LED versus MH Testing - By Steven Pro

[Troylee]

they claim the 101 to be a direct replacement for 150w metal halide..... brightness plays no role here i know that for a fact a par meter will show that..... i have 2 tanks going one litl by a 250w mh it looks 100 times brighter than my other display that has 150 three watt cree leds but my led tank will cook any coral i put there all day long if i crank the leds..... the look's of leds are very deceiving they don't look bright but let me tell you i can fry some sticks that just got pulled out from a 250w mh in a matter of 3 days under a dim looking led.....

 

[Steven Pro]

agreed rev being rude is not the way to go about it here..... i like the idea of the test my self and glad Steven took the time to do a comparison.... i know exactly what he's saying and why he did it the way he did... i would love to see the 103 against a 250w mh myself they claim it's all that plus a bag of chips...hmmmmm

If you take a peak at the links I provided earlier, you will see Sanjay did that test, a 250 MH versus LEDs. After hearing about Sanjay's test, I decided to do my own because I could not drawn any conclusions from it. The wattages were vastly different and the PAR intensities and distribution of those intensities were not the same, so I found it a difficult comparison. Sanjay tried to normalize the results by comparing areas where PAR was 100 or more, which was a better comparison, but still not apples to apples for me.

 

[CalmSeasQuest]

Have you tried mounting those fixtures at like a 20* angle to get the beams of light to cross paths and maybe give your tank a more natural look or even color???? i think it would work great honestly...;)

Thanks Troy, but this was setup just to compare the PAR and color bewteen the SOL white and SOL Blue fixtures. Minutes after that photo was taken, the second SOL white was upgraded to the Blue. All even now :) The tank looks horribly washed out as the LEDs were runnng at 100% for the PAR measurements and photo. Normal settings are ~60%.

The photo also demonstrates the how the Apogee meter underestimates PAR on very blue light and also that the lower nm light penetrates better (note the better PAR performance of the SOL blue unit at depths greater than 24".)

 

[Steven Pro]

they claim the 101 to be a direct replacement for 150w metal halide..... brightness plays no role here i know that for a fact a par meter will show that..... i have 2 tanks going one litl by a 250w mh it looks 100 times brighter than my other display that has 150 three watt cree leds but my led tank will cook any coral i put there all day long if i crank the leds..... the look's of leds are very deceiving they don't look bright but let me tell you i can fry some sticks that just got pulled out from a 250w mh in a matter of 3 days under a dim looking led.....

;) That phenomenon is in part two of my LED discussion, that LEDs don't appear nearly as bright as MH when side by side. Your eye is a terrible judge of PAR.

 

[revhtree Verified Admin]

I had a AI Blue LED Fixture next to a 250w Radium and you couldn't tell a difference with the naked eye when the hood was down except the LED had a bit more shimmer.

 

[Steven Pro]

Thanks Troy, but this was setup just to compare the PAR and color bewteen the SOL white and SOL Blue fixtures. Minutes after that photo was taken, the second SOL white was upgraded to the Blue. All even now :) The tank looks horribly washed out as the LEDs were runnng at 100% for the PAR measurements and photo. Normal settings are ~60%.

The photo also demonstrates the how the Apogee meter underestimates PAR on very blue light and also that the lower nm light penetrates better (note the better PAR performance of the SOL blue unit at depths greater than 24".)

You are correct. The Apogee PAR meter does underestimate lower nanometer (blue) light, but those numbers are really not all that different. It looks to be about plus or minus 5%. That is close enough in my opinion once you figure in the error rate of the machine and slight variations in the angle in the sensor or how it is aligned in relation to the LEDs. I would guess the PAR to be roughly equivalent between the white and blue Sol (especially considering that the way they make a "white" LED is to take a blue one and put a phosphor coating on it), but the blue Sol makes the colors pop more.

 

[CalmSeasQuest]

You are correct. The Apogee PAR meter does underestimate lower nanometer (blue) light, but those numbers are really not all that different. It looks to be about plus or minus 5%. That is close enough in my opinion once you figure in the error rate of the machine and slight variations in the angle in the sensor or how it is aligned in relation to the LEDs. I would guess the PAR to be roughly equivalent between the white and blue Sol (especially considering that the way they make a "white" LED is to take a blue one and put a phosphor coating on it), but the blue Sol makes the colors pop more.

Agreed. The PAR output between the AI blue and white units is very similar. THe MQ-200 measurement error contributes to much of the difference (user testing/sensor placement errors aside) in the values above 24" - With the lower nm light penetrating deeper and delivering more PAR.

This better defines the Apogee response values...

 

[my2girls]

FWIW, I have a 4 foot Acan 104 over my standard 75g tank. It's been running for about 2 months now. Previously I had an Aquactinics 250w MH fixture and then a Constellation T5 fixture. With the new LEDs, I can only run them at 88% power without bleaching some corals (mostly LPS). SPS and clam coloration at the bottom of the tank is good. There is a lot of talk about PAR and meters, etc. I think by now it's been proven that LEDs (Acan and AI) are sufficient to grow and keep corals healthy.

I do agree that testing against a 70w MH bulb is a waste of time. No offense Steven.

 

[revhtree Verified Admin]

Maybe we can talk Steven into running some led's against some MH lamps that you all use. :D

 

[dougers31]

New led's seem to be great.... just wondering what the performance will be at 1-3-5 years down the road.

 

[Swooshjvm]

nice post

 

[Just Clownin Around]

Maybe noone runs nanos over here but the 70w mh is still used. I understand the info may not be pertinent to you but others appreciate the hard work that went into the test.
Maybe next time we could expand the test to include 150&250 halides

 

[my2girls]

I didn't mean to sound unappreciative. My main point was that instead of judging LEDs by their PAR values, maybe coral observance would work better. Numbers are just numbers. On the Acan website (acanlighting dot com) they have PAR ratings versus 250w halides.

 

[Tenacious716]

I certainly appreciate your time and efforts in performing this test, but in my experience I wouldn't recommend people spend the exorbitant amount of money that the makers of the Acan are charging. It too is a chinese manufactured fixture that doesn't comply with the Orbitech patent laws. Furthermore, coming from someone who has PAR tested both, the Acan can't stand a chance against the quality and PAR of an AquaIillumination units.

I can't stress that this is just my opinion, and regardless I appreciate the fact that Steve is willing to take his time comparing light fixtures. Hopefully we will see a rush of quality L.E.D. fixtures in the years to come. :)

 

[Redstag]

Thanks for the good information in here.

 

[smpolyp]

Steven thank you for the time and effort. Given the different uses in lighting over the world it is seems to lead us that LED will take over. Whether or not that is good for us now you cannot neglect it. I have tried a couple of LED units at 2 different kelvins. After trying the 20K I still think MH is better. I just switched to a 14K(same set up and brand) and fried my first coral. This is my coral observation. Lux and par readings to follow. Steven keep up the good work as we all will benefit from it in the long run.

 

[mobyreef]

Steven thank you for the time and effort. Given the different uses in lighting over the world it is seems to lead us that LED will take over. Whether or not that is good for us now you cannot neglect it. I have tried a couple of LED units at 2 different kelvins. After trying the 20K I still think MH is better. I just switched to a 14K(same set up and brand) and fried my first coral. This is my coral observation. Lux and par readings to follow. Steven keep up the good work as we all will benefit from it in the long run.

I was curious as to the process of "frying" of the coral. Does it get RTN and tissue sloths off or does it 's tissue recede within the skeleton and bleaches out?
I was considering trying some Aqua Illumination LEDs but I am hesitant. I run 250w Radium MHs on a 150g now. None of my coral have turned brown. They mostly turn Green, purple and some Blue.