How to quick cycle/cheat

[SueAndHerZoo]

I've been reefing for about 15 years and always have 2 or 3 (OK, sometimes 5) tanks running at once. I had a tragic loss when I traveled a few weeks ago and have lost my motivation to keep the current tanks running, especially since I'll never know what went wrong while I was away. The only thing that makes me want to get excited and back into the hobby is the thought of having seahorses again, and as fate would have it, my LFS texted me to tell me he just got 3 seahorses in and did I want them. A sign from the Universe?

Anyway, I hesitate to put them in any of my existing tanks since I need to figure out what went wrong in them so I want to throw together a quick tank to go get the seahorses. I have a shed full of tanks and equipment, but I don't have the patience (I know, that's a key ingredient in this hobby but I've never had any/never will). How can I set up one of my empty tanks to be safe for a seahorse in 2-3 days? I'm thinking I would go barebottom (for now) but I have plenty of stuff I could put in there that has biological filtration on it. (Only one of my tanks had a major death toll while I was away, the other one is OK but full of predatory fish so can't put ponies in there).

Would live rock and daily water changes work? I'm thinking of setting up my empty 34 gallon AIO.

I know, bad idea to throw together a tank quickly but I can't stop myself!
Sue

 

[Spare time]

Live rock works but will bring pests. Otherwise, just buy an oversized bottle of cycling bacteria and you should be good to go. Alternatively, you can add the large bottle of cycling bacteria, turn the heat up to 82F or so, add some ammonium chloride or food, and "test" the bacteria out. You would ideally want to QT some hermits and snails and then add them after 30 days at 81F.

 

[brandon429]

Reef conventions do this and carry a hundred thousand dollars of animals in one tank for as many days as the convention runs then they skip cycle the unsold items back home, never cycling one time

Your goal is three small seahorses, that's easy.

Move live rock from another reef into this tank and it's done. Don't do any testing, just move it, because it always works and mis testing will have you dumping in things that mess up the clean start.

Only use live rock that comes from a running reef tank or a vat at the pet store marked live rock, get some with coralline on it. That's guaranteed skip cycle rock. If you do any other way its not guaranteed.

Beginning any tank without fallow and qt steps is begging for a disease Wipeout in six months, the cycle isn't your risk

 

[brandon429]

an entire thread with your exact request in the title then about fifty jobs doing the exact request:

A thread tracking pure skip cycle instant reefs, no bottle bac

THE GOLDEN EXAMPLE OF A SKIP CYCLE DAY 1 REEF https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/octo-high-end-sps-skip-cycle-build.713256/ read that entire thread before you read ours. that's the heart of skip cycling. Everything we do going forward in this thread reflects on that ability above, in the #1...

www.reef2reef.com

how much testing did we do in that thread: zero

how much bottle bacteria did we use: zero

how many failed cycles were there: zero

it's easy to do what you want to do, sellers at reef conventions kept it hidden from the buyers for a reason.

 

[SueAndHerZoo]

Live rock works but will bring pests. Otherwise, just buy an oversized bottle of cycling bacteria and you should be good to go. Alternatively, you can add the large bottle of cycling bacteria, turn the heat up to 82F or so, add some ammonium chloride or food, and "test" the bacteria out. You would ideally want to QT some hermits and snails and then add them after 30 days at 81F.

Makes sense, but am confused about adding QT'd snails after 30 days at 81F. Why do I want the QT to be at 81?

 

[SueAndHerZoo]

Reef conventions do this and carry a hundred thousand dollars of animals in one tank for as many days as the convention runs then they skip cycle the unsold items back home, never cycling one time

Your goal is three small seahorses, that's easy.

Move live rock from another reef into this tank and it's done. Don't do any testing, just move it, because it always works and mis testing will have you dumping in things that mess up the clean start.

Only use live rock that comes from a running reef tank or a vat at the pet store marked live rock, get some with coralline on it. That's guaranteed skip cycle rock. If you do any other way its not guaranteed.

Beginning any tank without fallow and qt steps is begging for a disease Wipeout in six months, the cycle isn't your risk

Wow - fascinating and exciting! I'm off to go do a ton of reading on that thread but I just texted my LFS guy and told him to mark the 3 horses "SOLD". THANK YOU!

 

[Spare time]

Makes sense, but am confused about adding QT'd snails after 30 days at 81F. Why do I want the QT to be at 81?

81F just speeds up the life cycle of common diseases in reef tanks so that they can die from there being no hosts around.

 

[brandon429]

you have many unspoken variables in your challenge that have nothing to do with cycling, another big one beyond skipping disease preps is that LFS typically hold fish at low salinity so that latent disease won't express/can't sell the animals

then someone takes them home and either adds them to reef salinity, shocking them, or they bag float them and harm them with still too-quick of a shock and ammonia stress from inside the bag, not from the reef tank. the challenges of instant reefing have nothing to do with the cycle

horses will be especially delicate compared to most

 

[vetteguy53081]

Makes sense, but am confused about adding QT'd snails after 30 days at 81F. Why do I want the QT to be at 81?

You dont want 81 degrees especially for snails which prefer cooler temps of 76-78
Seahorse tank is a basic setup with objects to wrap their tail around such as plastic chain links or gorgonians, live rock and subtle water flow and basic filtration. Live rocks help with water stability and bacterial needs

 

[SueAndHerZoo]

81F just speeds up the life cycle of common diseases in reef tanks so that they can die from there being no hosts around.

Ahhhh, OK, I thought you were saying to keep the snails at 81 degrees for 30 days.

 

[SueAndHerZoo]

You dont want 81 degrees especially for snails which prefer cooler temps of 76-78
Seahorse tank is a basic setup with objects to wrap their tail around such as plastic chain links or gorgonians, live rock and subtle water flow and basic filtration. Live rocks help with water stability and bacterial needs

Thank you for the reminders. I've had seahorses in the past, even successfully bred them, but it's been a few years. I'm thinking going bare-bottom (which I've never done before) so I can siphon the bottom and keep it cleaner. The only drawback there is I can't have any/many members of a clean-up crew, right?

I'm cleaning out a 14 gallon right now and will pick up the ponies in a day or two (they are very small but eating frozen nicely - they've been at the LFS (owned by a friend of mine) for about 10 days. In a tank that small I can easily do daily water changes and keep an eye on things in there while I figure out which of my bigger tanks to eventually move the growing ponies into. I'd much rather get them home sooner rather than later because I'm sure the LFS doesn't know as much about seahorses as I do, and that came from him. It's a gamble if they are better off in a small, clean, bare-bottom here with me while I ready a bigger tank or if they are better off staying at the store.
Sue

 

[SueAndHerZoo]

I'm still reading the other "cycling" thread but I haven't seen mention of this yet: do I want to use any of the water from an established tank or is the "good stuff" only on the rock and sand)? In the past I've read conflicting opinions on that.
Sue

 

[brandon429]

Those were brand new tanks they had no old water to use. It's the rock that has what you need. Reef water from other tanks does have filter bacteria suspended in it, we just don't need any. Rocks are enough to build an entire reef tank on day 1 given control over all other hidden variables.

 

[SueAndHerZoo]

Those were brand new tanks they had no old water to use. It's the rock that has what you need. Reef water from other tanks does have filter bacteria suspended in it, we just don't need any. Rocks are enough to build an entire reef tank on day 1 given control over all other hidden variables.

Thanks. What kind of clean up crew would live in a bare-bottom tank?
Sue

 

[brandon429]

I don't use them/ unable to recommend
Cuc don't do much other than add waste to the system. Source for statement: the nuisance algae forum where eighty currently wrecked tanks already have a cuc and are still wrecked and usually even the beyond methods aren't working, see the multiple page attempts underway

If cuc's worked other than from one person testimony (got lucky) that entire forum would have no tanks to fix.

 

[Spare time]

You dont want 81 degrees especially for snails which prefer cooler temps of 76-78
Seahorse tank is a basic setup with objects to wrap their tail around such as plastic chain links or gorgonians, live rock and subtle water flow and basic filtration. Live rocks help with water stability and bacterial needs

I've kept snails at this temperature without issue. It depends on the snail species.

 

[vetteguy53081]

I've kept snails at this temperature without issue. It depends on the snail species.

Agree- they prefer cooler but not crucial as many tanks reach 82 with no effect on snails

 

[SueAndHerZoo]

Next question regarding next step/permanent SH tank:
I'm picking them up tomorrow and they will be staying in a very small tank while I get their 72 gallon ready for them. Regarding the small tank, I talked to the LFS owner and he checked the current salinity for me so I could have mine match: 1.023. Temp is 71, testing shows it's ready for them (hopefully they will only be in there a week at the most).

Currently my 72 gallon has tons of live rock, a fairly deep sandbed, a sump/refugium, reactors, skimmer. It's got 4 large aggressive fish that will be moved to my 90 gallon. Then I will drain all the water out, remove ALL the sand, scrub the tank, and refill it with fresh salted water and most of the live rock that came out of it. Will there be any sort of cycle? See any snags or flaws in my plan? Thanks in advance.
Sue

 

[Spare time]

Next question regarding next step/permanent SH tank:
I'm picking them up tomorrow and they will be staying in a very small tank while I get their 72 gallon ready for them. Regarding the small tank, I talked to the LFS owner and he checked the current salinity for me so I could have mine match: 1.023. Temp is 71, testing shows it's ready for them (hopefully they will only be in there a week at the most).

Currently my 72 gallon has tons of live rock, a fairly deep sandbed, a sump/refugium, reactors, skimmer. It's got 4 large aggressive fish that will be moved to my 90 gallon. Then I will drain all the water out, remove ALL the sand, scrub the tank, and refill it with fresh salted water and most of the live rock that came out of it. Will there be any sort of cycle? See any snags or flaws in my plan? Thanks in advance.
Sue

As long as the rock is kept wet, then no it should be fine.

 

[Garf]

Cuc don't do much other than add waste to the system.

That’s illogical.