Tang: White spots or flukes ? Next steps?

[Humblefish]

Thanks all; I should mention that the white spots on the fish are gone; I didn't do a fresh water dip, so will are not able to fully confirm ich vs flukes vs lympho. The odd discoloration around the face continues though, hard to take a picture as the fish is very spooky. It appears that the scales around the face are abraded or pitting. I am guess a bacterial infection or some intolerance to cuperamine? It's been near 18 days at therapeutic dose of copper, so I decided to do a couple of large water changes to clear the cuperamine out of the system, then did a dose of API genera cure to help with the possible bacterial infection - it has the same antibiotic as metroplex. This fish has been frustrating to qt; seems like whenever we are done with one ailment, another symptom presents itself

It's a vicious cycle. Parasites/worms feed upon a fish, which leaves behind tiny holes which are ripe for infection. Compounding the problem is copper (and other medications) are immunosuppressants, and that makes it much more difficult for the immune system to overcome infection. Dosing an antibiotic helps, but since that merely controls the population growth of bacteria in a fish long enough for its immune system to eliminate them... the immune system itself still has to be capable of delivering the knock out punch.

 

[tenurepro]

Ok guys, mid way through API general cure (~metro) treatment and no obvious improvement in facial spots... can I get the experts to confirm if I am dealing with a bacterial infection vs hlle? Hoping these pics will do, but I can also net the fish and take some closeups. They look like little tan blotches/pits, above and behind the fish's eyes. They are symmetrical (on both sides of the fish).

It's been 42 days in QT now. If it is hlle, then I don't think antibiotics will help and I should probably just introduce him to DT. If it is a bacterial infection, doesn't seem to be severe. Is it Better to try other antibiotics or should I just wait it out and hope it clears up.

Thanks all!

 

[Humblefish]

Are the other "marks" I see on him in pic #2 just spots on the glass?

 

[tenurepro]

Are the other "marks" I see on him in pic #2 just spots on the glass?

Yes - sorry dirty glass

 

[aykwm]

I dont think its good idea to stop treatment of antibiotics half way. In second picture I can see slight development of HLLE, id recommend continue treatment and make sure to provide vitamin enriched food and feed frequently as tangs have high metabolism and eat a lot. Cutting treatment halfway might cause bacteria to become resistive to antibiotic in case it exists.

 

[ngoodermuth]

I'm thinking HLLE too, but agree with aykwm. If he's not reacting poorly, it's usually best to finish out the treatment. Just like people taking amoxicillin.

 

[tenurepro]

Thanks for the confirmation of hlle; sorry about the confusion, I plan to continue antibiotic which is done in 2 days. The question is, do I follow it up with more rounds of antibiotic (if the spots on face are an infection) or I add him to display. My thoughts are, if it is hlle, then he will likely fair better in the display. Bigger tank, more food to eat, and cleaner water. My qt is small so I err on the side of underfeeding to maintain good water quality. Also if it is hlle, then antibiotics will not help anyways? Sounds reasonable?

 

[Humblefish]

I agree it is likely HLLE. What are you feeding him in QT? Have you tested for stray voltage in there? More info: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/hlle-head-lateral-line-erosion.259916/

Many times fish (especially tangs) develop HLLE in QT for a variety of reasons, including exposure to copper. But once the fish is placed in the DT and fed vitamin enriched foods, it usually clears up.

 

[tenurepro]

I agree it is likely HLLE. What are you feeding him in QT? Have you tested for stray voltage in there? More info: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/hlle-head-lateral-line-erosion.259916/

Many times fish (especially tangs) develop HLLE in QT for a variety of reasons, including exposure to copper. But once the fish is placed in the DT and fed vitamin enriched foods, it usually clears up.

Thanks H. That is 3 votes for HLLE 0 votes for bacterial infection.
I am feeding NLS pellets (large) and a bit of omega garlic flakes. I haven't checked for stray voltage. But hlle symptoms did develop mid way during cooper treatment.

Given the HLLE diagnosis, I will likely then move him to DT this weekend after round of antibiotic is done.

Thanks for the advice guys!

 

[4FordFamily]

I'm thinking HLLE too, but agree with aykwm. If he's not reacting poorly, it's usually best to finish out the treatment. Just like people taking amoxicillin.

X3. Stay the course.

May be hlle but won't hurt to continue treatment in case.

 

[tenurepro]

A quick update and thank you all for your help.
After getting a consensus that the tang was suffering from hlle, I transferred him to display after second round of API general cure (started because I thought hlle was an infection).
I added him via an acclimation box. He fit in really well with the other fish and started eating along with the pack. His colors have deepened and is gaining weight. His hlle is improving; it is almost gone from one side and most of the pits on the other side of his face have healed, except for the largest pit which you can see in the pics; hoping it will heal with some more time.

Thanks all for your help!