Triton Results, Mixed Results

[Clownfishy]

Just had my first Triton results and it has confirmed that even after nearly 2 years of trying to treat the phosphate leaching from my old live rocks, I still have a long way to go. Also detected some copper so will check all my magnets. Are the other elements something to worry about and overall, is this good/bad compared to other people's tests?
https://www.triton-lab.de/en/showroom/aquarium/auswertung-b/icp-oes/64195

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Are you dosing any trace elements? Zinc, copper and iron seem high.

Any metal parts in the tank water or RO/DI?

 

[Clownfishy]

Only dose kalkwasser, BIO Magnesium and occasional BIO Calcium. I use a lot of Rowaphos in an attempt to keep my phosphates down. I use RO/DI all the time and use Reef Crystals salt. Not sure where these would come from?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Do you have any float switches? hose clamps? rusting parts on pumps or in your hood? screw on the bottom somehow?

 

[Clownfishy]

No float switches or clamps. I run a bare bottom aquarium and don't see any screws. Could this be coming from the magnets on the pumps?

 

[rkpetersen]

I use a lot of Rowaphos in an attempt to keep my phosphates down.

I'm wondering if perhaps some of the soluble and/or finely suspended iron that RowaPhos gives off when fresh and used without rinsing (as per instructions) might have been circulating in your tank at the time you took the water sample.

Otherwise the combo of iron + zinc + copper does suggest corrosion happening somewhere. I had a return pump that was prematurely rusting giving me high levels of tin. The Triton result was the first I knew of it.

 

[Clownfishy]

I don't have a sump so the only thing in the aquarium are 3 Tunze 6095 (one of these is brand new and added after the water was tested) a Tunze 9012 skimmer and a cobalt hester. I wonder if the 2 old 6095's are rusting away somewhere where I can't see. The only other thing is if it is coming in via the piping into the house. Would RO/DI strip these elements out of the water

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Yes, a working RO/DI will remove them.

 

[Clownfishy]

@Randy Holmes-Farley , many thanks for that info as I thought it maybe corrosion in one of the pipes supplying water but if the RO/DI would strip this out, it has to be something in the aquarium. Could it be coming from Rowaphos as I cannot see any corrosion on the pumps?

Thanks for your help.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

@Randy Holmes-Farley , many thanks for that info as I thought it maybe corrosion in one of the pipes supplying water but if the RO/DI would strip this out, it has to be something in the aquarium. Could it be coming from Rowaphos as I cannot see any corrosion on the pumps?

Thanks for your help.

I don't think that is likely. Lots of people use Rowaphos and other brands of GFO without those issues.

 

[Clownfishy]

Ok many thanks, I will take a much closer look at the pumps and the cobalt heater as it cant see any other place where these elements would come from.
Will report back once I find it.

 

[Clownfishy]

To help try and pinpoint my high Zinc, copper and iron levels from my first Trition test (https://www.triton-lab.de/en/showroom/aquarium/auswertung-b/icp-oes/64195), I made up some new saltwater and sent that away for analysis -
https://www.triton-lab.de/en/showroom/aquarium/auswertung-b/icp-oes/64117/

It seems the Reef Crystal salt has very high levels of Barium, Zinc, Iron and low levels of Lithium. I am going to assume my RO/DI unit (1 x pre filter, 2 x carbon filters, 1 x ro and 2 x DI filters) with an output of zero TDS is stripping everything out of the water so these readings are correct and from the salt itself.

Questions -

• I know I have asked this before but can we assume zero TDS means everything is stripped out and/or what is passing through is so low, we can ignore any affect on our saltwater mix? Could Zinc and Iron be coming through from corroding pipes feeding into the RO/DI until that I cannot see?
• I am assuming these high Iron levels could be one of the causes that fuels my hair algae which I have continued to battle with (my phosphate are also too high 0.8 which I am addressing)?

• How damaging are high levels of Barium, Iron and Zinc?
• How damaging are low levels of Lithium

This second test certainly indicates the copper in my original test is coming from inside the aquarium somewhere so I need to find something there that is rusting away.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

To help try and pinpoint my high Zinc, copper and iron levels from my first Trition test (https://www.triton-lab.de/en/showroom/aquarium/auswertung-b/icp-oes/64195), I made up some new saltwater and sent that away for analysis -
https://www.triton-lab.de/en/showroom/aquarium/auswertung-b/icp-oes/64117/

It seems the Reef Crystal salt has very high levels of Barium, Zinc, Iron and low levels of Lithium. I am going to assume my RO/DI unit (1 x pre filter, 2 x carbon filters, 1 x ro and 2 x DI filters) with an output of zero TDS is stripping everything out of the water so these readings are correct and from the salt itself.

Questions -

• I know I have asked this before but can we assume zero TDS means everything is stripped out and/or what is passing through is so low, we can ignore any affect on our saltwater mix? Could Zinc and Iron be coming through from corroding pipes feeding into the RO/DI until that I cannot see?
• I am assuming these high Iron levels could be one of the causes that fuels my hair algae which I have continued to battle with (my phosphate are also too high 0.8 which I am addressing)?

• How damaging are high levels of Barium, Iron and Zinc?
• How damaging are low levels of Lithium

This second test certainly indicates the copper in my original test is coming from inside the aquarium somewhere so I need to find something there that is rusting away.

I've not seen evidence that RC is contaminated the way you suggest, and think it very unlikely unless a metal part fell into the salt bucket.. That zinc level is very high. Concerningly high.

Some folks contaminate their RO/DI after they make it, and clearly see elevated levels in that water. It is not from upstream corrosion. Float switches in the RO/DI have been an issue.

Lithium is not likely useful and has no demonstrated biological role. I would not personally add it.

The elevated barium is not, IMO, an issue.

 

[2una]

Got any brass fittings RO or tank side? that also will bring Zn & Cu
I found high Zn coming from my 2 tunze RO solenoids i used for gravity fed ato.
With the Ati icp kit you get a vial for RO test also,that would at least rule out which direction you need to be looking.

 

[Clownfishy]

Nothing in the RO water. I make it up in the morning and it drips straight into a food grade water container. When I have 20litres, I add the salt and heaters allow to mix of a few hours with a small pump. The contamination would happed in the few hours I'd mixing but can't see anything rusting on the pump and heaters. No ATO.
Could it be the Triton tests are not testing freshly made salt mix correctly as I all I did was mix as normal and that was the results?

Thanks for the comments and help.

 

[2una]

A ro test will rule out that your rodi unit is doing what you think it is, i've seen a few UK guys with zn making it thru the di & say they have 0 tds showing. With that salt test reading that high before hitting the tank that would be where i'd be starting to look 1st

 

[rkpetersen]

Nothing in the RO water. I make it up in the morning and it drips straight into a food grade water container. When I have 20litres, I add the salt and heaters allow to mix of a few hours with a small pump. The contamination would happed in the few hours I'd mixing but can't see anything rusting on the pump and heaters. No ATO.
Could it be the Triton tests are not testing freshly made salt mix correctly as I all I did was mix as normal and that was the results?

Thanks for the comments and help.

Any possibility that the contamination is from your hands? Does your work or another hobby result in metallic dust in your fingerprints or under your nails? A long shot, I know.

Also, the Triton results are generally pretty accurate, ime. I've sent freshly prepared salt water in on several occasions and the results can sometimes be eye-opening, although not typically as noticeably off as what your report indicates. The last time I tested fresh Reef Crystals water was July 2017. At that time Triton indicated an elevated lithium level of 478, and elevated manganese of 35. Everything else was normal. Zinc was 3, iron was 5.

 

[Clownfishy]

@2una that would indicate a zero TDS can be a false reading and something is coming through which is were I am leaning towards at the moment but I thought zero meant zero and the zinc started to be added after the make up water. I was careful when making up my saltwater mix I sent for testing and just ran the RO/DI water straight into a food grade container, added salt, heater and a mixing pump and then took the samples and sent them off in the post. Checked the pump and heaters I used to mix the salt for corrosion and there is no sign of anything.
So it is either something in the RO/DI unit itself, pipes pre RO/DI or the water itself but all of this would indicate it is getting through an RO unit and two DI resins which as mentioned, I didn't think this possibly.
As you say, an RO water test would rule the salt out. As the pipes to my RO/DI unit run behind a bath enclosure, I may need to prise off the wooden facing to the enclosure to see if there is any corrosion around the connectors or pipes. I have been putting this off as it is not going to come off easily making quite a mess and I have always assumed I can trust the RO/DI to strip out everything. Could zinc be coming from pipework or pipe fittings?

@rkpetersen I waswcareful that my hands never went into the water I mixed up for testing and I work at a keyboard all day so nothing I can pinpoint down to my hands adding it to the water that I can tell. It's funny you should mention hands because the Triton tests do say it could come from handwash so I have been ensuring I do not use any soap before putting my hands in the aquarium and as mentioned, ensured I did not put them in the salt mix I sent for testing.
Thanks for the info on your tests of Reef Crystals and by what Randy has mentioned, it should not be the salt so I am "assuming" I need to look from RO/DI unit to the source water.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

@2una that would indicate a zero TDS can be a false reading and something is coming through which is were I am leaning towards at the moment but I thought zero meant zero and the zinc started to be added after the make up water. .

It doesn't necessarily mean a false reading. It means ICP is much more sensitive than conductivity if 1 ppm TDS is the lowest level your conductivity device can read.

1 ppm TDS means about 1 ppm of total ions. 10 ug/L of zinc chloride would not show up at all.

BUT, ICP can readily detect levels of metals that are also not a problem. Even if the RO/DI has the same level of, sy, zinc, as the display tank, that does NOT necessarily mean the RO/DI is either a problem or the main source of that metal. If you only top off 1% daily, you are only adding 1/100th of the tank amount each day, which could easily be below the daily consumption.

 

[Clownfishy]

Hmmm, not sure where to go with this now. I have checked all my mixing equipment and there is no corrosion so if my saltmix has a zinc reading of 160 µg/l but the aquarium has a lower reading of 37 µg/l, to me the source is the saltmix. If the zinc is not coming from the water, then that leads to the salt itself.
The only thing that I can think of is that I only mix the salt for a few hours before I took the samples to be sent off for testing. Could it be that by mixing for the full 24 hours, some of these elements reduce out as they need this time to mix in correctly? Just checked the side of the salt bucket and there is nothing listing the minimum amount of time the salt should be mixed for.