Brook? Help me ID this illness

[hondacbr600rr]

I originally thought I was battling an ich outbreak in my display tank, but now I’m trying to determine if it might actually be something else.

No signs of fish swimming into powerheads, so I’m not sure if that helps rule out Velvet or not.

The trigger is what has me now wondering if maybe this is a sign of Brook, however this has been going on for about a week now, and I thought Brook normally killed fish in 24-48 hours.

Any help is appreciated. Not sure I can catch all the fish and QT at once, so I’m hopeful I can treat in the DT.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

I originally thought I was battling an ich outbreak in my display tank, but now I’m trying to determine if it might actually be something else.

No signs of fish swimming into powerheads, so I’m not sure if that helps rule out Velvet or not.

The trigger is what has me now wondering if maybe this is a sign of Brook, however this has been going on for about a week now, and I thought Brook normally killed fish in 24-48 hours.

Any help is appreciated. Not sure I can catch all the fish and QT at once, so I’m hopeful I can treat in the DT.

That’s advanced ich, Cryptocaryon. As this disease advances it starts to look different and give different symptoms.

I’m afraid this is past the point of being able to treat this in the DT. You’re going to need to set something up to get all of the fish into coppersafe at 2.5 ppm, or hyposalinity at 1.009.

 

[hondacbr600rr]

I originally thought I was battling an ich outbreak in my display tank, but now I’m trying to determine if it might actually be something else.

No signs of fish swimming into powerheads, so I’m not sure if that helps rule out Velvet or not.

The trigger is what has me now wondering if maybe this is a sign of Brook, however this has been going on for about a week now, and I thought Brook normally killed fish in 24-48 hours.

Any help is appreciated. Not sure I can catch all the fish and QT at once, so I’m hopeful I can treat in the DT.

That’s advanced ich, Cryptocaryon. As this disease advances it starts to look different and give different symptoms.

I’m afraid this is past the point of being able to treat this in the DT. You’re going to need to set something up to get all of the fish into coppersafe at 2.5 ppm, or hyposalinity at 1.009.

I appreciate the prompt response.

At least I know what I’m dealing with.

Catching the fish will be fun, but I can make it work. I was back and forth on going fallow again, but it seems like this is the only way.

 

[hondacbr600rr]

@Jay Hemdal , another question.

When Ich gets this bad, does it normally continue to snowball? I have many fish that show no signs of anything, I’m just wondering how urgent it is to get all fish into QT vs the ones showing visible symptoms. Ultimately trying not to overload the QT system’s filtration if I can move the sickest looking fish first, and slowly move the rest over as I build out my QT holding system better.

 

[vetteguy53081]

@Jay Hemdal , another question.

When Ich gets this bad, does it normally continue to snowball? I have many fish that show no signs of anything, I’m just wondering how urgent it is to get all fish into QT vs the ones showing visible symptoms. Ultimately trying not to overload the QT system’s filtration if I can move the sickest looking fish first, and slowly move the rest over as I build out my QT holding system better.

This needs treatment ASAP. You will need to place fish in Quarantine tank and treat with Coppersafe or Copper Power at therapeutic level 2.25 for a FULL 30 days (do not interrupt this 30 day period) monitored with a Hanna Brand copper test kit- No API brand. Also monitor Ammonia levels while in quarantine with a reliable test kit and add aeration during treatment using an air stone. All other fish in with it should also be removed as they have also been exposed to the parasites and placed in quarantine tank.
The display tank will have to be kept fishless (FALLOW) for 6-8 weeks to assure the existing parasites go through their life cycle without a host fish and die off. Inverts and coral can remain in the display (not treatment) tank during fallow period.
A quarantine tank can be as simple as a tank from a second hand store, a Rubbermaid type tub or a starter kit from Walmart which most of the needed essentials.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

@Jay Hemdal , another question.

When Ich gets this bad, does it normally continue to snowball? I have many fish that show no signs of anything, I’m just wondering how urgent it is to get all fish into QT vs the ones showing visible symptoms. Ultimately trying not to overload the QT system’s filtration if I can move the sickest looking fish first, and slowly move the rest over as I build out my QT holding system better.

The problem with ich is that it reproduces with exponential growth, so it can go for some time as a moderate infection, and suddenly, the math kicks in and the parasite population explodes and overwhelms and kills the fish. Not all fish are infected at the same rate due to different levels of immunity to the parasite. However, the tang in the middle video above is pretty close to the point where it will soon become very ill.

If ALL offspring from ich were to find a host and reproduce, the growth looks like this:

Day 0	Start	Initial parasite	1
Day 2	Cycle 1	1 × 251¹	251
Day 4	Cycle 2	1 × 251²	63,001
Day 6	Cycle 3	1 × 251³	15,813,251
Day 8	Cycle 4	1 × 251⁴	3,969,126,001
Day 10	Cycle 5	1 × 251⁵	996,250,626,251

Luckily, only a small percentage of each generation manage to find a host fish. Still, the growth curve is similar.

 

[hondacbr600rr]

I lost a few of the worst looking fish before I could get them caught and into QT.

All my other fish are now completely spot free.

Is it safe to assume if the fish aren’t covered in spots, the ich population isn’t reproducing at an alarming rate now? The purple tang was covered last week, and now looks like he was never phased.

My gem tang, sailfin, blue hippo, scopas, and bristletooth tangs all look great too.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

I lost a few of the worst looking fish before I could get them caught and into QT.

All my other fish are now completely spot free.

Is it safe to assume if the fish aren’t covered in spots, the ich population isn’t reproducing at an alarming rate now? The purple tang was covered last week, and now looks like he was never phased.

My gem tang, sailfin, blue hippo, scopas, and bristletooth tangs all look great too.

What are you treating them with?

 

[hondacbr600rr]

I lost a few of the worst looking fish before I could get them caught and into QT.

All my other fish are now completely spot free.

Is it safe to assume if the fish aren’t covered in spots, the ich population isn’t reproducing at an alarming rate now? The purple tang was covered last week, and now looks like he was never phased.

My gem tang, sailfin, blue hippo, scopas, and bristletooth tangs all look great too.

What are you treating them with?

I haven’t moved anymore fish to QT yet. So no medications since they are still in the DT. It just appears the other tangs cleared all signs of ich. I have about 40 fish in both tanks that will be moving to my new rack system for holding while the display tanks are fallow.

Just seems like the ich that was present was getting worse, and now it isn’t causing any visual issues. Makes me wonder if my UV caught up, or if that strain just died off?

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

I haven’t moved anymore fish to QT yet. So no medications since they are still in the DT. It just appears the other tangs cleared all signs of ich. I have about 40 fish in both tanks that will be moving to my new rack system for holding while the display tanks are fallow.

Just seems like the ich that was present was getting worse, and now it isn’t causing any visual issues. Makes me wonder if my UV caught up, or if that strain just died off?

With some parasites (ich and flukes) you will see a distinct drop in parasite load after a move, since the reproductive stage was left behind in the old tank. This is often short lived, as the parasites begin reproducing in the new tank. The tank transfer method can actually cure ich be doing this move three or four times, 3 days apart.