Coral Beauty Angelfish - Diagnosis & Treatment?

[kyley]

Hi All,
I've had my Coral Beauty for about 9 months now (quarantined first with Tank Transfer Method and PraziPro). It's lost some tissue from the front of its face. Mouth at times has almost looks bloody. It's been like this for about 5 months, but hasn't gotten worse over the past several. I just removed it (and my other two fish) and placed them all in a quarantine tank as I plan to treat them and then move them into my newer 120g tank. Thoughts on what this is and how to treat it? HLLE? Bacterial infection? What should I try to treat it? Pictures:

Additional info:

• Fish were in a 10 year old reef tank running carbon and GFO and rare water changes. Nitrates and Phosphates are at 0.
• All 3 fish from this tank act fine and eat well. The clown has black marks on it (which I think is some sort of irritation from coral or something), and my Royal Gramma Basslet has some slightly paler tissue, but I don't think it's anything really.
• There's never been any white spots or anything else visible on any of these fish (the other two I've had for 8 and 10 years). If you see anything in the pics, it's just stuff floating around.
• I feed LRS, mysis, and Prime Reef Flakes - often using Selcon, garlic, and VitaChem with the frozen foods. So I don't think nutrition is an issue.
• In the new tank I'm using a small amount of carbon and even smaller amount of GFO. I'm considering removing them though. I have an algae scrubber and skimmer that are removing everything well.
• Those pics are from 4+ months ago. I'll try to get some newer ones and add, but the fish looks about the same.

Here are a few meds that I happen to have on hand if you think they would be helpful?
Seachem MetroPlex (metronidazole)
Seachem Focus
PraziPro
Formalin MS
Methylene Blue

Thanks for any suggestions!
--Kyle

 

[Mmun]

Hi All,
I've had my Coral Beauty for about 9 months now (quarantined first with Tank Transfer Method and PraziPro). It's lost some tissue from the front of its face. Mouth at times has almost looks bloody. It's been like this for about 5 months, but hasn't gotten worse over the past several. I just removed it (and my other two fish) and placed them all in a quarantine tank as I plan to treat them and then move them into my newer 120g tank. Thoughts on what this is and how to treat it? HLLE? Bacterial infection? What should I try to treat it? Pictures:

Additional info:

• Fish were in a 10 year old reef tank running carbon and GFO and rare water changes. Nitrates and Phosphates are at 0.
• All 3 fish from this tank act fine and eat well. The clown has black marks on it (which I think is some sort of irritation from coral or something), and my Royal Gramma Basslet has some slightly paler tissue, but I don't think it's anything really.
• There's never been any white spots or anything else visible on any of these fish (the other two I've had for 8 and 10 years). If you see anything in the pics, it's just stuff floating around.
• I feed LRS, mysis, and Prime Reef Flakes - often using Selcon, garlic, and VitaChem with the frozen foods. So I don't think nutrition is an issue.
• In the new tank I'm using a small amount of carbon and even smaller amount of GFO. I'm considering removing them though. I have an algae scrubber and skimmer that are removing everything well.
• Those pics are from 4+ months ago. I'll try to get some newer ones and add, but the fish looks about the same.

Here are a few meds that I happen to have on hand if you think they would be helpful?
Seachem MetroPlex (metronidazole)
Seachem Focus
PraziPro
Formalin MS
Methylene Blue

Thanks for any suggestions!
--Kyle

I have never seen anything like that. Looks like a little bit of both of your suggestions. There are experts in here that will chime in at some point. My best guess is bacterial

 

[kyley]

Bump! Anyone have any ideas? Thanks,
--Kyle

 

[Crabs McJones]

HLLE is my first impression. Are you giving her any nori to graze on. Tangs and Angel's need algae to eat throughout the day. Have you physically seen her eat?

 

[Greatdane]

Mine died but was crazy with algae it was pretty amazing how much it got rid of sadly it died of some fungus

 

[Terri Caton]

@Humblefish

 

[Humblefish]

HLLE is my first impression. Are you giving her any nori to graze on. Tangs and Angel's need algae to eat throughout the day. Have you physically seen her eat?

+1 Other factors to consider:

1. Test the water for stray voltage.
2. What kind of carbon are you using? I only trust Rox 0.8, because it doesn't leach carbon dust back into the water. (Which can literally tear into your fish.)

 

[kyley]

HLLE is my first impression. Are you giving her any nori to graze on. Tangs and Angel's need algae to eat throughout the day. Have you physically seen her eat?

Not regularly feeding Nori. When I have, it doesn't go after it. But, when it's in the new tank there will be Nori every day. And yes, I've seen it eat - it's been like this for 5 months and always eats like a pig.

+1 Other factors to consider:

1. Test the water for stray voltage.
2. What kind of carbon are you using? I only trust Rox 0.8, because it doesn't leach carbon dust back into the water. (Which can literally tear into your fish.)

I had some stray voltage about a year ago (before I got this fish), but I added a ground probe and now don't detect any.

I do use ROX .8 carbon from BRS. But that's good to know because I was using a little bit of other carbon in my big tank and will stop now.

So with HLLE, it may just get better on its own in time, right? I'll rely less on carbon in the new tank (skimmer + algae scrubber keep the water pretty clean, but I do have a couple of leathers). Thanks,
--Kyle

 

[kyley]

Here are some updated pictures of the fish in my quarantine tank. Again, it's been like this about 5 months. It looks worse here now that I can see more closely with the pictures though. :-(

No carbon in the QT. I will try to feed food with Metroplex and hope that helps, along with no carbon for awhile.

 

[Crabs McJones]

Do you have any vitamins you can soak the food in?

 

[Humblefish]

Ever see white stringy poop come out of this fish? There is a genus of parasitic diplomonads (Hexamita) which usually starts out in the GI tract, but over time migrates to the sensory pores on the head. And causes little pits like that.

 

[kyley]

Do you have any vitamins you can soak the food in?

Yeah, I have been using Selcon, VitaChem, and garlic with the food the past 5 months. Using all 3 about half the time I feed.

 

[kyley]

Ever see white stringy poop come out of this fish? There is a genus of parasitic diplomonads (Hexamita) which usually starts out in the GI tract, but over time migrates to the sensory pores on the head. And causes little pits like that.

Not that I have noticed. And I can see all the poop now that it's in the QT.

Would it be best to try MetroPlex and Focus? Or General Cure and Focus?

I also saw a little about Beta Glucan, but I'm not sure what that is or where to get it. Thanks,
--Kyle

 

[Crabs McJones]

Just keep in mind the fish is likely already stressed out, throwing a bunch of meds at it will stress it out even more.

 

[kyley]

Just keep in mind the fish is likely already stressed out, throwing a bunch of meds at it will stress it out even more.

Well, it's been in a QT with 2 peaceful tankmates for a week (without any meds). I'm not sure when would be a better time to try to medicate it... It's either do that, do nothing in QT for awhile, or transfer it to the 120g as-is?

Does General Cure or MetroPlex cause stress for fish? I'm sure things like copper do, but I didn't think that meds like that would? Thx,
--Kyle

 

[Humblefish]

Not that I have noticed. And I can see all the poop now that it's in the QT.

Would it be best to try MetroPlex and Focus? Or General Cure and Focus?

I also saw a little about Beta Glucan, but I'm not sure what that is or where to get it. Thanks,
--Kyle

Have you done a recent stray voltage test on your DT? Just to rule that out. Aquarium heaters & pump can have a high failure rate, and are prone to leaking stray current into the water.

 

[kyley]

Have you done a recent stray voltage test on your DT? Just to rule that out. Aquarium heaters & pump can have a high failure rate, and are prone to leaking stray current into the water.

I did about 9 months ago and had small amounts. But once I installed a ground probe, I was no longer able to detect any stray voltage. Should be okay there... Thanks,
--Kyle

 

[Humblefish]

I did about 9 months ago and had small amounts. But once I installed a ground probe, I was no longer able to detect any stray voltage. Should be okay there... Thanks,
--Kyle

Since you already have the fish in QT, I would dose Metroplex and also food soak that medication for a couple of weeks. Metro is not as harsh as treating with copper.

 

[4FordFamily]

I’m wondering about hexamita as well. I’d add general cure and focus to food for 14 days and keep fortifying foods in vitamins such as selcon, zoe, vita chem to help. Could be extreme hlle as well as mentioned but other than nutrition, checking for stray voltage, and carbon removal there is not much more that you can do as @Humblefish has said.

 

[4FordFamily]

Since you already have the fish in QT, I would dose Metroplex and also food soak that medication for a couple of weeks. Metro is not as harsh as treating with copper.

Metro is a good suggestion, also. This guy knows his stuff better than I. General cure is metro but at a lower dose and with other ingredients.