroing this thread because it was important for my finger leather Carl. He's been with me from the get go and the tank is a couple months old now but now i've covered it in Acropora frags and they seem pretty dang happy. I was worried maybe Carl was gonna hold their growth back but as long as I see good feeding responses and no RTN or STN i'm leaning towards not worrying about it. This thread definitely helped with that and i'll refer others to it as time goes on.

 

[pmanz]

Following along even though this thread is pretty old.

I’ve been dealing with some STN lately with a stylophora, monti-digi, and seriatopora that had previously been growing and am trying to narrow down the cause. It may be related to some recent instability after a nutrient spike that I’ve been working to bring back under control, but I also recently came across the possibility that my Fiji yellow leather could be releasing toxins.

For context, this is an SPS-dominant system with about ~200 gallons total water volume (180 gallon display). The leather is roughly 4–5" across. Nutrients are currently around NO3 ~15 ppm and PO4 ~0.05–0.06 ppm (the PO4 is maintained with lanthanum dosing). I did have a recent algae bloom while I was away that I’ve been cleaning up as well.

ICP testing came back normal, which makes things more confusing. Because of the STN, I started wondering if the leather could be contributing chemically and am debating whether to move it to a softy-only tank as a precaution.

Given the size of the system, it’s hard for me to imagine that a single leather of this size would be releasing enough toxins to cause major issues—but I suppose it’s possible.

Curious if anyone has seen a leather impact SPS in a larger system like this, or if I’m chasing the wrong problem.

 

[Reefer_Marc]

Following along even though this thread is pretty old.

I’ve been dealing with some STN lately with a stylophora, monti-digi, and seriatopora that had previously been growing and am trying to narrow down the cause. It may be related to some recent instability after a nutrient spike that I’ve been working to bring back under control, but I also recently came across the possibility that my Fiji yellow leather could be releasing toxins.

For context, this is an SPS-dominant system with about ~200 gallons total water volume (180 gallon display). The leather is roughly 4–5" across. Nutrients are currently around NO3 ~15 ppm and PO4 ~0.05–0.06 ppm (the PO4 is maintained with lanthanum dosing). I did have a recent algae bloom while I was away that I’ve been cleaning up as well.

ICP testing came back normal, which makes things more confusing. Because of the STN, I started wondering if the leather could be contributing chemically and am debating whether to move it to a softy-only tank as a precaution.

Given the size of the system, it’s hard for me to imagine that a single leather of this size would be releasing enough toxins to cause major issues—but I suppose it’s possible.

Curious if anyone has seen a leather impact SPS in a larger system like this, or if I’m chasing the wrong problem.

Not an expert at all, but i also have a leather and some SPS together. Its not quite as big a tank, about 110 gallons.
The leather is quite big though, see picture attached.
I have some SPS: stylophora, birdsnest, montipora and a pavona. Similar to your setup i guess.
The oldest SPS in the tank is the stylo, about 1.5 years old. The leather is 7 years in the system now.
I run carbon, changing it maybe every 3 months or so.
No problem so far with my SPS that i could attribute to the leather.

 

[pmanz]

Not an expert at all, but i also have a leather and some SPS together. Its not quite as big a tank, about 110 gallons.
The leather is quite big though, see picture attached.
I have some SPS: stylophora, birdsnest, montipora and a pavona. Similar to your setup i guess.
The oldest SPS in the tank is the stylo, about 1.5 years old. The leather is 7 years in the system now.
I run carbon, changing it maybe every 3 months or so.
No problem so far with my SPS that i could attribute to the leather.

Thanks - this is helpful. I'm thinking it might be the other issues I've been battling recently that are the real issue. Thinking I give things a bit more time before I move it.

 

[SnowIce]

Following this thread, interested to see what happens over time since I have a good population of softies and am adding more sps

 

[komachi253874]

I am a foreigner, and the following text is automatically translated, so it may sound awkward and contain inappropriate wording.

I'm not an expert, but I saw an article that made a very credible claim.

Leather corals are large and have a lot of mucus on their surface, which is a carbon source.

1. Excessive carbon emissions can lead to a carbon-nitrogen imbalance;

2. Excessive carbon emissions can cause a large proliferation of microorganisms, including both beneficial and harmful bacteria;

3. Pure LPS tanks without leather corals can also encounter this problem, especially since LPS tanks tend to feed once or twice a week, or even irregularly, rather than daily.

All three points can lead to an imbalance in the microbial ecosystem. This is why coral infections usually occur throughout the entire tank, while individual infections typically only occur in the first few days after newly purchased corals are introduced.

An imbalance in the microbial community can lead to abnormal nutrient cycling, or an excess of microbial community can cause the nutrient cycling to be too rapid, preventing corals from obtaining enough nutrients.

If most corals are in poor condition and leather corals are dominant in the system, the remaining corals are more likely to become unhealthy. However, I believe that the impact of leather corals is not significant when SPS corals dominate the system.