How to program Profilux to turn doser off if container empty and on again

[Laith]

I'm using a Profilux 4 controller and have just installed a GHL Maxi Doser 2.2 to perform AWCs.

Previously I was using a Spectrapure Litermeter III for AWC and loved it but after five years one of the pumps stopped working and it is problematic in Europe to get Sepectrapure spares/pumps so I decided to try the Maxi Doser.

My fresh saltwater reservoir holds 240 liters and I have installed two sensors, one at the bottom and one at the top of the reservoir. When the bottom one is triggered two things happen: a solenoid is activated (via the Switchbar) to auto fill the reservoir with RO/DI water and the switch on the Switchbar powering the Litermeter turns off so all AWC is stopped. The reverse happens when the top sensor triggered...

How do I do the same for the Maxi Doser? I want both pumps off when the lower sensor is triggered and on again when the top sensor is triggered. I have spent the last couple of hours reading up and playing around with Programmable Logic and virtual switches but cannot figure it out and I think my brain has melted! :astonished-face:

The only solution I have seen is to power off the Maxi Doser the same was I did the Litermeter. But I don't like that solution because this causes a PAB communication error in the Profilux as it can no longer see the Maxi Doser... and any future GHL devices connected downstream from the Maxi Doser will loose comms too.

Any ideas? @Lasse maybe?

 

[Lasse]

For filling the reservoir you can use a circuit controller with ATO two sensors. You knit that to a switch socker for the solenoid. When the lowest is activated - it switch on and its on until the upper is in its upper position - when it switch off and will be off until the lower is activated again. You may have to play with inverted and non inverted individual sensors. Test it and be sure that the circuit react the way you want.

Now you want that the two Maxi heads only should be able to work when your circuit for the reservoir not is active. I think you also want them be active at certain times too. Let us say that you want to change 2 L at certain times Make first one virtual pump program (31 as an example) Calibrate the real pump you will use fot the pumping out old saltwater - use speed 2. and also put in wanted flow 100 ml/min Copy this figures to the virtual pump. It will take 20 minutes to pump out 2 L. Create the time schedule in the virtual pump (31) 2 L att xx:xx yy:yy and so on. Create a virtual switch - let us say S60. Make a PL with the function AND. First function pump 31 and as second function your circuit controller but INVERTED!. Knit this PL to S60.

Now go to you real Maxi pump - let us say 1. Go to the part - pump reacts to and fill in index 60

Now you real maxi pump will pump out 2 L at the times you set and if ATO filling is NOT active

Now to the second maxi head - the one that shall pump in fresh saltwater. Create a similar virtual pump (32 as an example) Calibrate the real and do the same thing with the virtual as you did with 31. Note - you should set the activation time xx:xx+20 min, YY:YY+20 min and so on Ig you use another amount of water out and in - you must adjust the plus time. Create a new virtual switch (61 in my example) Create another PL with the function AND. Use doser 32 and as second function your circuit controller but INVERTED!. Go to the Maxi that should pump in fresh saltwater and use the switch channel 61


Its important that both the real and the virtual pump has the same calibration and wanted amount/min

I have not test it but I´m rather sure it will work - but as usally test and test again

Sincerely Lasse

 

[Lasse]

I will note that the use of wanted amount only is possible with some of the latest FW both for P4 and the Maxi

Sincerely Lasse

 

[Laith]

Thanks Lasse for that!

The fill of the reservoir is not a problem... I actually use the min-max function to turn the solenoid on and off (on when the low sensor is on and off when the high sensor is triggered). That works fine.

As for the Maxi Dosers, I'll look more in detail to your explanation tomorrow and see if I can implement that.

Thanks again!

 

[Laith]

Currently using the automatic dosing to split the 20 liter per day water change into 2 liters 10x per day. But I need to play around with this because the Maxi is so LOUD! Maybe I'll only run it several times at night...

 

[Lasse]

If you want to use the automatic dosing 20 time during night - let the virtual pumps above dose automatic 40 times * 2 L and create a timer Z active between 21:00 and 09:00 and do a new PL for each virtual pump including the PL in post 2 AND timer Z to each virtual switch.

I actually use the min-max function to turn the solenoid on and off (on when the low sensor is on and off when the high sensor is triggered). That works fine.

Use that instead for ATO 2 sensors but invert it for the Maxi pumps.

Sincerely Lasse

 

[Laith]

For filling the reservoir you can use a circuit controller with ATO two sensors. You knit that to a switch socker for the solenoid. When the lowest is activated - it switch on and its on until the upper is in its upper position - when it switch off and will be off until the lower is activated again. You may have to play with inverted and non inverted individual sensors. Test it and be sure that the circuit react the way you want.

Now you want that the two Maxi heads only should be able to work when your circuit for the reservoir not is active. I think you also want them be active at certain times too. Let us say that you want to change 2 L at certain times Make first one virtual pump program (31 as an example) Calibrate the real pump you will use fot the pumping out old saltwater - use speed 2. and also put in wanted flow 100 ml/min Copy this figures to the virtual pump. It will take 20 minutes to pump out 2 L. Create the time schedule in the virtual pump (31) 2 L att xx:xx yy:yy and so on. Create a virtual switch - let us say S60. Make a PL with the function AND. First function pump 31 and as second function your circuit controller but INVERTED!. Knit this PL to S60.

Now go to you real Maxi pump - let us say 1. Go to the part - pump reacts to and fill in index 60

Now you real maxi pump will pump out 2 L at the times you set and if ATO filling is NOT active

Now to the second maxi head - the one that shall pump in fresh saltwater. Create a similar virtual pump (32 as an example) Calibrate the real and do the same thing with the virtual as you did with 31. Note - you should set the activation time xx:xx+20 min, YY:YY+20 min and so on Ig you use another amount of water out and in - you must adjust the plus time. Create a new virtual switch (61 in my example) Create another PL with the function AND. Use doser 32 and as second function your circuit controller but INVERTED!. Go to the Maxi that should pump in fresh saltwater and use the switch channel 61


Its important that both the real and the virtual pump has the same calibration and wanted amount/min

I have not test it but I´m rather sure it will work - but as usally test and test again

Sincerely Lasse

@Lasse, I've followed your steps but I have a question about the PL settings. No problem for function 1 but what do I set in function 2? You say "circuit controller" but what exactly would this be in the drop down choices available?

There is no option either for level controller or sensor...

Sorry, but a bit lost here!

Thanks!

 

[Lasse]

In the drop down menu - test ATO only and the number at the second drop down meny should be the circuit controller (level controller) you had configured for your two sensors

Sincerely Lasse

 

[Laith]

Thanks @Lasse for the help. Another question: What should the virtual Switch Channels functions be set to? By default they are "Always off".

Sorry for all the bother! I wish that GHL would make this as simple as it should be: turn off the dosing pump if level sensor X is triggered. The same as turning off a switch plug...

 

[Lasse]

To the PL you programmed. I´m sorry I use Swenglish when I wrote stick this PL to S60 - in proper English i should be tie this PL to S60 The PL you create for dos pump 31 should be the function for the switch channel 60 and the PL created for dos pump 32 should be the function for switch channel 61

I do not know if this could be easier but this is what I would test. I do not know if it works well - please let me know and I can sit down with my experimental P4 and figure it out

Sincerely Lasse

 

[Laith]

Ok, I think I've done everything as you suggest.

If the SW reservoir is not filling, the two dosing pumps should be ON. Shouldn't I see that on the Virtual Switches? So the Virtual Switches should show ON when the pumps should be on and OFF when the SW reservoir is filling?

At the moment both Virtual Switches show OFF though the SW reservoir is not filling...

 

[Laith]

After playing around with it the Virtual Switches now show ON when I set INVERT on in them...

Now to test!

 

[Laith]

When I set the real dosing pump for Drain to activate on Switch channel 60 instead of dosing schedule the drain pump turns on immediately, ignoring the dosing schedule I put in the virtual dosing pump... The schedule I put in the virtual dosing pump is the same as the real one: 2.5l at midnight, 01:00, 02:00 etc, 8 times for a total of 20 liters.

I have the same schedule for the Fill pump so the drain and fill should happen at the same time. I don't understand why you put +20 on the schedule in your suggestion.

 

[Lasse]

Because its more effective to first pump out and after that fill upp. If you do the drain and fill at the same time - a 10 % WC will in reality maybe be 6-7 % because you pumping out new water too. 2 L will take 20 min

Sincerely Lasse

 

[Lasse]

channel 60 instead of dosing schedule the drain pump turns on immediately, ignoring the dosing schedule I put in the virtual dosing pump.

Play with inverted in the PL function

Sincerely Lasse

 

[Laith]

@Lasse, it works! :beaming-face-with-smiling-eyes:

I manually tested it at 23.30 last night and when I triggered the low level float switch the two dosers stopped. And when I triggered the high level float switch both dosers started again.

The reservoir was getting low so I let it run as usual every hour starting at midnight, 2,500ml each time. Normally the last run is at 07:00 for a total of 20,000ml. The tank ran low during the 06:00 run and both dosers stopped as the RO/DI unit started the fill of the reservoir.

You can see here the fill (the small line at 23:30 is the manual test):

And here the drain:

The fill stopped after filling 1,904ml at 06:00 and the drain stopped at 1,401ml after draining at 06:00. The difference is due to the different calibration of the two pumps. So when the reservoir was empty I filled about 500ml more than drained. I don't see a way around this and it doesn't really matter in a 1,900 liter system.

Lasse, I appreciate the help tremendously! I don't think I would have been able to figure this out on my own... but I'm starting to see how powerfully flexible the Profilux can be with this type of capability. It is just difficult to connect all the dots to make it do what one wants!

Once again, thanks! :cool:

 

[Laith]

And to the point about filling and draining at the same time:

I don't see this as a real issue as my drain happens upstream in the sump and the fill is in the return chamber. The sump is two meters long so I can't see much mixing of the two, if at all.

 

[Lasse]

And to the point about filling and draining at the same time:

I don't see this as a real issue as my drain happens upstream in the sump and the fill is in the return chamber. The sump is two meters long so I can't see much mixing of the two, if at all.

OK - in that case - you do not need the time separation




Sincerely Lasse

 

[Lasse]

The fill stopped after filling 1,904ml at 06:00 and the drain stopped at 1,401ml after draining at 06:00. The difference is due to the different calibration of the two pumps. So when the reservoir was empty I filled about 500ml more than drained. I don't see a way around this and it doesn't really matter in a 1,900 liter system

If you use the desired flow - like the example below - the calibration should not matter when it stop because low level

Sincerely Lasse

 

[Laith]

The drain and fill pumps have different calibration due to the distance: the SW reservoir is right next to the sump while the drain is under a sink about 6-7 meters away.

But I hadn't realized about setting the same desired flow rate for both pumps! Will set them both to the same. That would solve the difference.