Auto empty a skimmer cup.

[BornHandy]

My skimmer will be too short to drain out of my sump unless I either drill a specific drain (I can, but would rather not), or put the skimmer on a stand.

I was thinking of some sort of skimmer cup pump. Has anyone ever done this?

 

[Brett S]

It’s not exactly what you’re looking to do, but my skimmer cup drains into a skimmate locker from avast marine, and inside that skimmate locker I have a Neptune PMUP utility pump. The skimmate locker has a high level sensor, so my Apex knows when it’s full and when that happens the Apex turns the PMUP on for about 30 seconds to drain the skimmate through a tube that goes up inside my wall, through my attic and down into my laundry washing machine drain.

I have my Apex configured so that it can’t drain the skimmate locker twice in an 8 hour period. If the skimmate locker gets filled again in less than 8 hours since the last time it was drained the Apex shuts off the skimmer and sends me an alert. That way if something happens and the skimmer starts going crazy and dumping water into the cup then I don’t have to worry about draining too much water from the tank and affecting the salinity when the ATO replaces it with freshwater.

I’ve had this system running for more than a year and I’ve never cleaned the skimmate locker or the PMUP and it’s still working great.

(On a side note, I just got a Trident and I ran the waste line from the trident into the skimmer locker as well so that way the waste from the trident will get pumped up and into the drain along with the skimmate)

So all that said, I think it’s certainly something you could do, but I feel like it might be a little hard to find a pump that would fit inside your skimmer cup. I did also consider using a perastalic dosing pump to empty my skimmate locker, but I was a bit worried that the tube might get clogged with chunky skimmate. However, in your case that would have the advantage of just needing a tube in the skimmer cup and not a whole pump, so it might be something to consider.

 

[ctenophore]

I’ve used a peristaltic pump to move sludge directly from a skimmer cup to a drain successfully. The pump inside the locker is a good idea too. Brett, would you mind posting your 8hr limit code that you use?

 

[Brett S]

No problem. The program for the outlet that controls the PMUP that empties the skimmate looks like this:

SKM_Empty:
Set OFF
If Skm_h OPEN Then ON
Min Time 000:30 Then ON
Min Time 480:00 Then OFF

Skm_h is the high level sensor in the skimmate locker. The first min time command will run the PMUP for 30 seconds whenever it is triggered. This is enough to empty the container without letting the pump run dry, and the second min time means that it can’t retrigger for 8 hours (480 minutes)

Then I have another virtual outlet configured like this:

SKM_H_Delay
Set OFF
If Skm_h OPEN Then ON
Defer 000:15 Then ON

That will turn on if the high level sensor in the skimmate locker has been open for more than 15 seconds. I have the apex configured to alert me if this outlet comes on.

If things are operating normally once the Skm_h sensor triggers the PMUP will turn on and empty the container and it will do so in less than 15 seconds, so that virtual outlet never turns on. However, since the PMUP can’t be turned on for 8 hours from the last time it ran then if there is a case where the skimmer refills the container in less than 8 hours then the PMUP won’t drain it, the high level sensor will stay on for more than 15 seconds, the SKM_H_Delay virtual outlet will turn on and I will get an alert. This will also turn off the skimmer.

 

[ctenophore]

That's really clever. I like it. Good way to auto empty waste, yet prevent mindlessly draining a runaway skimmer. Thanks for the details!

 

[Brett S]

That's really clever. I like it. Good way to auto empty waste, yet prevent mindlessly draining a runaway skimmer. Thanks for the details!

Thanks:). It’s been working pretty well for me. Within the last couple of weeks I’ve also started monitoring to make sure that the container is getting emptied regularly. Like many I often put off cleaning or checking my skimmer for too long and it will get dirty and it might slow way down or stop producing skimmate.

If the skimmer is operating normally it will fill the reservoir in about 20 hours. So I set up an alert to let me know if the reservoir hasn’t been emptied within the last 24 hours, since that could indicate that the skimmer needs to be cleaned or something is wrong. To do this I set up two virtual outlets:

SKM_12:

Set OFF
If Output Skim_Empty = ON Then ON
Defer 720:00 Then OFF

SKM_24:

Set OFF
If Output Skm_12 = ON Then ON
Defer 720:00 Then OFF

SKM_12 will be on as long as the skimmate has been emptied within the last 12 hours and SKM_24 will be on as long as it’s been emptied within the last 24 hours.

SKM_12 turns on when the skimmate reservoir is emptied and won’t turn off for 12 hours (720 minutes). SKM_24 turns on when SKM_12 turns on and won’t turn off for 12 hours after SKM_12 goes off, for a total of 24 hours. Then I have an alert configured to let me know if SKM_24 ever gets turned off.

I had to do it with two virtual outlets because the Defer command has a limit of 999 minutes, which is less than the 24 hours that I wanted.

 

[blitzkragz]

If the skimmer is operating normally it will fill the reservoir in about 20 hours.

Holy cow, you fill up a 5 gallon bucket in 20 hours?

I love your idea on the pump and skimmer shutoff/alert if it trips twice within 8 hours. I was thinking of doing something similar, except putting an electronic ball valve on the skimmate bucket that would open for 5 minutes and flow to a floor drain when the high level sensor tripped. Thank you for posting the code for this though!

 

[Brett S]

Holy cow, you fill up a 5 gallon bucket in 20 hours?

I love your idea on the pump and skimmer shutoff/alert if it trips twice within 8 hours. I was thinking of doing something similar, except putting an electronic ball valve on the skimmate bucket that would open for 5 minutes and flow to a floor drain when the high level sensor tripped. Thank you for posting the code for this though!

Hahaha, no, I have the medium sized acrylic skimmate locker. It holds a bit less than a gallon. Additionally the sensor triggers before it gets all the way to the top and I don’t drain it all the way down because I don’t want the pump to go dry. I think it’s more like half a gallon in 20 hours.

 

[Brett S]

I love your idea on the pump and skimmer shutoff/alert if it trips twice within 8 hours. I was thinking of doing something similar, except putting an electronic ball valve on the skimmate bucket that would open for 5 minutes and flow to a floor drain when the high level sensor tripped. Thank you for posting the code for this though!

That’s a great idea too and a good way to monitor it to make sure that the skimmer isn’t going nuts and draining your tank. Unfortunately I don’t have a floor drain near my tank so I need to pump the water into the drain anyway, but even if I had the option to just drain the skimmer into a drain I would always worry that the skimmer might overflow and drain too much water.

I suspect you could still my code for that with a little modification.

 

[CDavmd]

I ran RO tubing from my skimmer cup through my floor down to my basement. I initially had it sump into a 5 gallon bucket. It had an optical sensor that would warn me when it was full and also shut down down the skimmer. I also added a flow meter that would shut down the skimmer and warn me if the flow was too high indicating a run away skimmer.

I got rid of the bucket and plumbed the line into a pvc pipe that drains my water softener waste outside. I put a one way valve on it so but can’t back up.

Between this and my skimmer neck cleaner I never have to open the skimmer. If I want to clean the skimmer neck more thoroughly I cause it to over flow and basically autowash the skimmer

 

[TexasReefer31]

It’s not exactly what you’re looking to do, but my skimmer cup drains into a skimmate locker from avast marine, and inside that skimmate locker I have a Neptune PMUP utility pump. The skimmate locker has a high level sensor, so my Apex knows when it’s full and when that happens the Apex turns the PMUP on for about 30 seconds to drain the skimmate through a tube that goes up inside my wall, through my attic and down into my laundry washing machine drain.

Sorry to revive an old post. I am researching* the reef hobby hard coming from large freshwater. Automating a reef tank is also part of the fun and reading this is very inspiring for the biggest concern of mine during long work trips. The other half of the household is another reason for wanting to automate it, as she doesn't want to maintain the tank. My question is, how far do is this run? Would you advise pumping this into the trip under a bathroom sink? The tank will be on a wall with a bathroom behind and was planning to run the RODI there and it'd be simple to have 1 hole. Thanks for the input and inspiration.

 

[Brett S]

Sorry to revive an old post. I am researching* the reef hobby hard coming from large freshwater. Automating a reef tank is also part of the fun and reading this is very inspiring for the biggest concern of mine during long work trips. The other half of the household is another reason for wanting to automate it, as she doesn't want to maintain the tank. My question is, how far do is this run? Would you advise pumping this into the trip under a bathroom sink? The tank will be on a wall with a bathroom behind and was planning to run the RODI there and it'd be simple to have 1 hole. Thanks for the input and inspiration.

Sorry about the late reply to this. Life has been a little crazy lately and I haven’t had time to be on the forum much. In any case, if you’re still looking for this info, my run is probably a good 50 feet by the time it goes up the wall, then across to the laundry room and back down into the drain. It’s been working perfectly for me for more than a year.