Herbie overflow.......out of patience

[reef tank 2.0]

I am out of paitence. I don't know what else to do. I have spent the last two hours trying to adjust my gate valves so that the overflow drain level STOPS fluctuating. I haven't changed anything, other than adjust the gate valve a 16th of an inch at a time.

I have opened my return gate valve all the way. From that point, I adjust the drain valve to the point that it is A) quiet, and B) stable. A) isn't a problem at all. I can quiet that down pretty quick.

B), right when I think the level is finally stable, I watch it for 5-10 minutes, and I watch it slowly creep upwards or downwards. The further down it goes, the louder the overflow becomes.

I don't understand why this is happening. Nothing is changing from the sump, up to the overflow.

I have the system filled with water, rock, and sand, and getting ready to drop in raw shrimp tomorrow to begin the cycle process.

I understand one needs patience in this hobby, but this is ridiculous. A 16th of an inch should not change the level by INCHES!

Here is an image of the set up instructions I used.

 

[reef tank 2.0]

i can only assume you don't want any water draining through the emergency line. which is what i am trying to avoid. but on the flip side, if i do let the water flow through the emergency line AND the main drain line....does this cause an issue? when it does flow through both, things seem to stable out and become a lot quieter.

i sat here and watched this water level drop 2" with me not changing a thing. then it creeps back up, very slowly.
when i go to the sump, everything is quiet and there is no gurgling or anything coming from these pipes. i don;t know what the issue is up here at the tank. why is this water level fluctuating?

a gyre wouldn't cause this would it? i do have that in place

 

[JGT]

There should be just a trickle down the emergency drain.
A gyre can cause ripples esp if it’s at the surface and affect the drains.

 

[reef tank 2.0]

Well, I can deal with the trickle...I've been fighting to keep it clear. Hopefully the level stays consistent. I'll raise it back up

The gyre is about 12 inches down. It doesn't really disrupt the surface

 

[saltcats]

When I was adjusting my overflow, I found that it would continue to change level for a while after the initial adjustment... So I'd adjust it a bit, wait a few hours until it had settled out, adjust it again if needed. I figured that was normal based on some other threads I'd read.

Maybe give it a little more time between adjustments and see if it settles, if you haven't yet?

 

[reef tank 2.0]

i definitely haven't been waiting a long time for the change. its frustrating when i don't make changes, and things CHANGE for no reason.

i'll try the "more patience" route and see what happens.

thank you

 

[The_Paradox]

Pull the e-drain and chamfer the top of it. Then adjust the gate so that you are the smallest turn beyond a trickle, ie more water. Something like 5% through the e-drain is about right. Once the chamfer gathers some slime/film it will be totally silent.

 

[2Flash1]

I remember when I first set up my tank I was dealing with overflow issues for a good month! Even after a WC…pumps off and would pray when it came back on that no noise! From time to time it will make some noise.

 

[saltcats]

i definitely haven't been waiting a long time for the change. its frustrating when i don't make changes, and things CHANGE for no reason.

i'll try the "more patience" route and see what happens.

thank you

It took me a few days to dial mine in; it would be quiet in the morning and then have crept up or down by the end of the day, but it did settle out. I saw other people reference dialing in their overflow over the first week or so, so it seemed normal to me!

 

[Idech]

I’ve been fiddling with mine for a month. I’m getting better at making it quieter but it’s still annoying sometimes because I do nothing and it starts making noise.

I was told to speed up the pump, which I did, and it helped.

 

[JM302]

Do you have a DC return pump? In my experience, DC pumps, although superior in so many ways - they tend to vary flow enough to be annoying on a 2 pipe system. My Vectra L2 can be touchy at times, my Cor20 is maddeningly bad.

I guess I'm suggesting that the problem may be return pump fluctuations.

 

[reef tank 2.0]

wow...well, this is good to know.

after i adjusted the drain to accept water, everything quieted down.................for now.

earlier i shut off the return pump to see how much the sump would fill up due to a "power loss". once i confirmed that and turned the pump on, my hoping things would return to the way they were, did nothing.
i continued to adjust.

knowing what i know now.....if i left it alone, things would have gotten back to "consistent", or so i think.

i'll let this go for a while and see how it goes. I'll just have to deal with loud noises for a bit, until it settles in.

 

[reef tank 2.0]

It could be the return pump fluctuating, which also makes sense.

I have the Syncra ADV 10.0

 

[2Flash1]

I’m sure you will win this battle…small tweaks at a time and you’ll get it.

 

[The_Paradox]

It could be the return pump fluctuating, which also makes sense.

I have the Syncra ADV 10.0

That’s why you want ~5% going through e-drain at the slowest point.

 

[JM302]

That’s why you want ~5% going through e-drain at the slowest point.

Agreed this is the way to go, but to be clear - if that second pipe is anything besides completely dry, it's not a true 'emergency' pipe.

The only way you can guarantee that pipe will never have any obstructions is to ensure it never gets wet.... unless there's an emergency.

 

[reef tank 2.0]

Thank you for the quick responses... my blood pressure has decreased a tad.

 

[The_Paradox]

Agreed this is the way to go, but to be clear - if that second pipe is anything besides completely dry, it's not a true 'emergency' pipe.

The only way you can guarantee that pipe will never have any obstructions is to ensure it never gets wet.... unless there's an emergency.

Second drain should naturally flow 30-40% more volume than the main at minimum. So even if the main clogs the secondary should be able to handle all the flow with at the least a 25% safety margin.

 

[Lbrdsoxfan]

i can only assume you don't want any water draining through the emergency line. which is what i am trying to avoid. but on the flip side, if i do let the water flow through the emergency line AND the main drain line....does this cause an issue? when it does flow through both, things seem to stable out and become a lot quieter.

i sat here and watched this water level drop 2" with me not changing a thing. then it creeps back up, very slowly.
when i go to the sump, everything is quiet and there is no gurgling or anything coming from these pipes. i don;t know what the issue is up here at the tank. why is this water level fluctuating?

a gyre wouldn't cause this would it? i do have that in place

If you have a gyre that's pulsing it can cause heartburn. I have one pointed at my drain and when it ramps up, it will push a bit more water past the weir.

 

[JM302]

Second drain should naturally flow 30-40% more volume than the main at minimum. So even if the main clogs the secondary should be able to handle all the flow with at the least a 25% safety margin.

I'm not sure how the OP has his pipes sized - but the way I look at it..... If the secondary pipe is taking 5% flow... a snail crawls into said pipe allowing that 5% to continue to flow with no issue - something happens to the primary drain - you now need that secondary drain to pickup the slack, you have a problem.

Do I think it's a likely scenario? No. Do I stand by that makes the secondary pipe a secondary and not an emergency, yes -100%. This is why 3 pipe setups are superior in every way.