Need help with diagnosis

[Humblefish]

You shouldn't have a problem FW dipping clownfish, just follow my instructions below exactly:

Freshwater Dip: Provides temporary relief for Brooklynella, Flukes, Marine Velvet disease (Amyloodinium); possibly even Ich & Uronema marinum (both unproven). Can be used to confirm the presence of Flukes.

How To Treat - Fill a bucket with RODI water, and use a heater to match the temperature to the water the fish is coming from. Aerate the water heavily for at least 30 minutes prior to doing the dip, then discontinue aeration while performing the dip. Fish aren’t overly pH sensitive for short durations like this, but you can squirt a little tank water into the dip just before the fish goes in to help bring it up.

Place the fish in the freshwater (FW) dip and observe closely. It is not unusual for them to freak out a little at first. Also, tangs are notorious for “playing dead” during a FW dip. The important thing is to watch their gills; they should be breathing heavily at all times during the dip. If breathing slows, it’s time to exit the dip. Dip the fish for no longer than 5 minutes. Multiple dips may be done, but it’s important to give your fish a day to recuperate in-between dips.

For flukes, use a dark (preferably black) bucket so you can see if tiny white worms fall out of the fish (especially out of the gills) at around the 3-4 minute mark. The worms will settle to the bottom, so you can use a flashlight to look for them there as well.

Pros - Provides temporary relief for a wide range of diseases in a chemical free environment. Can “buy you more time” until a proper treatment can be done.

Cons/Side Effects - Not a permanent “fix” for any disease, as FW dips are not potent enough to eradicate all of the parasites/worms afflicting the fish. Some fish can have an adverse reaction to a FW dip by appearing unable to maintain their equilibrium once returned to the aquarium. If this happens, hold the fish upright (using latex, nitrile or rubber gloves), and gently glide him through the water (to get saltwater flowing through the gills again). It is also a good idea to place the fish in an acclimation box until he appears “normal”.

 

[Humblefish]

Look for tiny white worms falling out so we can confirm/rule out the presence of flukes once & for all. Also, observe closely post dip to see whether or not the scratching continues.

 

[eeyore357]

What do you suggest after the FW dip?

 

[Humblefish]

What do you suggest after the FW dip?

Continue with the copper for now. Then on Apr 2nd, transfer them to a different QT with non-medicated water. Do not drop the copper concentration beforehand.

 

[eeyore357]

The yellow tang has developed two more red spots this afternoon. I've read that brooklynella is notorious for causing secondary bacterial infections. I'm tempted to do a water change and run carbon. And use this tank for a formalin treatment. It would be this weekend before I could go get a new tank and filter and might end up fighting ammonia with a new tank.

 

[Humblefish]

The yellow tang has developed two more red spots this afternoon. I've read that brooklynella is notorious for causing secondary bacterial infections. I'm tempted to do a water change and run carbon. And use this tank for a formalin treatment. It would be this weekend before I could go get a new tank and filter and might end up fighting ammonia with a new tank.

Pretty much all parasitic infestations (ich, velvet, brook, uronema) can increase the chances of a secondary bacterial infection developing. You can dose antibiotics (ex. Furan-2, Kanaplex) in conjunction with copper. What I would do in your current situation is start administering 30-45 min formalin baths, while still treating with copper. That is a lot safer than dosing a QT with formalin.

 

[eeyore357]

Can I dose metroplex with copper? It did really well last time. Do you know the recommended dosage for 37% formaldehyde per gallon for a bath?

 

[eeyore357]

Also wondering if I could dip all three at the same time in 4gal of formalin SW with an airstone?

 

[Humblefish]

Can I dose metroplex with copper? It did really well last time. Do you know the recommended dosage for 37% formaldehyde per gallon for a bath?

You can safely mix metro with copper. The dosage rate for 37% formaldehyde is 150 ppm; I believe Formalin-MS (which contains 37% formaldehyde) advises to use 20 drops per gallon for the bath solution. Someone said they no longer include dosing droppers; just use an eye dropper from the drug store.

Also wondering if I could dip all three at the same time in 4gal of formalin SW with an airstone?

I would not because formalin quickly robs the water of available oxygen. There wouldn't be enough O2 for all 3. Do one at a time. You can reuse the bath solution though for all 3.

 

[eeyore357]

I ended up trying a long-term formalin bath at a rate of 2ml ever other day for 11 days. I didn't have any issues other than suppressed appetite for a few days. I wasn't able to do any dips during the long term bath. The clowns have started scratching again. I setup a 10gal yesterday. I was thinking about doing a formalin dip in a 3gal container with the tank water they are in now and transfer them to the 10gal after 45min. Then clean the entire 20gal system with vinegar and get it set back up. Do a dip again with the 10gal water and transfer back to the 20. I was thinking I could do this for a week. It would be like a TTM + dip every other day. This will kill my bio filter but..... What are your thoughts on this?

 

[Humblefish]

Dosing formalin directly into a QT for 11 days should have eradicated brook or even flukes. Your plan to give the clowns a 45 min bath, and then transfer them into a new, clean QT after each bath is a good one. I'm just not so sure anymore whatever is ailing your fish is something formalin will treat. Sorry to hear this has turned into such a fiasco.

 

[eeyore357]

I gave the clowns and the yellow tang a 40-45min formaldehyde SW bath (3ml in 3gal) and moved them directly to the 10gal. Everyone is still alive so that's a good thing. What would formaldehyde not treat? One of the unknowns?

 

[Humblefish]

Formalin treats brook and stubborn strains of flukes. It also provides temporary relief for velvet and possibly ich (in the gills).

 

[eeyore357]

Well I've changed my plans. One clown was scratching a little this morning and the tang has a ragged looking spot on it's fin. For the sake of MY mental health I've decided to do Maracyn and Maracyn 2 for 5 days and whatever happens, happens. I don't plan to do anymore meds or tank transfers. I hate to do it but I feel like I'm fighting a losing battle. I'll keep you updated if you want.

 

[4FordFamily]

Geez, what an adventure...

 

[eeyore357]

You're telling me.

 

[eeyore357]

I finished the 5 days of Maracyn meds. The fish started scratching during that time. Now one of the clowns has white stringy poop hanging off of it tonight.

 

[eeyore357]

Been feeding the fish metro and kanaplex for the past five days. This morning I am going to do a formalin dip and move to a new qt. Some medicated food with chloroquine should arrive this evening, so I will have that on hand. I've been working 14-16hrs a day this week so I haven't been able to observe the fish any. Hopefully next week I'll be able ro really watch them.

 

[eeyore357]

When I went in the room to do the dip one of the clowns was scratching. The dip went good and got everyone moved over to another tank. I plan on setting up another 20gal this weekend and splitting the clowns and yellow tang up. Going to try to feed everyone the chloroquine phosphate over the next few weeks. I figured it couldn't hurt and it's about the only medication I haven't tried.

 

[Humblefish]

When I went in the room to do the dip one of the clowns was scratching. The dip went good and got everyone moved over to another tank. I plan on setting up another 20gal this weekend and splitting the clowns and yellow tang up. Going to try to feed everyone the chloroquine phosphate over the next few weeks. I figured it couldn't hurt and it's about the only medication I haven't tried.

You'd be better off dosing CP into the water than trying to get fish to eat CP laced food. It's very bitter tasting.