2 Years Struggling - any advice?

[JamesFishes]

Hi all, I’m after some advice after 2 years of struggling to keep any coral alive. Apologies if too much information below but wanted to share as much as I could.

My parameters have been very stable for a long time and as below seem to be ok unless I’m missing something, I do a 10% weekly water change and my ICP test didn’t identify any problems but I struggle to keep any coral alive for long.

I’ve tried zoas, frogspawn, candy canes, palys, torches, favias, hammers and everything eventually dies off. Nothing dramatic just seems to deteriorate over time and shrinks until it’s gone. Other than my palys nothing has ever grown (that’s now GlT closed and shrinking) at best things survive for a while. I’ve had a Xenia for 2 years and it’s the same size as when I first put it in the tank!

I don’t constantly change anything and in the two years have only changed my light settings once - moving from AB+ to LPS template and my Neros from random to pulse (about 4 months ago).

My tank has plenty of Coraline algae on the rock. I don’t know what I’m doing wrong. Any advice on what could be the problem or what I could do?

Thank you in advance for any advice (even if it’s to find a new hobby!)

——
Tank
- 145 litre (38cm x 81cm x 55cm)

Parameters
- Magnesium 1357
- Alkalinity 8.4
- Calcium 443
- Phosphate 0.02
- Nitrate 10
- Ph 8.0
- Temp 25.8c
- Salinity 1.026

Fish/Clean Up
- 2x Clowns
- Timor Wrasse
- Bi-colour dwarf angel
- Bristle tooth tang
- Chalk Goby
- Cleaner shrimp
- Nassarius/ Mexican/ fake Mexican turbo snails
- 2x Emerald crab

Lights
- 1x Radion XR15
- LPS/Soft template
- 8 hours/ 35% intensity

Powerheads
- 2x AI Nero3
- Pulse mode, max 45%
- 2 secs on/off (2nd Nero3 same with 0.5 sec delay)

Other Equipment
- ATO
- Doser (ALK, CAL, MAG)
- Filter: Ocelllaris 850 canister

 

[BlueFynn_Ian]

Replying to get you bumped so hopefully someone has some better insight.

I've had tanks with much less stable parameters grow coral fantastically. My only thought is that the lighting schedule seems fairly short and the intensity is low. Any idea on your PAR readings?

Also, do you do any feeding specifically for corals?

 

[Tim'sReef]

If ICP test show all good parameters and based on the above I would check par readings as well.

 

[X-37B]

I would increase your intensity on the 15.
I run mine 12 hrs with a 1hr ramp up/ down.
35% scheduled intensity is rather weak.

Also the dwarf angel may be the problem. I have had to remove them in the past because they like to pick at corals causing stress.

 

[Pistondog]

I assume you use rodi?
Why 10% weekly water change? For nutrient reduction or trace replenishment?
Do you run carbon?

 

[Pistondog]

Hey just notic ed you are a new member. Welcome to reef2reef.
I do 1% daily awcs rather that 1 time per week. I think this provides more consistency.

 

[musel101]

Can you send a picture of your tank set up with the light on top of the tank?

 

[JDCagley]

I would increase your intensity on the 15.
I run mine 12 hrs with a 1hr ramp up/ down.
35% scheduled intensity is rather weak.

Also the dwarf angel may be the problem. I have had to remove them in the past because they like to pick at corals causing stress.

I would definitely get a PAR meter. When I first started my tank, I had no meter and was looking for a close idea to what settings to use on my 3x-xr30-G5's. I read and read and read some more. Settled on some BRS videos of height (8" above water - equally spaced across 72" tank). I found a few people mention intensities and ran with 67%! They had success....
I fried everythiing I put in the tank quickly except the softies at the bottom. Suspecting too much light, I slowly ramped them down to 32% over then next 4 months. I bought a PAR meter and found that at the now 32% (scheduled intensity at 100% - which btw I find a highly irritating setting to have), I was at 250-275 PAR at top of tank. Not bad for an eyeball. I would love to take a reading at 67% and see what it is, but I am now aclimating towards 40% and that put me in the 350+ range at the top. Buy a meter - it is pricey, but then you'll have it and anytime you get a coral - pick a spot you like, measure, and see if the light in that spot is "right" for it or not.
Plus, you will always be able to know if your lights are degrading over time and be able to adjust up as needed.

 

[JamesFishes]

Replying to get you bumped so hopefully someone has some better insight.

I've had tanks with much less stable parameters grow coral fantastically. My only thought is that the lighting schedule seems fairly short and the intensity is low. Any idea on your PAR readings?

Also, do you do any feeding specifically for corals?

I feed one block of frozen mysis

Replying to get you bumped so hopefully someone has some better insight.

I've had tanks with much less stable parameters grow coral fantastically. My only thought is that the lighting schedule seems fairly short and the intensity is low. Any idea on your PAR readings?

Also, do you do any feeding specifically for corals?

Hi and thanks for your help - I feed one block of frozen mysis each day, which all gets eaten but they slow down toward the end so think that’s the right amount. For corals I did target feed reefroids but wondered was that causing me an issue as they didn’t seem to react well, so stopped a few months ago.

 

[JamesFishes]

I would increase your intensity on the 15.
I run mine 12 hrs with a 1hr ramp up/ down.
35% scheduled intensity is rather weak.

Also the dwarf angel may be the problem. I have had to remove them in the past because they like to pick at corals causing stress.

Thank you, I don’t have a par meter but sounds like consistent advice for others too so I’ll get one and check. If I’m then changing my setting would you recommend sticking with the LPS/soft template or would you go back to AB+?

I’ve had the dwarf angel from very early on so he may be the problem, will be a shame to take him out but if he could be the problem then I’ll take him out. Will check par and keep and eye on him first.

Thank you for the advice, really appreciated.

 

[JamesFishes]

I assume you use rodi?
Why 10% weekly water change? For nutrient reduction or trace replenishment?
Do you run carbon?

I use RODI for the ATO and natural sea water from my LFS for my water changes. I do the water change weekly because the tank is small and I probably have too many fish for that size, and I hear of problems with canister filters so try and keep on top of the water so the phosphate and nitrate don’t get too high. But let me know if you think that’s too often or too much.

Yes I run carbon in the filter and change it once a month. Thanks for the reply

 

[Alexandru B]

1) Ok I had issues as well because I had some rocks that I think ware contaminated. But over the time it went good after like a year and half. The same ICP test could not identify anything.

2) Also you need more light I think. My lights are running in 2 channels I use viperspectra lights. Got them from amazon with $120
Blue 66% from 13:30 to 23
White and a some reds and greens 40% from 16 to 20
My sand bed par is @100-130 par and top I think around @300 par
So you need more light. Show us a picture with the system and lights.
Maybe there is somebody in your area that can borrow you the par meter. Or perhaps you can rent one from a fish store in your area.
Here in San Francisco we have a fish club and we have par meters and other equipments available for the members.

3) Another thing I am surprised your phosphate is so low. Mine is 0.12.
I also feed reef roids, Goni power, amino, and acropower once a week to my system.

4) Are you sure your angel, emerald crab, shrimp is not nipping or bothering the corals? I had an emerald crab nipping on them.

5) Wonder how your flow is. Would be good to see a video.

Here is how my system is.


Look how the corals are moving on the bottom and mid range and top. This is an 130 gallon tank. 6 feet long, I have 1 return pump that give retun water in 2 areas. Then I run a separet pump for the UV. I only have 1 wave maker that is an SOW - 20 jebaou on pulsating flow on the lowest setting.

Hopefully it helps. But I had issues in the biginning and it was related to the contaminated rock and light I think.

Also not even the gsp, toadstool or mushrooms are not surviving in your system?

 

[Alexandru B]

I use RODI for the ATO and natural sea water from my LFS for my water changes. I do the water change weekly because the tank is small and I probably have too many fish for that size, and I hear of problems with canister filters so try and keep on top of the water so the phosphate and nitrate don’t get too high. But let me know if you think that’s too often or too much.

Yes I run carbon in the filter and change it once a month. Thanks for the reply

I don't think to many fishes is the problem if they don't bother the corals. I see your nitrates and phosphates are low.

Talking about the water, you should check the TDS meter. Maybe their water is not good. The TDS meeter should be 0. Maybe the sea water is contaminated, but pretty sure the other reefers in the area would complain.

Maybe I would also try not to run carbon. I don't run carbon at all. Carbon is helping the water to be clean and take contaminates out of the water. But maybe takes something beneficial as well.

 

[nornicle]

Lighting sounds low, my tank took off when I was given some very mature live rock from a friends tank. At first I tried just caribsea liferock

 

[IslandLifeReef]

@JamesFishes, I agree with the others who suggest light is the issue. The fact they your corals seem to slowly deteriorate is a common sign of lack of light. While one XR15 over that tank can be enough light, running it at 35% capacity is probably slowly starving your corals.

 

[X-37B]

I would definitely get a PAR meter. When I first started my tank, I had no meter and

Thank you, I don’t have a par meter but sounds like consistent advice for others too so I’ll get one and check. If I’m then changing my setting would you recommend sticking with the LPS/soft template or would you go back to AB+?

I’ve had the dwarf angel from very early on so he may be the problem, will be a shame to take him out but if he could be the problem then I’ll take him out. Will check par and keep and eye on him first.

Thank you for the advice, really appreciated.

Is your xr15 a blue or pro. I run 4 blues on my 80g?

Please post a pic of your system so we can see what we are commenting on.

I woud try my settings as it took awhile to get the colors I wanted.
First 4 channels 100%
Last 4 channels 50%
Scheduled intensity 55%
Start at 40% scheduled and go up 5% every couple weeks and observe.
I started at 40% and see no reason to go above 55%. But thats without a par meter and on my system.

Carbon is ok as I run it 24/7 in all my systems.

This is my 20g nano cube.
1 cup rox arbon, gfo when needed.
I ran 10% WC a month so 2g's.
Also run 10% a month on all other systems.
My 20g at startup and at 8 months just before I took it down.
I have build thread on it from day 1 untill I took it down.

 

[Pistondog]

No sump or skimmer, maybe try to increase oxygenation with an airstone.
It is unusual for the usual suspects (xenia, gsp) not to grow even is lowish light.
Or try a salt mix.