Kalk in RODI vs Saltwater

[HuduVudu]

Forgive me if I might request some evidence.

What is evidence for you?

Can you point to a single post you have made prior to today where you say you currently dose calcium hydroxide dissolved in seawater?

No one has yet to ask me. I asked about powder dosing here and got nothing. That is about as close as it comes. It is sure to come up on my build thread as I start to build out my new system. Getting dogpilled isn't fun so I wouldn't bring it up on my own.

 

[HuduVudu]

The answer to my question is RODI, but all this excitement has inspired another question! What if I did continuous auto water changes and I just wanted to boost the alk/ph of my salt mix that has yet to go in tank, just be a little. Would this work?

Maybe this will help me for this add on q, would I get all the ph boost but less alk and less ca? As I add more kalk to saltwater which do I lose and which do I keep from useful forms of Ca Alk and ph? Or is there no amount I can add where I am keeping all 3 and this is a bad idea?

There is a way to do this, but I am reluctant to discuss it here because being Galleo sux. If you want PM me.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

What is evidence for you?

I told you. Any post before today where you say you dose solid calcium hydroxide dissolved in seawater.

In any case, it is not preferred or necessary to dose that way, and it carries concerns.

If you or someone else does it (out of thousands of reefers that post what methods they use and that do not include adding calcium hydroxide dissolved in seawater) that does not make it desirable.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

There is a way to do this, but I am reluctant to discuss it here because being Galleo sux. If you want PM me.

lol

Better keep it secret. The light of day will burn it.

 

[HuduVudu]

I told you. Any post before today where you say you dose solid calcium hydroxide dissolved in seawater.

So seeing my aquarium isn't proof. Only what I have said on this board? Ok so here is my post asking about powder dosers:

How to dose ...

Any ideas on how to dose powders? @Randy Holmes-Farley

www.reef2reef.com

If you or someone else does it (out of thousands of reefers that post what methods they use and that do not include adding calcium hydroxide dissolved in seawater) that does not make it desirable.

According to whom? You? God? Whom? Who gets to say what is desirable or not? And desirable does not mean right.

 

[HuduVudu]

lol

Better keep it secret. The light of day will burn it.

Would you like a picture of what the light of day would burn or are you afraid because you have long ago given up on the desire to actually solve problems related to salt water aquariums.

There really should be an ignore button for you because you are a bully and nothing more. I am shocked at your reputation. You are really really far from that rep.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

According to whom? You? God? Whom? Who gets to say what is desirable or not? And desirable does not mean right.

"Desirable" is obviously an opinion. Your opinion is obviously different than mine.

Seeing the opinions and the reasons behind them, folks can decide for themselves how to care for their tanks.

 

[RobB'z Reef]

The answer to my question is RODI, but all this excitement has inspired another question! What if I did continuous auto water changes and I just wanted to boost the alk/ph of my salt mix that has yet to go in tank, just be a little. Would this work?

Maybe this will help me for this add on q, would I get all the ph boost but less alk and less ca? As I add more kalk to saltwater which do I lose and which do I keep from useful forms of Ca Alk and ph? Or is there no amount I can add where I am keeping all 3 and this is a bad idea?

The way you worded that question is a bit confusing but what i think you're asking is will you get a boost from doing auto water changes to your alk/CA in addition to using kalk in your top off water? The answer is yes to a percentage of the difference in total system volume vs how much you are changing on a daily basis. I'd have to sit down and think hard thru the math but basically it would be mixing two solutions at differing levels where your fresh sea water would contain a slightly higher level. In practice if your daily kalk demand was pretty low and your water change % was higher you might see a noticeable difference but in reality I don't think you would need to worry about this unless you're getting near daily zero evaporation from your tank and your alk demands were insanely high. Dosing kalk thru rodi can go a long ways.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

So seeing my aquarium isn't proof. Only what I have said on this board? Ok so here is my post asking about powder dosers:

How to dose ...

Any ideas on how to dose powders? @Randy Holmes-Farley

www.reef2reef.com

Of course not. You are asking about dosing some unknown solid.

Folks have been asking about dosing solid calcium hydroxide for more than 25 years. I've been asked dozens of times. That does not mean folks have found it to be an optimal process, or that anyone continues to do it if they actually tried.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

The way you worded that question is a bit confusing but what i think you're asking is will you get a boost from doing auto water changes to your alk/CA in addition to using kalk in your top off water? The answer is yes to a percentage of the difference in total system volume vs how much you are changing on a daily basis. I'd have to sit down and think hard thru the math but basically it would be mixing two solutions at differing levels where your fresh sea water would contain a slightly higher level. In practice if your daily kalk demand was pretty low and your water change % was higher you might see a noticeable difference but in reality I don't think you would need to worry about this unless you're getting near daily zero evaporation from your tank and your alk demands were insanely high. Dosing kalk thru rodi can go a long ways.

One can certainly boost alk and calcium in new salt water, within reason, but calcium hydroxide is not the best way to do it.

Even the normal high alk and calcium mixes (like Red Sea Coral Pro) are not very stable and will precipitation calcium carbonate if stirred too long).

But if you want to boost alk and calcium, you do not also want to boost pH, as that will hyper-accelerate precipitation. Baking soda and calcium chloride would be the optimal way to boost calcium and alk while minimizing precipitation in new salt water (or aquarium water, for that matter).

 

[HuduVudu]

Seeing the opinions and the reasons behind them, folks can decide for themselves how to care for their tanks.

Yah, so why don't you let them?

 

[RobB'z Reef]

One can certainly boost alk and calcium in new salt water, within reason, but calcium hydroxide is not the best way to do it.

Even the normal high alk and calcium mixes (like Red Sea Coral Pro) are not very stable and will precipitation calcium carbonate if stirred too long).

But if you want to boost alk and calcium, you do not also want to boost pH, as that will hyper-accelerate precipitation. Baking soda and calcium chloride would be the optimal way to boost calcium and alk while minimizing precipitation in new salt water (or aquarium water, for that matter).

I don't think i was trying to say that. Perhaps I worded it poorly. I wasn't speaking to dosing kalk directly to sea water. I'll let you answer her question haha! I'm still learning the sciency parts I guess, I just thought she was asking if adding new sea water through water changes would raise levels and I thought the basic premise was yes.

 

[LadyTang2]

In my mind, I envision this figure speaking when I read Randy's posts. He's the man.

 

[HuduVudu]

Of course not. You are asking about dosing some unknown solid.

Of course because saying exactly what I was dosing for would get me torn apart for being stupid.

You are seriously part of the problem.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

here's the similar asked to me from 2006, and the answer is the same then as today

Put kalk powder straight in ASW? - Reef Central Online Community

Put kalk powder straight in ASW? The Reef Chemistry Forum

www.reefcentral.com

" Would it be acceptable to add Calcium Hydroxide powder straight to my mixing bucket of ASW, giving it time to fully aerate and re-establish the carbonic acid/atmospheric CO2 equilibrium, in order to produce ASW that has acceptable Calc/Alk levels before it ever goes into my tank? "

My answer then:

"
The problem with adding lime is several fold. Primary is that the pH will get too high for any reasonable rise in calcium. Second, the alkalinity will rise by 1 meq/L for each 20 ppm rise in calcium. So boosting calcium by 100 ppm push alk through the roof.

So I'd boost it with calcium chloride, and either not worry about the alk (which at 2.8 meq/L is not bad), or add a little baking soda. "

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Of course because saying exactly what I was dosing for would get me torn apart for being stupid.

You are seriously part of the problem.

Others asked it many times over the years. They got a detailed chemical explanation of the issue, like the one above.

No one is ever torn apart by me for asking a question.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I don't think i was trying to say that. Perhaps I worded it poorly. I wasn't speaking to dosing kalk directly to sea water. I'll let you answer her question haha! I'm still learning the sciency parts I guess, I just thought she was asking if adding new sea water through water changes would raise levels and I thought the basic premise was yes.

Yes, doing water changes with a salt mix that has higher alk or calcium than the tank will boost those levels.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Yah, so why don't you let them?

Let who do what?

You are welcome to post any opinion you want. I never block or delete folks posts, unless they break the Terms of Service rules.

i certainly have no control over what folks do with the information posted.

The Reef Chemistry Forum: think of it like Thunderdome for chemistry ideas. Many enter, not all survive (including some of mine). lol

 

[RobB'z Reef]

Let who do what?

You are welcome to post any opinion you want. I never block or delete folks posts, unless they break the Terms of Service rules.

i certainly have no control over what folks do with the information posted.

The Reef Chemistry Forum: think of it like Thunderdome for chemistry ideas. Many enter, not all survive (including some of mine). lol

 

[HuduVudu]

No one is ever torn apart by me for asking a question.

YOU are the least of my concerns in posting on this board.

The problem with adding lime is several fold. Primary is that the pH will get too high for any reasonable rise in calcium. Second, the alkalinity will rise by 1 meq/L for each 20 ppm rise in calcium. So boosting calcium by 100 ppm push alk through the roof.

Once again reasonable. If for someone for some reason this might be something that solves a problem then they should do it, regardless of how many people do it.

Giving information dispells doubt. Making assumptions without stating those assumptions and giving a hard and fast yes/no answers shuts down information flow and causes people to fear. Gee the really "smart" guy said it was bad and I don't understand it so I won't do it. Not everyone is like that and no one should make assumptions that they are.