Adding crabs and corals before cycle is done
- Thread starter Goose91
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Goose91
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Thankyou all for added input. All this info is greatly appreciated. Helps me plan and know what to look for as i live 2 hours from my nearest store, so insuring im not jumping the gun and taking the correct steps to head in the direction i want is key as emergency runs to the store are almost impossible for me lol.
But ya thanks for the help, you guys rock
But ya thanks for the help, you guys rock
mfinn
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So you said day 2 there was ammonia. Now is day 3?
Did the store sell you cured live rock?
Looks like "Real Reef" rock.
It's a brand of manufactured rock.
That is important to find out.
If they sold it as cured, how long has those pieces been in their system?
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Goose91
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Yes, yesterday i got an ammonia lvl reading of .25ppm, and yes today will be day 3.
And i will assume the rock is cured, as the tub was filled with over 100lbs of this live rock that i picked out, so again im assuming its been in there system quit a while. They had a few typs of live rock, all kept the same way, and also dry rock for sale. But i guess the best way to tell is if my ammonia lvls stay at zero than from what everyone is saying the cycle should been done, and i can start slowly stocking my tank.
mfinn
likes zoanthids
Now I'm understanding it.
Yeah, if the ammonia was just minor die off from being out of water a short time, the bacteria in the rock should recover fairly fast.
But I still wouldn't add anything until a ammonia test kit reads 0.
I've used API test kits and it does read 0 when the ammonia is all gone.
I’m so happy to have your descriptions along w those pics you are on page one of the large cycling thread just kicked up. Twenty thousand people are going to get an awesome update on pics + visual cycling verification, then reverification from your work
how to call a cycle complete once you know submersion history, associated life forms while in storage, pics showing eighteen years or better of coralline, and the classic .25 all stated clearly is shown here. I think you might be our 20th or 30th collected example between that and the sand rinse thread
how to call a cycle complete once you know submersion history, associated life forms while in storage, pics showing eighteen years or better of coralline, and the classic .25 all stated clearly is shown here. I think you might be our 20th or 30th collected example between that and the sand rinse thread
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DarrenCar
Active Member
I am new to the hobby myself so I wont have the technical jargon that you will get from others here. My issue with your explanation is that you are assuming its LIVE rock. Did the store you purchased it at specifically tell you its live rock? There are several rock products on the market that mimic the look of live rock but are in fact NOT live rock. Life rock or Real Reef rock are examples of this. I have experienced first hand LFS selling this type of product as live rock when in fact it was not.
There have been several posts here that claim with the API kits they give a reading of .25 ppm on ammonia when its really 0ppm. I have not experienced this but it is out there as a possibility. Maybe test some freshly made saltwater that isn't in the tank to get a true reading of 0ppm ammonia to confirm your test kit is accurate.
Other than that best wishes on your new setup. I just finished the cycle process myself and am beginning to shop for livestock.
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Goose91
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Thats a very valid point. Always a good idea to have a control test to make sure upur equipment is working properly!
But ya, as far as i know and am aware, the rock i bought is supposed to be live, it looks live, feels live (slimy and such) and it should be taking care of the ammonia without having to do the ammonia and bac doseing you do with dry rock. So im gonna keep testing to make sure my reef is behaving properly before i add any livestock.
Brett S
Valuable Member
For the most part if the rock comes wet then it’s pretty safe to assume that it is live rock. It takes extra time and effort and expense to keep the rock wet and transport it that way, so if it was dead rock they would just sell it dry
Some of the confusion comes from the fact that the term ‘live rock’ can mean different things to different people. Some people believe that only rock from the ocean or aqua cultured rock with algae and sponges and other life on it qualifies as live rock. Other people would say that if you take dead dry rock and put it in a cycled tank so it grows bacteria then it counts as live rock.
In either case such wet ‘live rock’ should be able to cycle a tank fairly quickly where as dry rock will take longer.
Island Reef 242
Active Member
From my experience, using live rock and NSW to start my system. You can add hermit crabs and some snails from day one. Add a little fish food to keep the crabs happy and don't have your lights on to high, to help prevent an algae bloom. Wait about a week to add a fish, and another week or so to add some hardy corals. This is because some things on the live rock may take longer to die off, giving little ammonia and nitrate spikes that may harm some fish or coral. Again this is just from my experience, every tank is different. One pice of advice I can give is "If you think your tank is ready for something, wait another week." Take your time, keep it simple, and learn meditation, it will help with patience.
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Goose91
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Yes, thats correct. Live rock just means that the bacteria to nitrify your ammonia has grown and living on the rock. Thats why when you start a tank with dry rock you have to first add ammonia and bacteria so that the bacteria can start to grow on your rock, thus making it 'live' rock. Which according to the cycles takes 30 days, and about a year to create a mature tank.
Starting with live rock basically gives you a head start thanks to that bacteria already being alive on it, and lets your tank reaching maturity a lot quicker allowing you to have more fish quicker because you have a well developed bacteria cultures that can handle the bio load (of course that all depends on the size of your tank for how big your bio load can be).
Brett S
Valuable Member
Again, I don’t think there’s really a hard and fast definition of exactly what live rock means. As I said above, some people wouldn’t consider it live rock unless it was rock from the ocean or aquacultured rock with actual sea life on it... things like sponges, algae, pods, etc. And just putting a bunch of dead rock into a tank and leaving it there for a while isn’t going to make those things magically appear on the rock.
But at the same time, if you have a tank full of aquacultured rock and put in a piece of dry rock then after a number of weeks and months all of those things will migrate onto the new rock too... essentially you’re aquaculturing your own rock.
But if you define live rock as rock that contains the bacteria necessary to keep the tank cycled and functional then the dry rock will become live rock as soon as the tank is cycled.
This is my favorite thread for cycling+ https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/the-supreme-guide-to-setting-up-a-saltwater-reef-aquarium.138750/ I like the pictures. Seems to me from my beginners perspective, you don't want to do anything until you hit the diatom stage at least. If you don't know what that is, it is worth understanding. At that point I assume you ammonia and nitrite is 0. My recommendation, given I can relate to what you are going through because I am about 30 days ahead of you, is to spend all your "tank anxiety" reading various threads and posts in R2R and beyond. Read all of the articles in the beginners section, search on first fish, coolest fish to watch, how to build a stocking plan, watch videos on fish, read about different types or corals, pumps, learn all about dry rock, live rock, dead live rock (or whatever other made up name people have), lighting, buildout threads, join some Facebook groups local to you . . . . . I am able to spend countless hours learning and wishing I would have done things different.
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Goose91
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Okay heres the update, i think we are into month 4 of the tank, i dropped critters in there 2 weeks after adding the live rock, never have had an issue, water parameters have always been good, no spike in ammonia, barely get a reading with phosphates too. So ya, i had defienetly bought cultured live rock, as there was no need to start a cycle.
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