Mini cycle
- Thread starter alicia24
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Asking for the nth time... to what end?
There is absolutely nothing a photo, dead tank or thriving, has to do with what transpired here.
In any case,I suspect given your unanswered demands, that you ran her off pages ago.
we know the tank is safe even if the final pic is withheld for effect. There wasn’t any problem getting pics before
Bad updates are with zest, non updates means everything is fine that’s the routine for most who get tank tuning work. This is the #1 ammonia misread in my collection. This thread went down exactly like 150 others, by that am meaning the pic succession right to the end. The prediction for the system (will not crash, will run fine any day pictured) on page one held up to page ten, that’s the routine.
Nh4 panic persisted throughout, but with no ammonia testing ran on cycled display reefs this thread wouldn’t exist because the tank had no symptoms at any time of ammonia noncontrol. The entire thread title/body/ had only to do with an nh4 test kit that wasn’t a calibrated seneye, that’s literally every false ammonia alert thread on the site. That’s the pattern I find in all ammonia control concern threads.
this thread will be useful in showing others why we don’t test for ammonia when dealing with cycled rocks=waste four weeks of your life chasing red herrings.
It would have been nice to see if the water clarity and other details held the same throughout the thread. I’m assuming it sure did. If it didn’t, nine updates per second to show proof of bad would be in place without having to ask one time.
Bad updates are with zest, non updates means everything is fine that’s the routine for most who get tank tuning work. This is the #1 ammonia misread in my collection. This thread went down exactly like 150 others, by that am meaning the pic succession right to the end. The prediction for the system (will not crash, will run fine any day pictured) on page one held up to page ten, that’s the routine.
Nh4 panic persisted throughout, but with no ammonia testing ran on cycled display reefs this thread wouldn’t exist because the tank had no symptoms at any time of ammonia noncontrol. The entire thread title/body/ had only to do with an nh4 test kit that wasn’t a calibrated seneye, that’s literally every false ammonia alert thread on the site. That’s the pattern I find in all ammonia control concern threads.
this thread will be useful in showing others why we don’t test for ammonia when dealing with cycled rocks=waste four weeks of your life chasing red herrings.
It would have been nice to see if the water clarity and other details held the same throughout the thread. I’m assuming it sure did. If it didn’t, nine updates per second to show proof of bad would be in place without having to ask one time.
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I don't think creating a story to comply with your beliefs, despite evidence to the contrary is very community minded.
MnFish1
10K Club member
I'm confused - if I read the OP - this was a tank transfer in which the old sand was used - which I believe, in the past was frowned upon - and not recommended in 'new cycling science' - unless the sand was rinsed considerably. I completely believe the ammonia levels in the OP, and there is no magic with a Seneye. One could make the same measurements using a free ammonia calculator - which will always correlate to the total NH4 (and pH, temp, salinity)
exactly what was predicted went down, and it will be that way the next time as well.
Ammonia noncontrol has never been demonstrated in the presence of cured live rock in a normally-running reef tank
ammonia alert posts for display tanks are in reaction to an nh4 test reading, not a condition within the tank stopping normal running. That’s how it will go down next time as well.
At no time did ammonia exist uncontrolled here for days on end, we just have umpires that change rule sets to match the whims of the thread.
In one thread, sixty pounds of live rock eats up ammonia fast and portions of the test reading are seen as test noise
But on this thread, all the live rock can’t eat up sourceless ammonia and the test reading is highly accurate not one iota is noise or interfering compounds
No massive stores for unprocessed ammonia have ever been found in reef sand beds. Small trace amounts have been found, like small trace amounts that exist in our running and stocked reef tank water columns. The levels that trip up nh4 test kits we can see in searches.
The analysis of false ammonia alerts using updated rules remains consistent and apparently able to predict the behavior of these tanks fairly well/with pure luck/ time will tell.
Results compiled over ten years will tell.
There will never, ever ever be an actual symptom in the tank in any of these posts, it’ll always be a thread title about a test kit reading.
Any ammonia source that can overcome sixty pounds of cured live rock ammonia command has already been written about. We never found that cause here, for a reason. We did not find a definitive source for continual daily input of ammonia above what the cured rocks could handle in this thread.
Ammonia noncontrol has never been demonstrated in the presence of cured live rock in a normally-running reef tank
ammonia alert posts for display tanks are in reaction to an nh4 test reading, not a condition within the tank stopping normal running. That’s how it will go down next time as well.
At no time did ammonia exist uncontrolled here for days on end, we just have umpires that change rule sets to match the whims of the thread.
In one thread, sixty pounds of live rock eats up ammonia fast and portions of the test reading are seen as test noise
But on this thread, all the live rock can’t eat up sourceless ammonia and the test reading is highly accurate not one iota is noise or interfering compounds
No massive stores for unprocessed ammonia have ever been found in reef sand beds. Small trace amounts have been found, like small trace amounts that exist in our running and stocked reef tank water columns. The levels that trip up nh4 test kits we can see in searches.
The analysis of false ammonia alerts using updated rules remains consistent and apparently able to predict the behavior of these tanks fairly well/with pure luck/ time will tell.
Results compiled over ten years will tell.
There will never, ever ever be an actual symptom in the tank in any of these posts, it’ll always be a thread title about a test kit reading.
Any ammonia source that can overcome sixty pounds of cured live rock ammonia command has already been written about. We never found that cause here, for a reason. We did not find a definitive source for continual daily input of ammonia above what the cured rocks could handle in this thread.
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The OP was willing to play along until you exposed yourself as a zealot of your own opinion who is unwilling to concede error even in the face of basic fact and known science.
Like the other 150 times where you refused to believe verified tests. They are all misreads according to you, even verified Seneye reads that you attempt to classify as "error".
History shows that you wouldn't accept a Seneye readings showing ammonia either and would attempt to discredit them. Even Randy Holmes-Farley in this very forum recently pointed out your error in attempting to "calibrate" Seneye readings based on YOUR opinion and observations. You tried to pivot and wiggle there too. See below if your memory is short.
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alicia24
Active Member
The "final pic" is "withheld" because you insulted my inteligence multiple times. I appreciate all the people on here that did help me. However, I'm fully capable of conducting a hanna test. I am a nurse in real life so I would sure hope I can mix powder and liquid properly. I don't need to show proof via picture of the hanna result. You also said my fallow was going to fail which was completely uncalled for.
This thread also makes an incredibly convincing case for rinsing sand during 100% of tank transfers in the very least.
We wouldn’t be here if a rip clean was done mid-move, ammonia doesn’t emit uncontrollably from highly rinsed sand either.
regardless of the degree of subjective disagreement, in the end nobody debates this was a lot of thumb type calories spent cleaning up from an unrinsed tank transfer.
I always found it amazing how different sets of people discern different patterns and information all off the same material.
This thread was valuable as a cycle study in my opinion, it’s maybe the second or third one I’ve seen done with a hanna, new patterns will emerge from this group of cyclers over time.
The work I’ve seen here will go directly into helping others avoid exhausting cycle status debates: how to reef without owning an ammonia test kit.
readers will never be trapped by any degree of cycling doubt if patterns and outcomes noted within ammonia alert threads can be formed into effective training material.
We wouldn’t be here if a rip clean was done mid-move, ammonia doesn’t emit uncontrollably from highly rinsed sand either.
regardless of the degree of subjective disagreement, in the end nobody debates this was a lot of thumb type calories spent cleaning up from an unrinsed tank transfer.
I always found it amazing how different sets of people discern different patterns and information all off the same material.
This thread was valuable as a cycle study in my opinion, it’s maybe the second or third one I’ve seen done with a hanna, new patterns will emerge from this group of cyclers over time.
The work I’ve seen here will go directly into helping others avoid exhausting cycle status debates: how to reef without owning an ammonia test kit.
readers will never be trapped by any degree of cycling doubt if patterns and outcomes noted within ammonia alert threads can be formed into effective training material.
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MnFish1
10K Club member
Your posts ignore an important thing which is that the likelihood of a positive test 'meaning something' is independent of the underlying likelihood of that test meaning something. For example - if I take a totally normal functioning reef tank - and test ammonia, and its lets say 1 (with a normal pH, Temp and salinity), the likelihood that that value is accurate/means anything is much smaller than if a tank is having a problem (any problem). i.e. the predictive value of a positive test. Likewise, a tank thats doing terribly, with dying fish, etc - with an ammonia reading of '0' is also likely to be an error (predictive value of a negative test).
I personally didn't see any 'ammonia panic'. I also don't think this is breaking news - after all - there are many products out there that advertise adding fish and bacteria on day 1 with dry rock. I have done this and never had a reason/problem to check ammonia.
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Your proclivity to pivot and pretend you were right all along is palpable.
The rest of us indicated that the sand transfer was likely a driving factor in the mini cycle. Nice deflection.
(rhetorical) - Why insist on "sand washing" if there is no such thing as ammonia spike or "mini cycles"?
You continue to be defeated by your own rhetoric and contradictions. Why not walk away instead of digging a deeper hole?
Yes this thread will be useful, Brandon. It is one more example where you refuse to acknowledge that you are wrong even after being proven so. No amount of pivoting or word games changes that.
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