Another All for Reef dosing question...

[MDReefguy]

Hi all, have read almost every thread on here on AFR, my tank is about 5 months old and I started dosing about 3 weeks ago. Not sure what I should do next with my dosing. I started with about half the recommended dose for my 75 gallon, and then upped it slowly, but stopped at 12ml a day divided up into 8 doses, 1.5ml each dose, which is still below the starting amount. Kamoer doser that I calibrated.

Corals have gotten big and puffy for the most part, but my parameters seem a little weird, or they aren't reacting how I thought they would. Also my starter SPS corals don't look as polyp-y.

I use IO basic salt, usually mixes around 10dkh.

Normal parameters have been:
Nitrate 5-10
Phosphate .06-.1
Alk Low 7's
Calcium 400-420
Mag Hadn't tested until today
ph 8.0-8.2

I added a few fish right when I started dosing, and now I'm sitting constantly at:
Nitrate Sub 5
Phosphate .03
Alk 10
Calcium 360-380
Mag 1260
ph 8.4

I tried upping the dose to get to 450ish Calcium, but by the time it got to 400 Alk was creeping towards 11. Also it seems to be having the mild carbon dosing effect mentioned, as Nitrate and Phosphate are dropping with more fish and more food.

I was thinking of just dosing Balling Part A and bringing the calcium up, but any other suggestions? I really didn't think Alk would climb this far this fast.

Thanks in advance!

MD Reefer

 

[UMALUM]

Hi all, have read almost every thread on here on AFR, my tank is about 5 months old and I started dosing about 3 weeks ago. Not sure what I should do next with my dosing. I started with about half the recommended dose for my 75 gallon, and then upped it slowly, but stopped at 12ml a day divided up into 8 doses, 1.5ml each dose, which is still below the starting amount. Kamoer doser that I calibrated.

Corals have gotten big and puffy for the most part, but my parameters seem a little weird, or they aren't reacting how I thought they would. Also my starter SPS corals don't look as polyp-y.

I use IO basic salt, usually mixes around 10dkh.

Normal parameters have been:
Nitrate 5-10
Phosphate .06-.1
Alk Low 7's
Calcium 400-420
Mag Hadn't tested until today
ph 8.0-8.2

I added a few fish right when I started dosing, and now I'm sitting constantly at:
Nitrate Sub 5
Phosphate .03
Alk 10
Calcium 360-380
Mag 1260
ph 8.4

I tried upping the dose to get to 450ish Calcium, but by the time it got to 400 Alk was creeping towards 11. Also it seems to be having the mild carbon dosing effect mentioned, as Nitrate and Phosphate are dropping with more fish and more food.

I was thinking of just dosing Balling Part A and bringing the calcium up, but any other suggestions? I really didn't think Alk would climb this far this fast.

Thanks in advance!

MD Reefer

What's are you running your salinity at?

 

[MDReefguy]

What's are you running your salinity at?

1.025

 

[UMALUM]

1.025

Weird, water change schedule?

 

[MDReefguy]

10% every 2 weeks

 

[MDReefguy]

Hanna alk tester. Salifert CA and Mag

 

[UMALUM]

Hanna alk tester. Salifert CA and Mag

I would stop the AFR and see if you can balance it out with a couple good water changes. Let's see who else chimes in.

 

[Hooz]

Ok....

Stop the water changes for a bit to let nutrients creep up. If you're doing every 2 weeks, let it go for an extra week or two and see where you're at.

Put your All for Reef dosing back to where it maintains a consistent Alk (usually somewhere around 8). Not creeping up or down. Just steady.

Once you get your Alk steady, then adjust Calcium and Magnesium (and even Alkalinity if you need to) to where you want them using some other components.

I use the Red Sea Foundation Elements for two reasons:

1. It's a 3-part, so you can adjust alk/cal/mag separately.

2. You can get small bottles, so you don't invest a lot in something you'll rarely use.

All for Reef does a pretty awesome job of MAINTAINING levels, but it's not so great at raising them, especially if you only need to bump one of the "big 3".

 

[Salty_Northerner]

Hi all, have read almost every thread on here on AFR, my tank is about 5 months old and I started dosing about 3 weeks ago. Not sure what I should do next with my dosing. I started with about half the recommended dose for my 75 gallon, and then upped it slowly, but stopped at 12ml a day divided up into 8 doses, 1.5ml each dose, which is still below the starting amount. Kamoer doser that I calibrated.

Corals have gotten big and puffy for the most part, but my parameters seem a little weird, or they aren't reacting how I thought they would. Also my starter SPS corals don't look as polyp-y.

I use IO basic salt, usually mixes around 10dkh.

Normal parameters have been:
Nitrate 5-10
Phosphate .06-.1
Alk Low 7's
Calcium 400-420
Mag Hadn't tested until today
ph 8.0-8.2

I added a few fish right when I started dosing, and now I'm sitting constantly at:
Nitrate Sub 5
Phosphate .03
Alk 10
Calcium 360-380
Mag 1260
ph 8.4

I tried upping the dose to get to 450ish Calcium, but by the time it got to 400 Alk was creeping towards 11. Also it seems to be having the mild carbon dosing effect mentioned, as Nitrate and Phosphate are dropping with more fish and more food.

I was thinking of just dosing Balling Part A and bringing the calcium up, but any other suggestions? I really didn't think Alk would climb this far this fast.

Thanks in advance!

MD Reefer

 

[Pistondog]

If you find alk is constant a 7.5 and you target 8.5, throw in a teaspoon of baking soda rather than changing afr dose. This will raise alk and should keep it steady.

 

[UMALUM]

Ok....

Stop the water changes for a bit to let nutrients creep up. If you're doing every 2 weeks, let it go for an extra week or two and see where you're at.

Put your All for Reef dosing back to where it maintains a consistent Alk (usually somewhere around 8). Not creeping up or down. Just steady.

Once you get your Alk steady, then adjust Calcium and Magnesium (and even Alkalinity if you need to) to where you want them using some other components.

I use the Red Sea Foundation Elements for two reasons:

1. It's a 3-part, so you can adjust alk/cal/mag separately.

2. You can get small bottles, so you don't invest a lot in something you'll rarely use.

All for Reef does a pretty awesome job of MAINTAINING levels, but it's not so great at raising them, especially if you only need to bump one of the "big 3".

How does any of this address the issue at hand?

 

[Hooz]

How does any of this address the issue at hand?

It addresses his low nutrient concerns, his All for Reef dosing concerns and his low calcium concerns. Pretty much all of the concerns listed in the OP.

What parts didn't you understand?

 

[UMALUM]

It addresses his low nutrient concerns, his All for Reef dosing concerns and his low calcium concerns. Pretty much all of the concerns listed in the OP.

What parts didn't you understand?

As I understood it his concerns were why is the AFR dropping his nutrients, causing Alk to spike and calcium to decrease. His water change regiment is already at a bare minimum with a lower grade salt. I thought that's what we were trying to figure out?

 

[Salty_Northerner]

The tank is pretty young like mine. I also sparing use AFR and also watch my nutrients. I was adding calcium nitrate and Neophos for weeks and suddenly bam! Nutrients took off. The op didn't mention if he used live or dry rock. Maybe it's a case the system could be sucking up the nutrients?

I've found AFR has minimal affect to the tanks nutrients but then again I'm just dosing once a week since I've stopped doing WC's (dinos and diatoms) and the corals could use some trace elements which has been working out in my favor. As for cal and alk I'll dose ESV 2 part. Cheap and it works till the system settles itself out.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Hi all, have read almost every thread on here on AFR, my tank is about 5 months old and I started dosing about 3 weeks ago. Not sure what I should do next with my dosing. I started with about half the recommended dose for my 75 gallon, and then upped it slowly, but stopped at 12ml a day divided up into 8 doses, 1.5ml each dose, which is still below the starting amount. Kamoer doser that I calibrated.

Corals have gotten big and puffy for the most part, but my parameters seem a little weird, or they aren't reacting how I thought they would. Also my starter SPS corals don't look as polyp-y.

I use IO basic salt, usually mixes around 10dkh.

Normal parameters have been:
Nitrate 5-10
Phosphate .06-.1
Alk Low 7's
Calcium 400-420
Mag Hadn't tested until today
ph 8.0-8.2

I added a few fish right when I started dosing, and now I'm sitting constantly at:
Nitrate Sub 5
Phosphate .03
Alk 10
Calcium 360-380
Mag 1260
ph 8.4

I tried upping the dose to get to 450ish Calcium, but by the time it got to 400 Alk was creeping towards 11. Also it seems to be having the mild carbon dosing effect mentioned, as Nitrate and Phosphate are dropping with more fish and more food.

I was thinking of just dosing Balling Part A and bringing the calcium up, but any other suggestions? I really didn't think Alk would climb this far this fast.

Thanks in advance!

MD Reefer

You cannot use a balanced additive to make substantial calcium boosts. Alk will always get too high.

I don’t know if your calcium was actually low, or test error, but if it is, calcium chloride is the product to use to boost it.

 

[MDReefguy]

Thanks all, think I'm going to use a combo approach here, dial down AFR to just a few mLs a day, give it a little extra time til the next water change, and do a slightly larger one there to try and balance out parameters. I'm shooting for an 8.5 alk, so I'll just work towards that with AFR, followed by testing weekly and adding Calcium Chloride if needed to get me back above 400. Slow and steady it is!

 

[Hooz]

As I understood it his concerns were why is the AFR dropping his nutrients, causing Alk to spike and calcium to decrease. His water change regiment is already at a bare minimum with a lower grade salt. I thought that's what we were trying to figure out?

Water changes are generally used as the primary export of excess nutrients. If there are no excess nutrients to export, then there is no "bare minimum regiment". Don't do a water change until you need to do a water change, then only change enough to maintain your target parameters. Some people don't ever do water changes, some do them daily. There is no hard and fast rule.

The Alk spike came from dosing more AFR in an effort to raise calcium. AFR is a single dosing compound that contains a "balanced" level of Alk/Cal/Mag, If you up your dosing to increase one, you increase them all. That brings me back to my last comments... AFR is good at maintaining levels of Alk/Cal/Mag, Proper use would be to adjust dosing until your levels remain steady (most people use Alk as the easy indicator). Once AFR is MAINTAINING the levels, then you test the "big 3" and adjust them to where you would actually like them to be.

You can dose any of the popular Alk/Cal/Mag additives that you like. I just recommended Red Sea because of convenience. Unless you have a large tank and need to make big adjustments, this is a pretty cost effective way to go.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Water changes are generally used as the primary export of excess nutrients. If there are no excess nutrients to export, then there is no "bare minimum regiment". Don't do a water change until you need to do a water change, then only change enough to maintain your target parameters. Some people don't ever do water changes, some do them daily. There is no hard and fast rule.

The Alk spike came from dosing more AFR in an effort to raise calcium. AFR is a single dosing compound that contains a "balanced" level of Alk/Cal/Mag, If you up your dosing to increase one, you increase them all. That brings me back to my last comments... AFR is good at maintaining levels of Alk/Cal/Mag, Proper use would be to adjust dosing until your levels remain steady (most people use Alk as the easy indicator). Once AFR is MAINTAINING the levels, then you test the "big 3" and adjust them to where you would actually like them to be.

You can dose any of the popular Alk/Cal/Mag additives that you like. I just recommended Red Sea because of convenience. Unless you have a large tank and need to make big adjustments, this is a pretty cost effective way to go.

FWIW, I do not consider water changes a very good way to export nutrients and do not recommend them primarily for that purpose.

I recommend them to export organics and other accumulating materials that you do not have better alternatives to deal with, and to continually pull all ions back toward a desirable level if they may drift up or down.,

 

[areefer01]

Ok....

Stop the water changes for a bit to let nutrients creep up. If you're doing every 2 weeks, let it go for an extra week or two and see where you're at.

Put your All for Reef dosing back to where it maintains a consistent Alk (usually somewhere around 8). Not creeping up or down. Just steady.

Once you get your Alk steady, then adjust Calcium and Magnesium (and even Alkalinity if you need to) to where you want them using some other components.

I use the Red Sea Foundation Elements for two reasons:

1. It's a 3-part, so you can adjust alk/cal/mag separately.

2. You can get small bottles, so you don't invest a lot in something you'll rarely use.

All for Reef does a pretty awesome job of MAINTAINING levels, but it's not so great at raising them, especially if you only need to bump one of the "big 3".

You are sort of using the product wrong. Note the application & dosing instructions. It notes at the beginning to adjust your systems calcium, alkalinity, and magnesium to your desired levels. Use whatever 2 part or single components to adjust to desired values. Then follow their dosage guidelines. Then the flow chart to adjust.

Your display is new. Have you run a series of tests daily or every other day, or twice a week for a couple weeks to see what your consumption rate(s) are? You need to understand what that is before anything else. It very well could be that a water change alone is enough.

 

[UMALUM]

FWIW, I do not consider water changes a very good way to export nutrients and do not recommend them primarily for that purpose.

I recommend them to export organics and other accumulating materials that you do not have better alternatives to deal with, and to continually pull all ions back toward a desirable level if they may drift up or down.,

Thank you