I hate my sump

[dR3ws3r]

I think the title says it all. Sumps can be such a PITA to do anything with as the room is so tight.

I replaced my original AquaForest Sump with a Hamahli sump, and although it provided some improvements, overall it has flaws for me. So let me start with what is going on, and hopefully people can give me advice on what to do.

I have a 155 gallon internal overflow tank. If you look at the plumbing coming out of the bottom of the tank from left to right, I have a left side return to tank, main drain with valve, emergency drain, and right side return to tank. If this is standard, how do people plumb this in terms of the two return to tank lines. As one is on the left and one is on the right, and the return pump is on the right, how do you plumb from the return pump to the return line on the left. You either have to go behind the drain lines, or in front of the drain lines. Either way, it is a difficulty. Does anyone have some suggestions?




Leaks .... so many times. I think my left return to tank line check valve is either stuck or has an issue. The fittings around it will start to leak when the pump vibrates after shutting down, and then sometimes they don't. I have taken it apart, and that is a major headache even with unions, and resealed them several times. I have tried to use silicon lubricant on the seals, light pressure, heavy pressure, etc. It has been a problem. There is salt creep all over the fixtures that come from the tank, so I know things are not sealed well.

I need to replace that check valve, or remove it altogether, so I am thinking about how I want to plumb it going forward.

I think I made several choices that I am regretting. First the original plumbing was all 3/4", and I had the bright idea to go to 1". Not that 1" is a big deal, but it increases the size of all the unions and valves and limits a tight space by taking up even more space.

I hated the layout of the original sump because the return pumps were squeezed way in the back, and it had the ATO as part of the sump, taking up a huge amount of real estate. I put an IM ATO to the right of the tank, and that has given me a little more room in the sump area.

I also added a manifold, which I only use one valve of, and that takes up a lot of space with all the 1" fittings, unions and valves. If I redo the plumbing, I think I will either limit it to a single valve, or remove it altogether.

The Hamahli sump is acrylic and has lips (sort of like euro bracing I guess), all around it. The idea is that it makes things quieter and more tidy, but I find that I don't like that. The return pump has to be "screwed" into the fitting on the sump and then the sump plumbing attached to that fitting. With Sicce 6 or 7 return pump, I cannot fit two return pumps, ( my preference) in the sump and connect to both fittings. There just isn't enough room. And attaching the pump to the fitting on the sump, is like an exact science. Despite using some flexible hosing between the pump and fitting, I have to have everything lined up just right to get it in there, and not dangle, or not press up against the fitting. There is no way to fit two return pumps in there and attach them both to the two return fittings that sit in the right hand corner.

The sump lips are not compatible with all the aftermarket attachments as they all hook onto the side of the sump, and there are lips in the way. To install the red sea reef mat 500 I had to cut all sorts of lips off and holes in the sump too. That isn't too bad, but it is just another example of these custom sumps not really working well with aftermarket gadgets. The Himahli has two holes in the top of their return section for custom reactors, but those reactors don't even have foam tops or anything to keep the media from exiting the reactor, so you have to be really careful with your flow. I just don't use them and could probably drop something in that space instead if I wanted to cut the top off.

The edges for all the acrylic cutouts are so dang sharp too. Any time I have to get in there and do anything, I wind up with all these little cuts and scratches on my fingers and arms that should not be going back into the water.

Does anybody have any suggestions or thoughts on how I can make this nightmare any better. Changing that check valve is going to be a whole day event with water all over the place, and lots of swearing. I just don't want to do it lol.

I'm having trouble attaching photos for some reason. Every time I drop a phone in, it says "oops" something went wrong. I have included photos before, so I don't know if this is a website issue, or a new "feature".

 

[mfinn]

You have a lot of issues going on.
That makes it hard to figure out where to start.
One consistent issue I hear is you hate the new sump like you did the old one.
So that is where I think you should start.
Contact a acrylic tank maker and have a new custom sump made.
Measure the space carefully. Measure the opening carefully. That will decide how big you can go.
Some places will help you design one and maybe even help you figure out piping.
But you have to plan it in advance.
Maybe someone in a local club, or even a Facebook group.

 

[dR3ws3r]

You have a lot of issues going on.
That makes it hard to figure out where to start.
One consistent issue I hear is you hate the new sump like you did the old one.
So that is where I think you should start.
Contact a acrylic tank maker and have a new custom sump made.
Measure the space carefully. Measure the opening carefully. That will decide how big you can go.
Some places will help you design one and maybe even help you figure out piping.
But you have to plan it in advance.
Maybe someone in a local club, or even a Facebook group.

There are factors they have in common, but I don't dislike them for the same reasons. The original sump had less room because of the built in ATO, and the water path was circular, (back left, front left, front right, back right. The new sump is just left to right, with no built in ATO, which I do like. Each one has its own pros and cons, and spacing is always an issue with below tank sumps I would guess.

I just wanted to know a few things, like how do people plumb around the drain lines to the return line when they are in the way, and things of that nature.

A custom sump might work, but sumps are pretty expensive to start with. I'm not sure changing the layout will allow me to plumb like I want. It sure seems like this subject is like building a new home, everything looks good, but then when you move in, you see all the things that are not functional and you would change.

Just curious, could you see the attached photos?

 

[mfinn]

Just curious, could you see the attached photos?

No pics

 

[get-salty]

There are no photos my man

 

[dR3ws3r]

However I try to add them I get the following error:

Oops! We ran into some problems.
Oops! We ran into some problems.

Can you guys add a photo in a reply? I tried the insert image and it initially puts the photo in the message, then switches to the error message.

When I attach files, they show up as grayed out.

 

[mfinn]

However I try to add them I get the following error:

Oops! We ran into some problems.
Oops! We ran into some problems.

Can you guys add a photo in a reply? I tried the insert image and it initially puts the photo in the message, then switches to the error message.

When I attach files, they show up as grayed out.

send me one in a pm. I'll try to post it.

 

[PPBlimpy]

Sounds like its time to build your own custom sump.

Photos will help for sure.

When it comes to your one way valve, I have never had luck with them. I always have an anti syphon hole drilled and have stopped running the check valves. They not only are unreliable but also block a lot of flow.

On tank I have set up I always hard plumb my overflows and use a pair of unions at each side with a ball vlave between the union and the bulkhead

for my returns I hard plumb also. I do utilize a manifold also but generally drop down to 1/2" plumbing since most everything underneath can be ran on 1/2 or 3/8 tube.

I run 2 pumps, 1 has the manifold circuit on it and the other generally has a UV sterilizer inline.

What are the dimensions of your stand? would you be willing to tackle building your own sump?

 

[13rodo]

I think the title says it all. Sumps can be such a PITA to do anything with as the room is so tight.

I replaced my original AquaForest Sump with a Hamahli sump, and although it provided some improvements, overall it has flaws for me. So let me start with what is going on, and hopefully people can give me advice on what to do.

I have a 155 gallon internal overflow tank. If you look at the plumbing coming out of the bottom of the tank from left to right, I have a left side return to tank, main drain with valve, emergency drain, and right side return to tank. If this is standard, how do people plumb this in terms of the two return to tank lines. As one is on the left and one is on the right, and the return pump is on the right, how do you plumb from the return pump to the return line on the left. You either have to go behind the drain lines, or in front of the drain lines. Either way, it is a difficulty. Does anyone have some suggestions?




Leaks .... so many times. I think my left return to tank line check valve is either stuck or has an issue. The fittings around it will start to leak when the pump vibrates after shutting down, and then sometimes they don't. I have taken it apart, and that is a major headache even with unions, and resealed them several times. I have tried to use silicon lubricant on the seals, light pressure, heavy pressure, etc. It has been a problem. There is salt creep all over the fixtures that come from the tank, so I know things are not sealed well.

I need to replace that check valve, or remove it altogether, so I am thinking about how I want to plumb it going forward.

I think I made several choices that I am regretting. First the original plumbing was all 3/4", and I had the bright idea to go to 1". Not that 1" is a big deal, but it increases the size of all the unions and valves and limits a tight space by taking up even more space.

I hated the layout of the original sump because the return pumps were squeezed way in the back, and it had the ATO as part of the sump, taking up a huge amount of real estate. I put an IM ATO to the right of the tank, and that has given me a little more room in the sump area.

I also added a manifold, which I only use one valve of, and that takes up a lot of space with all the 1" fittings, unions and valves. If I redo the plumbing, I think I will either limit it to a single valve, or remove it altogether.

The Hamahli sump is acrylic and has lips (sort of like euro bracing I guess), all around it. The idea is that it makes things quieter and more tidy, but I find that I don't like that. The return pump has to be "screwed" into the fitting on the sump and then the sump plumbing attached to that fitting. With Sicce 6 or 7 return pump, I cannot fit two return pumps, ( my preference) in the sump and connect to both fittings. There just isn't enough room. And attaching the pump to the fitting on the sump, is like an exact science. Despite using some flexible hosing between the pump and fitting, I have to have everything lined up just right to get it in there, and not dangle, or not press up against the fitting. There is no way to fit two return pumps in there and attach them both to the two return fittings that sit in the right hand corner.

The sump lips are not compatible with all the aftermarket attachments as they all hook onto the side of the sump, and there are lips in the way. To install the red sea reef mat 500 I had to cut all sorts of lips off and holes in the sump too. That isn't too bad, but it is just another example of these custom sumps not really working well with aftermarket gadgets. The Himahli has two holes in the top of their return section for custom reactors, but those reactors don't even have foam tops or anything to keep the media from exiting the reactor, so you have to be really careful with your flow. I just don't use them and could probably drop something in that space instead if I wanted to cut the top off.

The edges for all the acrylic cutouts are so dang sharp too. Any time I have to get in there and do anything, I wind up with all these little cuts and scratches on my fingers and arms that should not be going back into the water.

Does anybody have any suggestions or thoughts on how I can make this nightmare any better. Changing that check valve is going to be a whole day event with water all over the place, and lots of swearing. I just don't want to do it lol.

I'm having trouble attaching photos for some reason. Every time I drop a phone in, it says "oops" something went wrong. I have included photos before, so I don't know if this is a website issue, or a new "feature".

Honestly I’d never rely on a check valve for the back siphon. I adjust the return so it breaks the siphon where I want it to. You can also make a small hole in the tank side of the return so even if the nozzle gets bumped you know it’ll break.

 

[dR3ws3r]

Sump pics try 299.

 

[Evil1]

However I try to add them I get the following error:

Oops! We ran into some problems.
Oops! We ran into some problems.

Can you guys add a photo in a reply? I tried the insert image and it initially puts the photo in the message, then switches to the error message.

When I attach files, they show up as grayed out.

Log out then back in. This should clear up the oops! Problem of attaching pictures

 

[Gumbies R Us]

@BeanAnimal