Kalk stirrer potency

[BAMatter]

What’s the reasoning behind kalk stirrers not producing water with a fully saturated PH potency?

 

[Sisterlimonpot]

What’s the reasoning behind kalk stirrers not producing water with a fully saturated PH potency?

I've been asking that question as well. I think the people that say that, haven't fully explored the possibilities.

Although, I can see how they came to that conclusion. There are reactors out there that only stir on occasion and if you pass enough rodi water through the reactor, it's going to dilute potency. Which means to solve that, you simply increase stirring times, or get a stirrer that maintains a cloud.

The other thing that gives reactors a bad name is passing water through that has high c02 will deplete potency as well, and it's harder to maintain saturation. But that's a source water issue not a kalk reactor issue.

I personally use a pH probe to monitor my kalk pH and get a push notification when it gets too low.

My reactor does a good job with maintaining potency.

 

[BAMatter]

I've been asking that question as well. I think the people that say that, haven't fully explored the possibilities.

Although, I can see how they came to that conclusion. There are reactors out there that only stir on occasion and if you pass enough rodi water through the reactor, it's going to dilute potency. Which means to solve that, you simply increase stirring times, or get a stirrer that maintains a cloud.

The other thing that gives reactors a bad name is passing water through that has high c02 will deplete potency as well, and it's harder to maintain saturation. But that's a source water issue not a kalk reactor issue.

I personally use a pH probe to monitor my kalk pH and get a push notification when it gets too low.

My reactor does a good job with maintaining potency.

What’s your stir schedule and do you use a standard PH probe in the reactor? Trying to research the best way to set one up…

 

[Sisterlimonpot]

What’s your stir schedule and do you use a standard PH probe in the reactor? Trying to research the best way to set one up…

Mine is a bit overkill, I'm a tinkerer, and couldn't find anything that fit my needs so like everything else, I made my own.



It uses a stand alone processor to monitor tank and kalk pH and dose kalk according to how I have it programmed. The pH probe is a atlas scientific probe.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

What’s the reasoning behind kalk stirrers not producing water with a fully saturated PH potency?

You mean why do they often produce less than saturated water, or how do we know it?

 

[BAMatter]

You mean why do they often produce less than saturated water, or how do we know it?

Primarily why do they produce less saturated water…

And in terms of knowing it, can you just put a PH probe in the vessel with the end of it at the top where the kalk is not settled out and the water that is being pushed out is monitored?

 

[BAMatter]

Mine is a bit overkill, I'm a tinkerer, and couldn't find anything that fit my needs so like everything else, I made my own.



It uses a stand alone processor to monitor tank and kalk pH and dose kalk according to how I have it programmed. The pH probe is an atlas scientific probe.

That’s pretty sweet…

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

pH is a very crude measure of potency and should only be used to compare to a for sure saturated solution using the same probe and calibration. A difference of 0.3 pH units is a 50% drop in potency.

Conductivity is the best way to gauge potency. Saturation is about 10.3 mS/cm.

I suspect the issue is as simple as continually adding new water and trying to remove saturated water without any particulates is a tricky balance between dissolution and settling rates of particles.

 

[Sisterlimonpot]

That’s pretty sweet…

One of the nice things about the controller is the ability to calibrate the pH probe slope to 10.00 and 12.46.

The atlas scientific probe uses a tyvek frit that doesn't seem to clog when it's constantly submerged in calcium hydroxide.

 

[BAMatter]

pH is a very crude measure of potency and should only be used to compare to a for sure saturated solution using the same probe and calibration. A difference of 0.3 pH units is a 50% drop in potency.

Conductivity is the best way to gauge potency. Saturation is about 10.3 mS/cm.

I suspect the issue is as simple as continually adding new water and trying to remove saturated water without any particulates is a tricky balance between dissolution and settling rates of particles.

@Randy Holmes-Farley is there a handheld conductivity probe you recommend that wont break the bank? I’m not ready to integrate one into my Hydros setup since it will require an X10 purchase to add to my existing collective and that’s a rabbit hole I’m avoiding at the time being…

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

@Randy Holmes-Farley is there a handheld conductivity probe you recommend that wont break the bank? I’m not ready to integrate one into my Hydros setup since it will require an X10 purchase to add to my existing collective and that’s a rabbit hole I’m avoiding at the time being…

I've not really looked to pick one, but you'd want to be sure that 10.3 mS/cm is within the range (and not right at the extreme of the range).

It could read in TDS (there 's not a perfect conversion, so TDS is a less desirable unit since the device is converting from measured mS/cm), but if so, you'd want to read in the 5,000-10,000 or more ppm range.

 

[Natural_Reefer]

I am having similar questions/concern but haven't gotten a simple solution to this. However, I have a pH probe in the stirrer and appears to work OK. Usually Freshly clean stirrer and new Kalkwasser have pH of 12.3-12.4, I would add more Kalkwasser when it drop from 12.0 to 11.9
The pH would stayed drop rather quickly with the chamber full of spent Kalkwasser (then I would clean the chamber and start over).
How about his Milwaukee to monitor Conductivity?

https://milwaukeeinstruments.com/milwaukee-mw301-pro-conductivity-meter/

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

I am having similar questions/concern but haven't gotten a simple solution to this. However, I have a pH probe in the stirrer and appears to work OK. Usually Freshly clean stirrer and new Kalkwasser have pH of 12.3-12.4, I would add more Kalkwasser when it drop from 12.0 to 11.9
The pH would stayed drop rather quickly with the chamber full of spent Kalkwasser (then I would clean the chamber and start over).
How about his Milwaukee to monitor Conductivity?

https://milwaukeeinstruments.com/milwaukee-mw301-pro-conductivity-meter/

The problem with pH for limewater potency is precision of the measurement.

The true pH of saturated kalkwasser at 25 deg C is about 12.45.

If the pH drops to 12.15, it is only about 50% saturated.

Thus, the errors in pH measurement add up to big errors in potency.

The milwaukee has too low of range. 1,990 uS/cm = 1.99 mS/cm

 

[BAMatter]

I am having similar questions/concern but haven't gotten a simple solution to this. However, I have a pH probe in the stirrer and appears to work OK. Usually Freshly clean stirrer and new Kalkwasser have pH of 12.3-12.4, I would add more Kalkwasser when it drop from 12.0 to 11.9
The pH would stayed drop rather quickly with the chamber full of spent Kalkwasser (then I would clean the chamber and start over).
How about his Milwaukee to monitor Conductivity?

https://milwaukeeinstruments.com/milwaukee-mw301-pro-conductivity-meter/

That was the one I was looking at as well, but @Randy Holmes-Farley mentioned to not get one where the 10.3 would be at an extreme end, which I’m “assuming” is because it reads from 0-1990, unless I’m looking at it incorrectly. I was hoping the one that read 0-10 would suffice even though the .3 would not be readable… the search continues I guess.

Edit: I’m spinning looking at all of these lol

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

That was the one I was looking at as well, but @Randy Holmes-Farley mentioned to not get one where the 10.3 would be at an extreme end, which I’m “assuming” is because it reads from 0-1990, unless I’m looking at it incorrectly. I was hoping the one that read 0-10 would suffice even though the .3 would not be readable… the search continues I guess.

Edit: I’m spinning looking at all of these lol

But the noted device only goes to 1.99 mS/cm

 

[BAMatter]

But the noted device only goes to 1.99 mS/cm

Yep. I’m getting my ms and us confused lol. May have found something on Amazon that does continuous monitoring. How does this one look?

https://a.co/d/0K7gMcO

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Yep. I’m getting my ms and us confused lol. May have found something on Amazon that does continuous monitoring. How does this one look?

https://a.co/d/0K7gMcO

I don't know anything about it except it's claimed range is adequate for limewater potency and tank salinity.

 

[Natural_Reefer]

The problem with pH for limewater potency is precision of the measurement.

The true pH of saturated kalkwasser at 25 deg C is about 12.45.

If the pH drops to 12.15, it is only about 50% saturated.

Thus, the errors in pH measurement add up to big errors in potency.

The milwaukee has too low of range. 1,990 uS/cm = 1.99 mS/cm

Yes, I understand the issues with accuracy and potency but it is a enough good visual aid for me to know when to add/change Kalkwasser.
I also calculated/estimated the amount of Kalkwasser consumption seem to align.
It is working for me so far as my Alkalinity is within +/-0.2 most of the time.

 

[Natural_Reefer]

But the noted device only goes to 1.99 mS/cm

Thank you! I guess the search is continuing...

 

[BAMatter]

Thank you! I guess the search is continuing...

Found this on Amazon I may try.

https://a.co/d/4L13gvw