Dinoflagellates - dinos a possible cure!? Follow along and see!

[domination2580]

Did you clean everything after you were done? Skimmer included...i used 8.5% Clorox bleach. If you didn't clean everything you had off you might have let it all survive by giving it a place to survive white you bleached the tank

 

[domination2580]

I don't think the safe dose is as effective but i think it depends on what strain of dinos it is. By all means I reccomend the safe dose to start off but it might not work every time. I RECCOMEND REMOVING ALL LIVESTOCK FROM TANK. Inverts and snails should be fine. Not quite sure on starfish. I witnessed my amphipods made it through as well. I also want to reccomend using the 8.25% sodium hypochlorite bleach...aka Clorox bleach. A safe starting point I would reccomend is 1 ml bleach per 10 gallons. So for example I have a 55 gallon so 5.5 ml TWICE Dailey once every 12 hours or so. But the objective is to go off of the smell of the tank, if dosing enough bleach you should be able to smell the tank and it should smell like a hot tub or pool. A chlorine smell should be present. The most I would reccomend is a 3 day dose so a total of six doses. I recommend also that once done, take all equipment out and do a bleach bath to make site they don't get reintroduced to the dt again. EVERYTHING must be bathed in a bleach bath. Nets, syringes, ect.

[emoji724] REMOVE ALL LIVESTOCK FROM TANK PRIOR TO THIS! [emoji724]
So to recap it is 1ml per 10 gallons. Dose twice Dailey with 8.25% bleach (Clorox brand). Or until you get the chlorine smell. Dose for 3 days to end up with a total of 6 doses.
Thanks, this is all based from @twilliard and his dedicated research. I have been doing research myself but don't have the tools like a scope. I have successfully dosed my tank with this method and I'm about a month free of dinos.



I will try to get a write up made in a day or two and start a new thread for the bleach dose.

 

[mcarroll]

I don't think the safe dose is as effective but i think it depends on what strain of dinos it is. By all means I reccomend the safe dose to start off but it might not work every time. I RECCOMEND REMOVING ALL LIVESTOCK FROM TANK. Inverts and snails should be fine. Not quite sure on starfish. I witnessed my amphipods made it through as well. I also want to reccomend using the 8.25% sodium hypochlorite bleach...aka Clorox bleach. A safe starting point I would reccomend is 1 ml bleach per 10 gallons. So for example I have a 55 gallon so 5.5 ml TWICE Dailey once every 12 hours or so. But the objective is to go off of the smell of the tank, if dosing enough bleach you should be able to smell the tank and it should smell like a hot tub or pool. A chlorine smell should be present. The most I would reccomend is a 3 day dose so a total of six doses. I recommend also that once done, take all equipment out and do a bleach bath to make site they don't get reintroduced to the dt again. EVERYTHING must be bathed in a bleach bath. Nets, syringes, ect.

[emoji724] REMOVE ALL LIVESTOCK FROM TANK PRIOR TO THIS! [emoji724]
So to recap it is 1ml per 10 gallons. Dose twice Dailey with 8.25% bleach (Clorox brand). Or until you get the chlorine smell. Dose for 3 days to end up with a total of 6 doses.
Thanks, this is all based from @twilliard and his dedicated research. I have been doing research myself but don't have the tools like a scope. I have successfully dosed my tank with this method and I'm about a month free of dinos.



I will try to get a write up made in a day or two and start a new thread for the bleach dose.

The bleach thing is already in this thread unless you're making a new set of instructions...lots of folks have already tried it.

Any chance you have some pictures on another thread somewhere of your tank currently? Or could you post one here?

You are one of the only people that a treatment like this has worked for so it would be awesome if you would document your case really really well. ( Your case may be a fluke. )

 

[mcarroll]

From what you describe I don't think you are trying anything new by the way. Check out the search on this thread for bleach smell:
bleach smell
(^--that's a search link for this thread. Click it!)

 

[mandrieu]

I don't think the safe dose is as effective but i think it depends on what strain of dinos it is. By all means I reccomend the safe dose to start off but it might not work every time. I RECCOMEND REMOVING ALL LIVESTOCK FROM TANK. Inverts and snails should be fine. Not quite sure on starfish. I witnessed my amphipods made it through as well. I also want to reccomend using the 8.25% sodium hypochlorite bleach...aka Clorox bleach. A safe starting point I would reccomend is 1 ml bleach per 10 gallons. So for example I have a 55 gallon so 5.5 ml TWICE Dailey once every 12 hours or so. But the objective is to go off of the smell of the tank, if dosing enough bleach you should be able to smell the tank and it should smell like a hot tub or pool. A chlorine smell should be present. The most I would reccomend is a 3 day dose so a total of six doses. I recommend also that once done, take all equipment out and do a bleach bath to make site they don't get reintroduced to the dt again. EVERYTHING must be bathed in a bleach bath. Nets, syringes, ect.

[emoji724] REMOVE ALL LIVESTOCK FROM TANK PRIOR TO THIS! [emoji724]
So to recap it is 1ml per 10 gallons. Dose twice Dailey with 8.25% bleach (Clorox brand). Or until you get the chlorine smell. Dose for 3 days to end up with a total of 6 doses.
Thanks, this is all based from @twilliard and his dedicated research. I have been doing research myself but don't have the tools like a scope. I have successfully dosed my tank with this method and I'm about a month free of dinos
I will try to get a write up made in a day or two and start a new thread for the bleach dose.

Yeah, I did basically the same, but it didn't work for me. Here's the catch: when we dose something like bleach or h2o2, the "power" of a certain amount of it will depend on the concentration of organics and other things that will react with it, so a certain dose (like 1 ml/10 gallons) could be effective in some cases, ineffective in some others.
And yes: REMOVE THE FISH!!! no matter what. Most of my fish died at less than the safe dose. Shame on me.

 

[BoneXriffic]

I don't think the safe dose is as effective but i think it depends on what strain of dinos it is. By all means I reccomend the safe dose to start off but it might not work every time. I RECCOMEND REMOVING ALL LIVESTOCK FROM TANK. Inverts and snails should be fine. Not quite sure on starfish. I witnessed my amphipods made it through as well. I also want to reccomend using the 8.25% sodium hypochlorite bleach...aka Clorox bleach. A safe starting point I would reccomend is 1 ml bleach per 10 gallons. So for example I have a 55 gallon so 5.5 ml TWICE Dailey once every 12 hours or so. But the objective is to go off of the smell of the tank, if dosing enough bleach you should be able to smell the tank and it should smell like a hot tub or pool. A chlorine smell should be present. The most I would reccomend is a 3 day dose so a total of six doses. I recommend also that once done, take all equipment out and do a bleach bath to make site they don't get reintroduced to the dt again. EVERYTHING must be bathed in a bleach bath. Nets, syringes, ect.

[emoji724] REMOVE ALL LIVESTOCK FROM TANK PRIOR TO THIS! [emoji724]
So to recap it is 1ml per 10 gallons. Dose twice Dailey with 8.25% bleach (Clorox brand). Or until you get the chlorine smell. Dose for 3 days to end up with a total of 6 doses.
Thanks, this is all based from @twilliard and his dedicated research. I have been doing research myself but don't have the tools like a scope. I have successfully dosed my tank with this method and I'm about a month free of dinos.



I will try to get a write up made in a day or two and start a new thread for the bleach dose.

Ive been back to testing. All live stock in the tank. 3x dose per day. Dinos came in from a purchase i made at rap. The strings turn white after 2 days and are disapearing quickly. When i came up with the original dosing formula i dosed for 6months 2x per day. About a year ago. Im udimg the original formula however. I would seem the type of dino makes a huge difference. But also the fish i have had for over a year that went through the bleach treatment were originally infected with velvet

 

[mandrieu]

I had hope for kalkwasser sorry to listen that, I think you are really patient person, two years [emoji50] My fight is about 7-8 monts and I want to give up already. I think its not worth the stress to try so long, I only think if I had restarted 6 months ago I would have a nice tank already. The only thing Im scared is that I will restart and they will come back some how.

In retrospect, I have to agree with you. I restarted my tank once already due to dinos and at least got to enjoy the tank for some time, until they re-appeared

 

[Jolanta]

In retrospect, I have to agree with you. I restarted my tank once already due to dinos and at least got to enjoy the tank for some time, until they re-appeared

Thats whats scares me Did you do quarantine for all your new corals and fish? Did you used old rock or sand? What was your procedure to restart your tank?

 

[Reeferhigh]

Theres no such thing as a safe dose for fish, I killed 2 following the safe dose. After removing the fish is when I went 3 times the dose. All dino strings did turn white and I had a very strong bleach smell throughout my entire dosing regime. But they still come back.

 

[domination2580]

Theres no such thing as a safe dose for fish, I killed 2 following the safe dose. After removing the fish is when I went 3 times the dose. All dino strings did turn white and I had a very strong bleach smell throughout my entire dosing regime. But they still come back.

Did you sterilize everything? Did you stir the sand bed?

 

[Reeferhigh]

I don't have a sand bed, not sure why I would have to sterilize the skimmer when it's been sitting in the same bleach water?

 

[domination2580]

I don't have a sand bed, not sure why I would have to sterilize the skimmer when it's been sitting in the same bleach water?

Was the skimmer on?

 

[Reeferhigh]

On and off depending on how crazy it was going.

 

[domination2580]

On and off depending on how crazy it was going.

Well there's a possibility that the dinos that were in the skimmer when it was off survived since it wasn't in contact with bleach the entire time and came back from it due to no sterilization. I recommend to keep skimmer running at all times during a bleach treatment.

 

[FFJB]

Fishless. To be honest it was all over the place, I tried not to go past 14ml on 280 gallons daily. I usually redosed once the chlorine smell went away. This would usually take anywhere from 6-12 hours depending on dose amount.

Of all the things i've tried, I believe hitting them with bleach in the beginning gives you the upper hand compared to other methods. It bring them down to manageable levels for you to try other methods. I believe other methods are effective, but are not effective enough for strong blooms, this is where bleach helps.

Timeline of events

-Moved everything from 90g to 220g with new sand, existing rocks, and another 200lb from someone breaking down their tank.
-Diatom bloom that never really went away, dinos started appearing now.
-Added a couple of fish
-Got velvet, went fallow
-Dinos were never really bad when fish were in tank, but once they were removed it got worse everyday. This agrees with the view that too clean of a tank causes them, since they didn't show up immediately rather a couple days later.
-Up until this point I was doing normal water changes weekly. I stopped them once I realised dinos were starting to bloom.
-Dosed bleach at recommended amount for 3 days, dino dissapeared
-Stopped bleach and began dosing nitrates. I went for 1ppm per day, increasing daily. This was done with no test kit.
-Dinos got alot worse, was only on plastic overflow and smooth surfaces, now they began to show up on rocks and sand, The typical dino bloom that takes over the tank.
-Stopped dosing nitrates
-Dosed bleach again, slightly stronger dose depending on bloom.
-Added clean up crew, hermits, snails, starfish, and cucumber.
-Stopped dosing bleach, 4 days dosing at this point.
-Got nitrate/phosphate test kit, nitrates off the charts 50ppm+, phosphates at hard 0.
-Tank looks the cleanest it has been, but since phosphates were at 0 I decided to add a bit of seachem phosphorus to raise it to .05. Only added 10ml/day which equates to ~.03ppm.
-Some algae is beginning to grow, doesnt look like dinos.

Hope this helps someone battling them. This is the 2nd time dealing with them and I take the slow approach. Drastic measures tend to cause dino blooms to get way worse in my experience. There is no quick fix, unless you are willing to remove fish and bleach your tank. This is the quickest way to defeat them, but requires either low dose with fish, or complete removal.

Sorry.if this has been asked but what about corals in the tank or nems. Will bleach kill them.

 

[mcarroll]

I wish this thread could be re-titled to something without "cure" in it....or something.

 

[BoneXriffic]

Theres no such thing as a safe dose for fish, I killed 2 following the safe dose. After removing the fish is when I went 3 times the dose. All dino strings did turn white and I had a very strong bleach smell throughout my entire dosing regime. But they still come back.

This would be incorrect. I dose daily. All fish in place. This is the second dosing regime ive done in a year an a half. It was all experimental for velvet. And velvet has never returned. I have a write up of how it went for me. Ill look for link

If fish are being harmed then a number of issues could be happening. Eg incorrect dose, or the way its dispersed.

I made the original dose formula. It worked for me and a few other.... there are many variabled that will determine success or failure of this. Different strains and resistance, also how over run your tank is. And others variables im sure

 

[mcarroll]

Theres no such thing as a safe dose for fish, I killed 2 following the safe dose. After removing the fish is when I went 3 times the dose. All dino strings did turn white and I had a very strong bleach smell throughout my entire dosing regime. But they still come back.

This would be incorrect. I dose daily. All fish in place. This is the second dosing regime ive done in a year an a half. It was all experimental for velvet. And velvet has never returned. I have a write up of how it went for me. Ill look for link

If fish are being harmed then a number of issues could be happening. Eg incorrect dose, or the way its dispersed.

I made the original dose formula. It worked for me and a few other.... there are many variabled that will determine success or failure of this. Different strains and resistance, also how over run your tank is. And others variables im sure

Clearly you are both correct.

Thankfully bleach is now a more popular reef supplement than two-part.

Next hot new product: Brightwell NeoChlor. ;Facepalm

I dunno what we're learning in the process (anything?), and it's a weird watching people just nuke their tanks post after post in this thread.

I started in this hobby in the early 1990's and I've never seen anything like this. The closest thing to this thread are threads about cleaning out used mixing buckets.

BTW folks, search through this thread for "bleach" and look at people's results before dosing bleach (or anything else ridiculous) into your tank.

Here's a link to the thread-search so there's no excuse not to look: bleach

500 posts on bleach (so far!?!) in this thread and of the cases I could find that confessed their outcome, it either wasn't positive or it wasn't without side-effects or both.

 

[domination2580]

Clearly you are both correct.

Thankfully bleach is now a more popular reef supplement than two-part.

Next hot new product: Brightwell NeoChlor. ;Facepalm

I dunno what we're learning in the process (anything?), and it's a weird watching people just nuke their tanks post after post in this thread.

I started in this hobby in the early 1990's and I've never seen anything like this. The closest thing to this thread are threads about cleaning out used mixing buckets.

BTW folks, search through this thread for "bleach" and look at people's results before dosing bleach (or anything else ridiculous) into your tank.

Here's a link to the thread-search so there's no excuse not to look: bleach

500 posts on bleach (so far!?!) in this thread and of the cases I could find that confessed their outcome, it either wasn't positive or it wasn't without side-effects or both.

Ok, I have left it alone for quite some time. You are once again bashing the bleach method...which I know has worked. There are a lot of variables included in the hobby let alone the bleach dosing. So far I have not seen or heard of any positive outcomes from your alternatives. So any alternative is better than no alternative. MOST dinos are a protozoan. Not an algae which means that yes some species do use light for photosynthesis but most are also something we introduce to our tanks. Whether it be a frag, a snail, or rock. For those of you trying to go about the high nutrient methods, Let me tell you that when I had dinos I had nitrates in the 60 and 80 at times and did not help at all. I am not saying that the bleach method should be taken lightly but should be researched through this thread and ask for help when not sure of something. And I remind everyone, it's better to take fish out when dosing bleach but it is up to the individual. All I'm saying is please don't bash a method that this thread has helped numerous people and was created for the dosing metro then bleach in the first place. And please don't bash in simple respect to the thread. Imagine how it would be with the shoe on the other foot? What if we bashed your methods....methods are methods...people have every right and choice to try methods they are comfortable with. And yes we are learning from this. I have done bleach dips on all my corals with not a single loss....and has proven to rid the dinos. There is no need for snotty remarks or bashing methods just because you don't like it. If you don't like it then don't do it. People can make their own decisions on what they want to do. If you find another method, please share and people can decide but in respect to those of us who have taken the time and risk of everything to find a possible cure for dinos, please stop bashing [emoji4]

 

[mcarroll]

Ok, I have left it alone for quite some time. You are once again bashing the bleach method.

I maintain that "Possible cure!?" ought be removed from the thread title.

Replace it with "Chemistry experiment!?" and least then folks would join the thread in the correct spirit vs having some expectation that their tank is going to be "cured".

Most folks are so antsy after reading "cure" that they can't even read the thread to notice where people failed at [bleach|h2o2|etc] 50 or 100 times....they just jump to the end and ask how to do it.

I had dinos I had nitrates in the 60 and 80 at times and did not help at all.

Were you able to ID what dino you had via microscope by chance?

What was the story with the nutrients in the system before the dino's showed up?

Was there any nutrient control happening before they showed up?

How old was the tank at that time?

So far I have not seen or heard of any positive outcomes from your alternatives.

Really? Seriously? ;Blackeye

Where have you looked?

Before you worry about my outcomes (using basic troubleshooting and husbandry – very dangerous), I'd worry about the folks dosing bleach.

BTW, I pasted that link to the search of this thread for bleach so anyone interested in trying bleach could use it to quickly find related posts. Why not reach back into the thread and look up some of those bleach side-effects to see what happened and try to help those folks instead of worrying about me?

(If you really wanna worry about be, then curing those folk's dino's as-promised would be a much better way to change my mind about dosing bleach.)