Yet another dieing bird's nest

pseudorand · Oct 7, 2020

I know there are a million of these bird's nest dieing from bottom threads, but I've yet to find one with an convincing cause.

Usually it's low flow in the base of a large bird's nest. But I have a frag. It's got lots of flow, and no flow or lighting changes in the two weeks it's been in the tank. It looked great until yesterday.

I know, I know, water params (I'll test tonight). But it hasn't been water params in any of the other threads I've found.

Maybe I have some pest that didn't discover it until yesterday.

Miguel Negron · Oct 8, 2020

Hmm, defiantly bleaching from the bottom. I have heard some birdnest do better in lower placement and some higher. Also another thing to look for is your nutrients

pseudorand · Oct 8, 2020

Yes, but why was it fine for two weeks and suddenly went south? I would have guessed that water conditions would be gradual, not sudden.

djryan2000 · Oct 8, 2020

Miguel Negron said:
Hmm, defiantly bleaching from the bottom. I have heard some birdnest do better in lower placement and some higher. Also another thing to look for is your nutrients

Generally green wants lower light while pink likes higher.

Anubisxii · Oct 8, 2020

Mine died within a month, too much light. I thought oh sps hit it will 250 par and that was a no no. Looked great for a few weeks then polyps closed up and started bleaching.

djryan2000 · Oct 8, 2020

It looks to me like the tips are very rounded in your photo. I’ve heard that rounded tips are a sign of the birds nest going downhill, and sharp tips are a sign of health. Did they round out over the two weeks?

pseudorand · Oct 8, 2020

Anubisxii said:
Mine died within a month, too much light. I thought oh sps hit it will 250 par and that was a no no. Looked great for a few weeks then polyps closed up and started bleaching.

How do you know it was too much light?

pseudorand · Oct 8, 2020

djryan2000 said:
It looks to me like the tips are very rounded in your photo. I’ve heard that rounded tips are a sign of the birds nest going downhill, and sharp tips are a sign of health. Did they round out over the two weeks?

Nope. They've always looked like that. It spent 45 days in QT and the only difference i noticed was that sometimes the polyps wouldn't come out. They've been out all the time in the DT. Save the ones that now appear dead at the base, of course.

It's actually a pretty stark contrast. I was worried in QT when they were all retracted, but now I see that retracted is clearly different than missing all together.

pseudorand · Oct 8, 2020

So I did the water test and it may be my numbers. Alk was down to 7.4, cal to 350 and mag to 1200. They are usually 8.0/450/1400, and I had a dosing regiment that kept them pretty steady. Last week I noticed that alk had fallen to 7.6, so I upped my soda ash dose, but apparently not enough. Cal and mag had not fallen last week, but now they have.

Could 6 sps/lps frags really make that much difference in a 120g? Two weeks ago I added two favias, a duncan, a candy cane, a monti shelf and the bird's nest. But they're all tiny frags. My BRS two-part alk dose was only 10ml, and 0 cal because it never fell. I doubled my alk dose over the past week. That seems like a dramatic difference though.

I also didn't dose at all in QT and they all survived for 45 days. And my QT is only 39gal. Perhaps they grow more with more light, but shurely not enough to suck that much alk, ca and mag out of a 120g.

djryan2000 · Oct 8, 2020

pseudorand said:
Nope. They've always looked like that. It spent 45 days in QT and the only difference i noticed was that sometimes the polyps wouldn't come out. They've been out all the time in the DT. Save the ones that now appear dead at the base, of course.

It's actually a pretty stark contrast. I was worried in QT when they were all retracted, but now I see that retracted is clearly different than missing all together.

Welp, my hypothesis is out. I peaked at my birdsnest this morning and coincidentally the base is starting to turn white.. Hopefully
mine fares better than yours did.

PicassoClown04 · Oct 8, 2020

Uh oh.... I CANNOT understand what makes the difference between what makes a birdsnest live or die. I have a Birdsnest in my 20 gallon and I placed a large frag into my 45 gallon. Same water, perams, everything. The only difference is my 20 gallon is totally mixed reef and the 45 was SPS dominant. The frag in the 45 withered and died over the course of 2 weeks, while the colony in the 20 continues to grow at an incredible rate. Maybe they are just sensitive to other acros the way BTA are sensitive to other BTA? But I have the main colony growing so close to a garf bonsai that the two are touching. A serious mystery.

pseudorand · Oct 8, 2020

djryan2000 said:
Welp, my hypothesis is out. I peaked at my birdsnest this morning and coincidentally the base is starting to turn white.. Hopefully
mine fares better than yours did.

Mine isn't quite dead yet. I'm uping alk and such as quick as I dare.

WvAquatics · Oct 8, 2020

djryan2000 said:
Generally green wants lower light while pink likes higher.

I thought that was reversed. Pink low green higher I could be wrong

djryan2000 · Oct 8, 2020

pseudorand said:
Mine isn't quite dead yet. I'm uping alk and such as quick as I dare.

Best of luck - tell me how it goes!

djryan2000 · Oct 8, 2020

WvAquatics said:
I thought that was reversed. Pink low green higher I could be wrong

According to tidal gardens pink and bird of paradise likes higher light - here's a link: https://www.tidalgardens.com/stock-pink-birds-nest-seriatopora.html

In his video, he mentions yellow bird's nest preferring lower light, citing his experience and a study done on the genetic variation of bird's nest that is linked in the description. He does not mention green.

In this thread, someone mentions green liking lower light, but I'd say that's far from conclusive so I'm open to being wrong about the light requirements of green bird's nest.

Birds Nest Placement?

One thing I've always struggled with is coral placement. I know I can move power heads around and turn lights up/down as needed. But I'm more needing help with aesthetics. I don't want my tank to look like I just threw everything in there. Here's where I've put my BN. Up high due to my LPS...

www.reef2reef.com

Edit: This thread I linked is actually pretty mixed, with some people saying green in low light and some saying they have green at 500 PAR and it's doing wonderful.

WvAquatics · Oct 8, 2020

djryan2000 said:
According to tidal gardens pink and bird of paradise likes higher light - here's a link: https://www.tidalgardens.com/stock-pink-birds-nest-seriatopora.html

In his video, he mentions yellow bird's nest preferring lower light, citing his experience and a study done on the genetic variation of bird's nest that is linked in the description. He does not mention green.

In this thread, someone mentions green liking lower light, but I'd say that's far from conclusive so I'm open to being wrong about the light requirements of green bird's nest.

Birds Nest Placement?

One thing I've always struggled with is coral placement. I know I can move power heads around and turn lights up/down as needed. But I'm more needing help with aesthetics. I don't want my tank to look like I just threw everything in there. Here's where I've put my BN. Up high due to my LPS...

www.reef2reef.com

Edit: This thread I linked is actually pretty mixed, with some people saying green in low light and some saying they have green at 500 PAR and it's doing wonderful.

Yeah I must have heard tidal gardens wrong. I thought it was different but haven't had a chance to go back and listen. I watch all bird'snest info tidal gardens has. Wondering now if I have my enchanted forest bird'snest too high lol.

pseudorand · Oct 9, 2020

djryan2000 said:
According to tidal gardens pink and bird of paradise likes higher light - here's a link: https://www.tidalgardens.com/stock-pink-birds-nest-seriatopora.html

In his video, he mentions yellow bird's nest preferring lower light, citing his experience and a study done on the genetic variation of bird's nest that is linked in the description. He does not mention green.

In this thread, someone mentions green liking lower light, but I'd say that's far from conclusive so I'm open to being wrong about the light requirements of green bird's nest.

Birds Nest Placement?

One thing I've always struggled with is coral placement. I know I can move power heads around and turn lights up/down as needed. But I'm more needing help with aesthetics. I don't want my tank to look like I just threw everything in there. Here's where I've put my BN. Up high due to my LPS...

www.reef2reef.com

Edit: This thread I linked is actually pretty mixed, with some people saying green in low light and some saying they have green at 500 PAR and it's doing wonderful.

How do those of us who haven't yet "invested" in a PAR meter judge high and low light? I have a 120g with 4 Lumia 5.2 DIY lights (that's 100 cree LEDs of different spectrums). One of my 5 channels peaks at to 30% around midday, everything else is lower. I was assuming that was actually not terribly bright, at least compared to some SPS dominant system out there. It could be two little light as easily as too much.

NinjaTiLL · Oct 9, 2020

pseudorand said:
How do those of us who haven't yet "invested" in a PAR meter judge high and low light? I have a 120g with 4 Lumia 5.2 DIY lights (that's 100 cree LEDs of different spectrums). One of my 5 channels peaks at to 30% around midday, everything else is lower. I was assuming that was actually not terribly bright, at least compared to some SPS dominant system out there. It could be two little light as easily as too much.

Borrow a PAR meter. Your local reef club might have one. Our a local fellow refer like myself. BRS had $100 of PAR meter this week.

SPS2020 · Oct 9, 2020

pseudorand said:
How do those of us who haven't yet "invested" in a PAR meter judge high and low light? I have a 120g with 4 Lumia 5.2 DIY lights (that's 100 cree LEDs of different spectrums). One of my 5 channels peaks at to 30% around midday, everything else is lower. I was assuming that was actually not terribly bright, at least compared to some SPS dominant system out there. It could be two little light as easily as too much.

As above or rent from BRS for $69 per week.

djryan2000 · Oct 9, 2020

pseudorand said:
How do those of us who haven't yet "invested" in a PAR meter judge high and low light? I have a 120g with 4 Lumia 5.2 DIY lights (that's 100 cree LEDs of different spectrums). One of my 5 channels peaks at to 30% around midday, everything else is lower. I was assuming that was actually not terribly bright, at least compared to some SPS dominant system out there. It could be two little light as easily as too much.

The easiest way, as a couple others said, is
to rent a PAR meter.

There is an alternative though - and it’s what I did. BRS did an episode about my lights (ReefBreeder’s) and measured the PAR at different heights above the tank, various depths in the tank, and various power levels. I based my lights off of that, estimating that the top of my tank is high 200s. If someone online runs your lights and uses a PAR meter that’s always an option too, but it’s far less exact.