How to Quarantine Kole tang

[xeanliao]

Hi, I got a Kole tang 5 days ago. She appears to be a very shy fish, either hiding when she see my shadow or bumping on the glass or chasing her own reflection in the corner. Finally yesterday, she started come out to eat occasionally. She look healthy that is a good relief.

Still, I am not risky my display tank by all means, I quarantine all new fishes and do preventive cuprimine treatment before release any to display tank. However, I read copper treatment could damage Kole tang.

What would you do to quarantine this type of tang without using cuprimine? lower dosage, or does it make sense to do preventive hypersalinity quarantine? or just observing she for longer period of time?

 

[Doclight]

Interesting.. My yellow eyed kole tang wasn't shy at all.. LOL. Was buddy buddy with my maroon clown in no time.. kinda thought I was watching finding nemo..

I would just keep in quarantine longer. Doesn't sound like its sick, especially if there are no external signs. As with anything. Some fish are just that way.

 

[jsker]

@Humblefish @4FordFamily some help please

 

[Isaac Alves]

I’ve quarantined two Kole Tangs in the last two years. They were both shy fish at first. And I found the easiest way to do it is to get them into a 20 gallon long Aqueon, with the back and sides blacked out, i used a black construction paper, a seeded oversized sponge filter, an egg crate top, heater, ammonia badge, and a small light on a timer. I used copper power at 4-5ppm and kept them in there for 72 days. Mark your water level for topping off each day.

Give them a nice big PVC pipe to chill in and they’re going to be great. I fed seaweed extreme pellets, and ocean nutrition green seaweed soaked in selcon.

 

[Mark Derail]

My yellow juvenile tang did not survive 48 hrs - straight from being healthy at LFS to QT with Cupramine in it - excellent water.
Copper was testing at half the recommended dose.

So will be curious about this thread and other success stories that are shared.

I was thinking of a 5 gal QT tank for just one tang, keep him there a few weeks to see if any problems, and try alternatives to copper for pre-treatment.
Worried that the small tank itself will cause stress, perhaps the 3 footer 30g would be better.

 

[kswan]

Last month I purchased a Kole Tang from my LFS and used the tank transfer method followed by observation in a 20 gallon long. I didn't use any meds during the quarantine. It was very shy throughout the process but is much more comfortable in the display.

 

[xeanliao]

I’ve quarantined two Kole Tangs in the last two years. They were both shy fish at first. And I found the easiest way to do it is to get them into a 20 gallon long Aqueon, with the back and sides blacked out, i used a black construction paper, a seeded oversized sponge filter, an egg crate top, heater, ammonia badge, and a small light on a timer. I used copper power at 4-5ppm and kept them in there for 72 days. Mark your water level for topping off each day.

Give them a nice big PVC pipe to chill in and they’re going to be great. I fed seaweed extreme pellets, and ocean nutrition green seaweed soaked in selcon.

So far, my experience on this little one seems like yours. Hopefully I can replicate your success. Question, I never use copper power, is it different from cuprimine? Is so, may I have more info about copper power, i.e, pro and cons vs cuprimine, and any recommendation to buy from?

 

[4FordFamily]

My yellow juvenile tang did not survive 48 hrs - straight from being healthy at LFS to QT with Cupramine in it - excellent water.
Copper was testing at half the recommended dose.

So will be curious about this thread and other success stories that are shared.

I was thinking of a 5 gal QT tank for just one tang, keep him there a few weeks to see if any problems, and try alternatives to copper for pre-treatment.
Worried that the small tank itself will cause stress, perhaps the 3 footer 30g would be better.

This sounds like ammonia poisoning. Or you used prime or amquel in conjunction with copper, two very critical errors that are not well-known (I’ve done it too).

 

[4FordFamily]

Hi, I got a Kole tang 5 days ago. She appears to be a very shy fish, either hiding when she see my shadow or bumping on the glass or chasing her own reflection in the corner. Finally yesterday, she started come out to eat occasionally. She look healthy that is a good relief.

Still, I am not risky my display tank by all means, I quarantine all new fishes and do preventive cuprimine treatment before release any to display tank. However, I read copper treatment could damage Kole tang.

What would you do to quarantine this type of tang without using cuprimine? lower dosage, or does it make sense to do preventive hypersalinity quarantine? or just observing she for longer period of time?

Hello,

I have sent several bristlooth tangs, including four Koles now (one currently for the second time) through copper at above fully therapeutic dose. I don’t find them to be a copper-sensitive fish at all. I have one in quarantine now that was coated in velvet 4 days ago and is now completely velvet free and miraculously beginning to eat again.

Anyway, tangs are not typically very copper-sensitive — which is good because they’re the fish that need copper treatment the most. Every once in awhile (perhaps one in ten yellow or 1 in 20 other zebrasoma tangs) cannot handle copper well, small yellow being the most common IME, followed by juvenile sailfin.

Anyway, definitely run fish through copper even if they show no symptoms. These fish are kept in subtherapuetic levels of copper throughout the distribution system which can subdue velvet or ich from taking over for about a month. Even if no spots show, they often have them in their gills. Kole can be pretty hardy and fight off disease well for some time, but add them to a tank full of more fragile tangs and they’ll behave as effective Typhoid Mary’s. Not a risk I’d take, considering nearly every fish you buy these days carry’s ich or velvet. Velvet is every bit as common, now.

Just my .02

 

[xeanliao]

Hello,

I have sent several bristlooth tangs, including four Koles now (one currently for the second time) through copper at above fully therapeutic dose. I don’t find them to be a copper-sensitive fish at all. I have one in quarantine now that was coated in velvet 4 days ago and is now completely velvet free and miraculously beginning to eat again.

Anyway, tangs are not typically very copper-sensitive — which is good because they’re the fish that need copper treatment the most. Every once in awhile (perhaps one in ten yellow or 1 in 20 other zebrasoma tangs) cannot handle copper well, small yellow being the most common IME, followed by juvenile sailfin.

Anyway, definitely run fish through copper even if they show no symptoms. These fish are kept in subtherapuetic levels of copper throughout the distribution system which can subdue velvet or ich from taking over for about a month. Even if no spots show, they often have them in their gills. Kole can be pretty hardy and fight off disease well for some time, but add them to a tank full of more fragile tangs and they’ll behave as effective Typhoid Mary’s. Not a risk I’d take, considering nearly every fish you buy these days carry’s ich or velvet. Velvet is every bit as common, now.

Just my .02

Do you use cupramine, or other type of copper treatments?

 

[Mark Derail]

Hello... Velvet is every bit as common, now.

Just my .02

I like hearing the success stories. One of my LFS has a few yellow tangs, some are much bigger, she said all the same price. So I'll try the largest one.
This time around it will be on it's own in the QT, and I will ramp up very slowly with Cupramine.

The first time, the 30g QT (filled to 20g) tested at 0.25 cu, wanting to ramp up to 0.5 (as per instructions), I acclimated the new tang with that water in a bowl first, then put him in.

The first day he did fine, the next morning I saw him munching on the seaweed and ate some brine shrimps mixed with Reef Frenzy.
The second morning he was floating dead.

I've lost two so far - the first from the ich or velvet outbreak in the DT which I did a full tear-down, then the second a small 2 inch yellow tang, that died.

For the third - I'm spooked.

 

[Isaac Alves]

So far, my experience on this little one seems like yours. Hopefully I can replicate your success. Question, I never use copper power, is it different from cuprimine? Is so, may I have more info about copper power, i.e, pro and cons vs cuprimine, and any recommendation to buy from?

Cupramine is an ionic form of copper. Copper Power, Coppersafe are chelated forms of copper. You can find a lot of info here on Reef2Reef about the molecular differences, etc. My experience is that Cupramine needs to be carefully administered. I've had bad luck with cupramine. I've had the greatest success with Copper Power (Chelated copper). From what I've read the chelated form is much gentler on the digestive system and to the fish overall. you can always ramp up the dosage over a couple of days if you don't see any signs of ick or velvet. I've treated General Cure at the same time prophylactically, as well as used Furan-2 with Copper Power during a very bad velvet outbreak that I'm sure helped control any secondary bacterial infections --- both times I've succeeded.

I'm extremely religious about quarantining now because of that velvet outbreak. Honestly, its a very good practice, it helps you get to the know the animal and the animal will get familiar with you. I brought my QT tank into my office the fish could see me constantly and I can monitor her...not sure if this makes any difference but I did notice my Spotted Kole Tank respond well to this and outgrow her timidness...but of course, the timidness is what gave her an awesome personality.

Just make sure you use API copper tests for Copperpower or Coppersafe. I've used this method with clowns, kole tangs, mandarin, lemon peel angel, wild caught salt mollies, neon goby, midas blenny, firefish, diamond sand sifting goby, cardinals, yellow tang, fox face, chromis. No casualties outside of being infected with Velvet and waiting too long to pull into the copper treatment.

 

[Isaac Alves]

Let me add that I only lost 3 fish during my velvet outbreak...all due to velvet at an advanced stage. The other animals were fully infected but in my copper power regimen, I was able to save all of the other fish who didn't already show signs of problematic breathing and lethargy.

 

[4FordFamily]

Do you use cupramine, or other type of copper treatments?

I’ve used coppersafe and cupramine. I’d say I slightly prefer chelated copper such as coppersafe at this point.

 

[Mark Derail]

Thanks guys you've gotten me less spooked. Will try in late Jan '18, going to finish my stand extension for the future DT upgrade first.

 

[xeanliao]

i put 1/4 cupramine dosage to the qt last night. this monning, found she is breathing heavily with swallon lip swimming slowly. while praparing moving she to anther establish 20 gallon observation/staging tank. She passed.

Given the fact she showed swallon lip today, i can not be sure its related to cupramine. this is the picture i look 10 mins after i spotted she is not moving. Do u see anything i can learn from this sad thing?

btw, when she still swimming right before she died, still very beautiful except swallon lip. the white circle showed up AFTER she died less than 20 min. wierd?

 

[mcpeachy]

This sounds like ammonia poisoning. Or you used prime or amquel in conjunction with copper, two very critical errors that are not well-known (I’ve done it too).

hello! i ran into this very old thread and have a question for you about ammonia poisoning! i realized just now that my QT had an excessive amounts of nitrites. I dont seem to be very successful at keeping bacterial in my QT. It was pretty high so I just put some of my other tank's water in there hoping bacteria takes over and turns the nitrites into nitrates. My fish seems to have velvet, so would you wait until the test shows not nitrites/ammonia before adding cupramine? And do you add the full dose right away or do you wait a few days to add the full dose? Its for my yellow eyed kole tang. thanks!

 

[4FordFamily]

hello! i ran into this very old thread and have a question for you about ammonia poisoning! i realized just now that my QT had an excessive amounts of nitrites. I dont seem to be very successful at keeping bacterial in my QT. It was pretty high so I just put some of my other tank's water in there hoping bacteria takes over and turns the nitrites into nitrates. My fish seems to have velvet, so would you wait until the test shows not nitrites/ammonia before adding cupramine? And do you add the full dose right away or do you wait a few days to add the full dose? Its for my yellow eyed kole tang. thanks!

I’d add biospira, make sure you have some media (not poly because it removes meds) like sponge or something for good bacteria to colonize. This has helped tremendously in quarantine. With velvet I wouldn’t wait to treat in copper I’d even do an acriflavine bath or freshwater dip if you don’t have that first for immediate relief as it is a horrific parasite that worsens so quickly.

 

[mcpeachy]

I’d add biospira, make sure you have some media (not poly because it removes meds) like sponge or something for good bacteria to colonize. This has helped tremendously in quarantine. With velvet I wouldn’t wait to treat in copper I’d even do an acriflavine bath or freshwater dip if you don’t have that first for immediate relief as it is a horrific parasite that worsens so quickly.

i think that's my issue. i have no idea what type of media i should have to add bacteria. I have no idea what you mean by a dip..? are we talking about fresh water dips? they scare me...should i not be scared by them?

 

[4FordFamily]

i think that's my issue. i have no idea what type of media i should have to add bacteria. I have no idea what you mean by a dip..? are we talking about fresh water dips? they scare me...should i not be scared by them?

Freshwater dips, they give fish immediate relief. If you match temperature a fish that doesn’t survive a dip was already a zombie fish.

You can buy sponge filter media on amazon, any porous media without poly fiber should work. Biospira is beneficial bacteria.