Advice Needed on Quarantining Fish with Suspected Ich

[reefo420]

Hello fellow Reef2Reefers,
I'm seeking advice on a quarantine conundrum I'm currently facing with my fish, and I'd greatly appreciate your insights.
Main Tank Details: I have a Red Sea 425, I have coral in my main tank, my fish are h:
Bangai Cardinal
Porcupine Pufferfish (1.5 inches)
Flame Hawkfish (2 inches)
Foxface (3 inches)
Halichoeres iridis (Radiant Wrasse, 2.5 inches)
Peacock Wrasse (1.5 inches)
Kole Tang (2 inches)
Watchman Goby
Quarantine Tank: I also have a Juwel 125 liter (about 35 gallons) quarantine tank.
Issue at Hand: I've noticed my Porcupine Pufferfish showing two spots on its back fin. This appeared after a month in QT Copper power at 1.75 ppm(he was healthy with no spots) and then, three days in the display tank the dots showed. I'm currently running a 39w UVC Deltec sterilizer in my main tank in hopes of managing ich, but I'm still seeing occasional spots, mainly on the Pufferfish. The other fish, like the Radiant Wrasse, also show some signs, though it's not as clear,
And last time my fish were in late stage ice I nuked it with copper and lost 1500$+ worth of coral so I’m trying to approach this
In a smarter way
I've been debating on how best to manage this situation:
Should I quarantine all my fish?
Is my 35-gallon tank sufficient for all these fish for the duration of the quarantine, considering their sizes and needs?
Would it be advisable to get a large plastic container and set it up with an external filter to quarantine half of the fish?
Also, I'm curious if the UVC sterilizer is effective in this scenario, or if I need to consider a different approach for treating ich. I also have a cleaner shrimp and an urchin in my main tank would it still be considered fishless or what should i do

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hello fellow Reef2Reefers,
I'm seeking advice on a quarantine conundrum I'm currently facing with my fish, and I'd greatly appreciate your insights.
Main Tank Details: I have a Red Sea 425, I have coral in my main tank, my fish are h:
Bangai Cardinal
Porcupine Pufferfish (1.5 inches)
Flame Hawkfish (2 inches)
Foxface (3 inches)
Halichoeres iridis (Radiant Wrasse, 2.5 inches)
Peacock Wrasse (1.5 inches)
Kole Tang (2 inches)
Watchman Goby
Quarantine Tank: I also have a Juwel 125 liter (about 35 gallons) quarantine tank.
Issue at Hand: I've noticed my Porcupine Pufferfish showing two spots on its back fin. This appeared after a month in QT Copper power at 1.75 ppm(he was healthy with no spots) and then, three days in the display tank the dots showed. I'm currently running a 39w UVC Deltec sterilizer in my main tank in hopes of managing ich, but I'm still seeing occasional spots, mainly on the Pufferfish. The other fish, like the Radiant Wrasse, also show some signs, though it's not as clear,
And last time my fish were in late stage ice I nuked it with copper and lost 1500$+ worth of coral so I’m trying to approach this
In a smarter way
I've been debating on how best to manage this situation:
Should I quarantine all my fish?
Is my 35-gallon tank sufficient for all these fish for the duration of the quarantine, considering their sizes and needs?
Would it be advisable to get a large plastic container and set it up with an external filter to quarantine half of the fish?
Also, I'm curious if the UVC sterilizer is effective in this scenario, or if I need to consider a different approach for treating ich. I also have a cleaner shrimp and an urchin in my main tank would it still be considered fishless or what should i do

UV unit is good but works with free floating organisms and not what’s pre-existing
Quarantine will be effective and practical and will require at least 2.0 copper level to take effect
Please first before approaching treatments post a video and pics under white light intensity to clearly assess what you have going on

 

[Reef By Steele]

Lots of questions, let’s see what I can do to answer.
UV. Good to help avoid parasites but has to be run with very low flow for enough dwell time to kill parasite, faster flow helps to prevent algae.

Get a plastic tub or if in US buy a half price tank or two from Petsmart so you can use over and over. Plus really hard to observe fish top down. @Jay Hemdal gave me that piece of advice previously.

Urchin and shrimp will not host ich so no issue there.

Yes QT all fish as no point in QT if reintroduce to tank with ich.

While fallow be sure to really vacuum sand and move rocks etc to avoid any cysts lying dormant in an Oxygen deprived location as they can survive way longer than the fallow period of anaerobic.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I think the first course of action is to try and confirm for certain hat the fish have ich - are you 100% confident in your diagnosis? If not, you could try uploading photos and videos for us to see.

Jay

 

[Uncle99]

With a couple of “dots” I’d do nothing but watch to see if the infection spreads, however, I might prepare what I need to do QT if the circumstances warrant.

Ick does not always mean everyone is going to die.

I have a blue tang which has got ick three times in three years but after about 6 weeks, it just gets less and less, then nothing.

Keep them fed, and waters stable with least stress possible.

Maybe just a few grains of sand stuck.

 

[MnFish1]

I would not rely on UV anything to treat a disease

 

[reefo420]

hate the white light been on blue whole time but here are some good pictures

vetteguy53081 @Jay Hemdal @Reef By Steele here are some pictures​

also should i qt all of them in a 35 gallon? or should i buy like a tub run it with an external filter for 6 weeks, and have another 50 gallon in a tub with the other half of the fish while i keep the tank fallow for 6 weeks

 

[reefo420]

would this with a cannister filter be good as a 2nd qt tank it's like 25 gallons
ontop of the other 35 gallon that i can put the puffer, radiant wrasse, and foxface, and small kole tang
in this one i plan to put the peacock wrasse, goby, hawkfish
would that be good enough while i keep the tank free of fish?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

hate the white light been on blue whole time but here are some good pictures

vetteguy53081 @Jay Hemdal @Reef By Steele here are some pictures​

also should i qt all of them in a 35 gallon? or should i buy like a tub run it with an external filter for 6 weeks, and have another 50 gallon in a tub with the other half of the fish while i keep the tank fallow for 6 weeks

The spots on the porcupine look too large to be ich (unless the porc is really tiny, tough to judge). Do you see salt grain sized white spots on any fish? If not, you might want to watch the porc to see if the spots change in numbers and location over a few days. If the same big spots are in the same location after, say 3 days, they aren't ich (the fish could also still have ich, but these spots wouldn't be that).

Jay

 

[reefo420]

The spots on the porcupine look too large to be ich (unless the porc is really tiny, tough to judge). Do you see salt grain sized white spots on any fish? If not, you might want to watch the porc to see if the spots change in numbers and location over a few days. If the same big spots are in the same location after, say 3 days, they aren't ich (the fish could also still have ich, but these spots wouldn't be that).

Jay

In the past three days, one spot disappeared and then two new ones appeared. Currently, the situation is as shown in the photos. The tang occasionally gets small spots, but they usually go away within a day or two. The porcupine is the only one showing these spots, it's a small porcupine are around 1.5 iches. The only unusual behavior I've noticed is from the large radiant wrasse, which seems to be scratching itself in the sand. If the spots aren't ich, could they be flukes or something else that requires a different treatment? Another strange thing is that one of my clownfish died in the sump after living there for a year. I've isolated the other clownfish, but I've never noticed any spots on them, even under white light.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

In the past three days, one spot disappeared and then two new ones appeared. Currently, the situation is as shown in the photos. The tang occasionally gets small spots, but they usually go away within a day or two. The porcupine is the only one showing these spots, it's a small porcupine are around 1.5 iches. The only unusual behavior I've noticed is from the large radiant wrasse, which seems to be scratching itself in the sand. If the spots aren't ich, could they be flukes or something else that requires a different treatment? Another strange thing is that one of my clownfish died in the sump after living there for a year. I've isolated the other clownfish, but I've never noticed any spots on them, even under white light.

Flukes don't cause distinct white spots like this, more just a general skin cloudiness with scratching.

For treating both ich and flukes at the same time, you could try hyposalinity (in the absence of invertebrates).

Hyposalinity

Hyposalinity Jay Hemdal 2021 This term refers to a long-term bath treatment for marine fishes in which the salt content of the water is lowered and held below the point that certain parasites can survive. The salt level reached, and the time of the treatment are the two variables...

www.reef2reef.com

Jay

 

[MnFish1]

The spots on the porcupine look too large to be ich (unless the porc is really tiny, tough to judge). Do you see salt grain sized white spots on any fish? If not, you might want to watch the porc to see if the spots change in numbers and location over a few days. If the same big spots are in the same location after, say 3 days, they aren't ich (the fish could also still have ich, but these spots wouldn't be that).

Jay

If not ich - to me it looks like lymphocystis. A viral infection that is self-limited - any other symptoms

 

[reefo420]

Flukes don't cause distinct white spots like this, more just a general skin cloudiness with scratching.

For treating both ich and flukes at the same time, you could try hyposalinity (in the absence of invertebrates).

Hyposalinity

Hyposalinity Jay Hemdal 2021 This term refers to a long-term bath treatment for marine fishes in which the salt content of the water is lowered and held below the point that certain parasites can survive. The salt level reached, and the time of the treatment are the two variables...

www.reef2reef.com

Jay

i don't have any other tank i can put my coral in so i'm thinking of taking all the fish out to 2 sepeare tanks to QT, would 6 weeks with frequent water changes and copper dosing be sufficent while they're out of the tank? i don't want to cause my problems than there already are so im not too sure on whwat to do

 

[reefo420]

If not ich - to me it looks like lymphocystis. A viral infection that is self-limited - any other symptoms

No other symtomps on the puffer it eats loads/no heavy breathing, when it was in quarantine it had 0 spots in copper, for a good 3 weeks then i added it back in 4 days ago and one showed up, then disappeared, then another 2 on the fins, none are visible anywhere else, she hits rocks alot but i don't think it'c caused these white spots, all other fish don't show a single white spot, but one of the wrasses keeps flashing(going in sand and kind of itching) and he seems irritated, so i'm trying to find a way to treat this without losing all the fish or all of the corals

 

[Jay Hemdal]

i don't have any other tank i can put my coral in so i'm thinking of taking all the fish out to 2 sepeare tanks to QT, would 6 weeks with frequent water changes and copper dosing be sufficent while they're out of the tank? i don't want to cause my problems than there already are so im not too sure on whwat to do

You will need to manage the ammonia in the QT. One way to do this is to move filter media over from your DT. That works, but you should not use calcium based media if you are going to use copper. You might need to use "bacteria in a bottle" products like Dr. Tim's to help manage the ammonia to keep it below 0.5 ppm.

Another option would be to move all the fish out to two new tanks and then run them at hyposalinity. That helps with ich or flukes at the same time.


Jay