Substitute for Hanna Alkalinity Reagent

[jzw]

does anyone know of a bulk substitute for hanna's reagent? im sick of paying $9 per tiny bottle.

could this be?

https://www.chemworld.com/Total-Alk...MI1PCkuY2x7AIVRz6tBh23MgowEAQYCCABEgI6c_D_BwE

 

[vanpire]

That would be interesting to find out. I agree $9 for a tiny bottle does suck.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

It is not so simple. The exact dyes and the exact ratio will be important the way hanna does the test. I doubt you can effectively mimic it without knowing those things.

 

[LeftyReefer]

I had thought about trying to substitute the Red Sea Alk reagent before, but never got around to it.

Both the Hanna and Red Sea AlK test kits require adding 1ml of reagent with a 10 ml sample of tank water.... so the ratios are the same there.... both reagents appear to be the same orangish liquid.... both tests go from blue to green.... so I'm thinking maybe they are same/similar reagents?

Hanna is $9 for 25 tests.
The Red Sea is $18 for 75 tests.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I had thought about trying to substitute the Red Sea Alk reagent before, but never got around to it.

Both the Hanna and Red Sea AlK test kits require adding 1ml of reagent with a 10 ml sample of tank water.... so the ratios are the same there.... both reagents appear to be the same orangish liquid.... both tests go from blue to green.... so I'm thinking maybe they are same/similar reagents?

Hanna is $9 for 25 tests.
The Red Sea is $18 for 75 tests.

The Hanna does not do the test in the same way, and I think it is extremely unlikely the Red Sea has the exact same dyes at the exact same concentration and has the exact same amount of acid in each mL of titrant. You need all of those for it to be a substitute.

 

[Nathan Milender]

I think it's theoretically possible but likely not worth the effort of figuring it out. Also, the hanna reagent is finnicky. Once open it tends to lose accuracy after about a month so a small bottle makes sense. If I was testing so much that I was going through multiple bottles a month I would consider one of those auto testers.

 

[chipmunkofdoom2]

I doubt this will work. Traditional alkalinity tests work by adding an acid of a known concentration to a sample until it reaches a certain pH, around 4.5. With Red Sea, Salifert and other titration tests, the dye is used only so we can visibly see when the titration endpoint is reached. The pH change from adding the acid is really what allows us to know the alkalinity.

The Hanna alkalinity checker is completely different. You simply add a dye to the water and put the sample in the Checker. Because there is no acid added, the dye must have some other properties that cause it change colors ever so slightly at different alkalinity levels. Traditional dyes that change color at a certain pH likely will not work here.

 

[MERKEY]

Although I won't try this it is an interesting theory.

As long as you have a set number with a proper Hannah reagent. Then use the red sea liquid to get a number if the Hannah instrument will read it. Then you have a base line on the Hannah compared to red seas. At this point dont worry about the numbers matching or even close. Just continue stability at what ever number the red sea liquid gave you that corresponded with the Hannah number.

If you wanted to set a comparison you would have to take multiple tests with both reagent liquids at various levels of alkalinity to establish a pattern or connection between the 2 but if the red sea reagent reacts and works consistently with the Hannah instrument there is a possibility to get consistent readings and track them.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Although I won't try this it is an interesting theory.

As long as you have a set number with a proper Hannah reagent. Then use the red sea liquid to get a number if the Hannah instrumentwill read it. Then you have a base line on the Hannah compared to red seas. At this point dont worry about the numbers matching or even close. Just continue stability at what ever number the red sea liquid gave you that corresponded with the Hannah number.

If you wanted to set a comparison you would have to take multiple tests with both reagent liquids at various levels of alkalinity to establish a pattern or connection between the 2 but if the red sea reagent reacts amd works consistently with the Hannah instrument there is a possibility to get consistent readings and track them.

I don't disagree with that, but it would take a lot of effort to validate the approach.

 

[LeftyReefer]

Randy was right about the Red Sea reagent not working.
I tried it anyway and it didn't work at all.
Filled 2 Hanna vials with 10 ml tank water.
Ran them both through the Hanna checker.
Adding 1 ml of Hanna reagent to the one vial resulted in a 8.4 kh reading.
Adding 1 ml of the red sea reagent instead, resulted in a 0.0 reading.

This is why Randy is the expert and I'm not. Lol

 

[jzw]

ok science guys, what is the intended purpose of the product in the OP?

 

[Big E]

does anyone know of a bulk substitute for hanna's reagent? im sick of paying $9 per tiny bottle.

could this be?

https://www.chemworld.com/Total-Alk...MI1PCkuY2x7AIVRz6tBh23MgowEAQYCCABEgI6c_D_BwE

Unless you're needlessly testing your tank more than once a week......... $18 for 50 weeks of alk data is hardly an issue.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

ok science guys, what is the intended purpose of the product in the OP?

It is an indicator dye used in an alkalinity titration, such as standard method 2320-B:

" Alkalinity Indicator, Total, pH 4.6(pink) - 5.2(blue/green), APHA for Alkalinity, 2320-B - 500 mL "

It says it changes pink to blue green at pH 4.6-5.2.

It changes color in the wrong range for us. For seawater, it should be in the low 4's, like 4.2-4.3.


This pdf describes the exact method 2320-B:

http://www.colby.edu/reload/chemistry/CH331/CH331Limit/2320-Alkalinity.pdf

 

[chipmunkofdoom2]

ok science guys, what is the intended purpose of the product in the OP?

I described what this product is in a previous post, as well as why it's likely not a drop-in replacement for the Hanna reagent.

 

[Dan_P]

does anyone know of a bulk substitute for hanna's reagent? im sick of paying $9 per tiny bottle.

could this be?

https://www.chemworld.com/Total-Alk...MI1PCkuY2x7AIVRz6tBh23MgowEAQYCCABEgI6c_D_BwE

It is possible to run 5 mL in a Checker. That would double the number of tests per bottle.

 

[robbyg]

It is possible to run 5 mL in a Checker. That would double the number of tests per bottle.

No because that would be right around where the optical sensor is located.

 

[robbyg]

I think it's theoretically possible but likely not worth the effort of figuring it out. Also, the hanna reagent is finnicky. Once open it tends to lose accuracy after about a month so a small bottle makes sense. If I was testing so much that I was going through multiple bottles a month I would consider one of those auto testers.

Are you sure the top is sealed properly? If you did not pull off the foil seal completely then that will cause this problem. Turn the bottle upside down and squeeze the sides a bit. If you see a leak then the seal is not making proper contact.

 

[Dan_P]

No because that would be right around where the optical sensor is located.

Not if you raise the the vial and cover the protruding vial to avoid stray light from entering the device. It works. It is only useful for liquid reagents unless you have a mg balance for cutting the powder quantities in half.

 

[robbyg]

Not if you raise the the vial and cover the protruding vial to avoid stray light from entering the device. It works. It is only useful for liquid reagents unless you have a mg balance for cutting the powder quantities in half.

I guess that would work but it's more work than I am willing to handle and certainly not something I would do with the powdered reagents.

LOL I am just envisioning my wife coming home and seeing me trying to divide the powdered reagents on a piece of glass with a razor blade. "Honey it's not what you think it is, it's reagents for my tester".;Blackeye