First time plumbing a reef tank, need advice

[Scope]

Hey everyone, I've never plumbed anything in my life so for the tank I went with herbie style overflow. Yesterday I finished filling my 500-liter tank with water and wanted to ask you some questions.

1. I simulated a power outage to see if my sump can handle all the water. It did okay...ish? It filled to around 7mm from the rim, which seems dangerously close, but hey - it didn't overflow. Can I leave it like that?

2. I wanted to see how my emergency drain works, so I shut the valve on the main drain, and to my surprise, the return chamber ran dry, but the water did overflow through the e-drain, just not enough to keep the pump running. Is that supposed to happen? What about ATO if my main drain gets clogged and the water level drops in the return chamber?

3. Did I mess up my return? I didn't want the pipes to go over the overflow because I'm using a lid, so I did this, and it might seem like the water level in my DT is too high. Thoughts?

 

[BryanM]

Hey everyone, I've never plumbed anything in my life so for the tank I went with herbie style overflow. Yesterday I finished filling my 500-liter tank with water and wanted to ask you some questions.

1. I simulated a power outage to see if my sump can handle all the water. It did okay...ish? It filled to around 7mm from the rim, which seems dangerously close, but hey - it didn't overflow. Can I leave it like that?

2. I wanted to see how my emergency drain works, so I shut the valve on the main drain, and to my surprise, the return chamber ran dry, but the water did overflow through the e-drain, just not enough to keep the pump running. Is that supposed to happen? What about ATO if my main drain gets clogged and the water level drops in the return chamber?

3. Did I mess up my return? I didn't want the pipes to go over the overflow because I'm using a lid, so I did this, and it might seem like the water level in my DT is too high. Thoughts?

I can't answer all the questions.

I will say my return area never goes dry, so I don't know what to say about that.

If the sump has 7mm to spare IMO you're good there.

And my returns come out of the sides of that return area, not over the top, so that looks reasonable to me as well.

 

[Mebbid]

1: It might be fine, i'd personally use a little less water in the return. If anything added takes up any volume in the sump then it's gonna overflow.

2: My guess would be is that the emergency drain is a little too high, that way it needs to fill more to start the emergency drain. Can't say for sure but that's my guess.

3: Nah, it's not messed up. But personally, i'd add some loc line and direct the return as well as figure out something to keep fish out of the overflow.

 

[UncommonSense]

1. I simulated a power outage to see if my sump can handle all the water. It did okay...ish? It filled to around 7mm from the rim, which seems dangerously close, but hey - it didn't overflow. Can I leave it like that?

What size is the sump?

The return line is pretty far underwater… when a return pump shuts down, the water in the return plumbing will suddenly stop being pushed uphill, and start flowing back downhill (into the sump)! This creates a siphon from display to sump through the return line…

The most reliable way to avoid siphoning an excessive amount of water out of your display, into your sump during a outage/pump shutdown would be to have your return plumbing very close to the water’s surface (and/or drill a 1/8”-1/4” hole in the in-tank return plumbing) to ensure that the return plumbing starts to suck air in a siphon event, subsequently breaking that siphon rapidly!

2. I wanted to see how my emergency drain works, so I shut the valve on the main drain, and to my surprise, the return chamber ran dry, but the water did overflow through the e-drain, just not enough to keep the pump running. Is that supposed to happen? What about ATO if my main drain gets clogged and the water level drops in the return chamber?

This goes back to sump size, but as stated above, can also be directly relative to emergency drain height… is the emergency drain standpipe height above the bottom of the weir teeth?

— in a Herbie drain system, you typically restrict the primary drain just enough to get a trickle of water flowing into the emergency drain during normal operation; this really helps sump return chamber water level fluctuation!

Normally, ATO is managed by using a reservoir large enough to last around a week, but small enough that it will not crash tank salinity in the exact scenario where sump return chamber water level continuously drops! — the ATO reservoir will run empty before doing any lasting damage!

Did I mess up my return? I didn't want the pipes to go over the overflow because I'm using a lid, so I did this

I’ve definitely seen worse! Would it be possible to raise it up even 3-6mm? — this would allow you to put a fitting on that exposed pipe to adapt to a nozzle you can actually direct as desired! (And let you strategically create your return siphon break)

and it might seem like the water level in my DT is too high.

Yes, either the emergency drain standpipe is too tall, or the return pump is pumping so much water into the display that the Herbie drains can barely keep up! (The latter would be due to insufficient drain plumbing diameter, and/or excessive return pump size)

 

[Scope]

What size is the sump?

It's 110 x 38 x 34 cm.

is the emergency drain standpipe height above the bottom of the weir teeth?

Yes. Guess I'll have to saw it back a little? I've seen some people cut theirs at a 45-degree angle. Is there a benefit in doing that?

Would it be possible to raise it up even 3-6mm?

I think I'll add a union because it's already glued to the bulkhead. It should raise it enough.

 

[UncommonSense]

It's 110 x 38 x 34 cm.

Great, this is a good size for your tank!

Yes. Guess I'll have to saw it back a little? I've seen some people cut theirs at a 45-degree angle. Is there a benefit in doing that?

Yeah, you should cut it down to be equal with the bottom of the weir teeth; if it is higher, the entire tank needs to fill up more, vs. just the overflow box! (This is why the sump return chamber went dry when testing your emergency drain!)

I think I'll add a union because it's already glued to the bulkhead. It should raise it enough.

You can just use a straight coupler, too!

Ideally, you want to avoid gluing your standpipes to your bulkheads, purely because it makes doing service later a pain!

— it isn’t the end of the world, you can always remove the bulkheads with associated standpipes later to cut the standpipes and add a straight coupler to each, making all but the last 3-4cm removable!

 

[Freenow54]

There are fittings that you can attach to your pipes they are flexible so you can twist them up near the surface in the tank therefore less water will siphon

 

[UncommonSense]

There are fittings that you can attach to your pipes they are flexible so you can twist them up near the surface in the tank therefore less water will siphon

Yep, the most common flexible modular fittings are Loc Line, or numerous knock-offs!

The issue here runs a bit deeper, though… in the photo with the return plumbing pictured, the final piece of pipe is resting directly on the wall of the overflow box! — he won’t be able to get a fitting over it to to do anything for a return nozzle unless he makes that pipe a few mm higher!

 

[Scope]

Thanks for the replies, guys! I got myself some loc-line modules and extended the return up so that it's over the comb. And I cut off like 3cm from the emergency drain so it should behave better this time.

 

[REEF GHOST]

Hey everyone, I've never plumbed anything in my life so for the tank I went with herbie style overflow. Yesterday I finished filling my 500-liter tank with water and wanted to ask you some questions.

1. I simulated a power outage to see if my sump can handle all the water. It did okay...ish? It filled to around 7mm from the rim, which seems dangerously close, but hey - it didn't overflow. Can I leave it like that?

2. I wanted to see how my emergency drain works, so I shut the valve on the main drain, and to my surprise, the return chamber ran dry, but the water did overflow through the e-drain, just not enough to keep the pump running. Is that supposed to happen? What about ATO if my main drain gets clogged and the water level drops in the return chamber?

3. Did I mess up my return? I didn't want the pipes to go over the overflow because I'm using a lid, so I did this, and it might seem like the water level in my DT is too high. Thoughts?

It is a emergency drain. So if your main drain were to slow down and not completely close off and divert to the emergency drain then it's working. In the case of a power failure the pump would be off and would not overtake either drains. Now when your sump filled to 7mm below the rim is more concerning. I'm not sure how you plumbed your return, but you should have a anti suction hole in the 90* elbow to prevent excessive draining from the tank. From your picture it's easy to see that your return is about an inch below the water level. The position of your return and no Anti syphon hole you are lucky it didn't flow alover your floor. If you want to fix this issue, then raise the 90 so the pipe is halfway out of the water and add a 45* fitting to aim the flow underwater but just below the surface. Also, in the armpit of the 90 drill a hole to prevent syphoning extra water.