Lionfish Venom

[Peter Houde]

Of course you could do what I accidentally did with wasp stings. Be very unlucky and keep getting stung until your body builds up a resistance…
Or you could get a doctor to do it in a safe environment with tiny doses but what’s the fun in that?!

I'm not so sure you necessarily develop resistance. I know someone who has been bitten so many times by rattlesnakes (job hazard) that they can't administer antivenom anymore. He was advised that if he was bitten again he would probably die.

 

[Peter Houde]

Sir, foxes don’t sting they bite. Probably their response honestly.

It seems that others disagree.

Lieske, E. & Myers, R. (1999). Coral Reef Fishes (2 ed.). Princeton University Press. pp. 129–130.

Taylor, Geoff (2000). "Toxic fish spine injury: Lessons from 11 years experience". Journal of the South Pacific Underwater Medical Society. 30 (1): 7–8.

Dianne J. Bray, Siganus unimaculatus in Fishes of Australia, accessed 09 Jan 2024, https://fishesofaustralia.net.au/home/species/1887

 

[Reefering1]

Glad you're ok sweetie!! That's a dangerous game your playing..
I'm allergic to shellfish, but I love eating it. I believe I'm building a tolerance by continuing to eat small(ever increasing amounts), a few months ago i overdid it. Full anaphylactic response.Blinded by bright tank lights, increased heartrate, sweating but shivering, lightheaded everytime I stood up, collapsing to ground 3 times. I thought I was a goner, called my brother and ate 12 benadryls, I was feeling better by the time he got here. It was scary.
Anyways, you have a taxidermist up there? If not, I got a guy here in Florida...

 

[littlefoxx]

Of course you could do what I accidentally did with wasp stings. Be very unlucky and keep getting stung until your body builds up a resistance…
Or you could get a doctor to do it in a safe environment with tiny doses but what’s the fun in that?!

LOL

 

[littlefoxx]

Sounds very much like an anaphylactic allergic reaction rather than just the effects of the venom. You should have had a prior exposure though as anaphylaxis generally does not occur on first hit. The venom itself can be painful but should respond to immersion in very hot water (as hot as you can stand…the heat denatures the venom). It works quite fast (personal experience from a sting ray and a scorpionfish while surfing. 2 separate events. Hot water worked both times) again your symptoms sound very much allergic and are different than what most people could expect. You definitely need to keep an epi pen handy or better yet, re-home the lion fish. The next time might be worse! Also, and they probably did this in the ER, make sure your tetanus shot is up to date. Any secondary infection should be treated with an antibiotic that covers skin bacteria plus vibrio vulnificans. Many ER docs overlook the later. Vibrio is a salt water bacteria that can cause severe skin infections after a wound. It won’t be covered by standard skin infection antibiotics.

Oh well this is good info! I figured it wasnt the venom as that felt like fire in my blood. The other stuff developed a few minutes after, for sure allergic to something in the venom! And I will with my doc about that, I was just told to take a steroid

 

[littlefoxx]

Glad you're ok sweetie!! That's a dangerous game your playing..
I'm allergic to shellfish, but I love eating it. I believe I'm building a tolerance by continuing to eat small(ever increasing amounts), a few months ago i overdid it. Full anaphylactic response.Blinded by bright tank lights, increased heartrate, sweating but shivering, lightheaded everytime I stood up, collapsing to ground 3 times. I thought I was a goner, called my brother and ate 12 benadryls, I was feeling better by the time he got here. It was scary.
Anyways, you have a taxidermist up there? If not, I got a guy here in Florida...

That must have been scary! Mine was. Lol taxidermist

 

[realwizer]

Why not look at getting gloves?

I have a pair that go all the way to my shoulders, and wear when I’m working around my foxface. The rubber is really thick and I’d imagine would protect against the lion fish as well.

Got them for maybe… 20 bucks.

 

[Reefering1]

That must have been scary! Mine was. Lol taxidermist

Seriously.. I bet he'd make a beautiful lamp or countertop decoration, you can put it next to the tank

 

[littlefoxx]

I'm glad you are recovering.
My wife has a severe allergy to wasps, I'm thinking about getting a pen for her.
And what do you plan to do with the lion?

I honestly dont know what Ill do. I have two. The volitan that stung me and Nala who is a dwarf fuzzy that I got when she was tiny! Im way too attached to Nala to get rid of her. I honestly would be heartbroken, shes such a friendly fish and comes to see me when Im near the tank and just acts like a water puppy! Great personality. I feel that rehoming just him because he stung me isnt very fair to him if Im keeping Nala, which I cant part with her. Really bonded with that fish. I love all my fish but she is just special. I cant give her away, I love her way too much. I think Im going to keep him for now and be very cautious of him. If he had gone after me aggressively and went out of his way to sting me (like freaking clowns biting people) then I would feel differently I think. It was my fault anyway he just was protecting himself

 

[littlefoxx]

Why not look at getting gloves?

I have a pair that go all the way to my shoulders, and wear when I’m working around my foxface. The rubber is really thick and I’d imagine would protect against the lion fish as well.

Got them for maybe… 20 bucks.

Yeah Im looking into them. Stupid part is Im allergic to latex, so getting gloves is tricky since thats a main part in rubber. Maybe my boyfriend was right and I do have a Gypsy curse! -.-

 

[POMO]

Well today was a horrible day. I was adding some rock to the tank and just waived my hand in the direction of my volitan to get him to move.

Usually Parthanaxx (the lion) is a super shy lion. Not sure why but he is very shy of people. But today he decided to ram my hand while doing this. Out of character for him for sure, I was surprised. One spike got me on my finger. One tiny spike. Most people describe lionfish venom stings as bee stings.

Well THAT WAS NOT THE CASE FOR ME.

I felt like lava was in my blood. In the first 30 seconds I started noticing my breathing being hard. My throat was swelling and I felt like I was breathing through a pin hole. A few seconds later my whole body went numb and tingly. Vision blurred. I honestly was scared I wasnt going to make it. Now Im a first responder. I run, and have ran towards shooters and dangerous situations. But this was different. I couldnt do anything. My boyfriend had to call 911.

I was taken code 10 (lights and sirens) to the nearest hospital. Put on oxygen in the ambulance, hit with a full dose of liquid Benadryl and two epi pens. By the time I got to the hospital I was so panicked and unable to breathe and was given medicine to make me drowsey while they worked to get my swelling down. Eventually the breathing evened out and I got feeling back. They numbed my finger and arm where the venom was. They took an xray of my hand to see if the spike was still there. I have swelling in my throat and chest pain still, so I was given an EKG and a chest xray. Thankfully all came back clear and they think I will be okay with some medicine to keep the swelling in my chest and lungs in check. Also prescribed an epi pen.

I just got home after an 8 hour stay in the ER.

This was all from the tip of my volitan lionfish’s spine. Just one and not even that deep of a sting. But Im deathly allergic to the venom according to the doctor.

When I bought my lions I knew I would be stung at some point, and was willing to take the risk. Ive got no allergies that I know (knew) of.

The reason Im posting this is to warn lion owners or new/potential lion owners to be aware that an allergic reaction is very serious and it acts FAST.

Sorry for the long post but I just wanted to put this out there as something for a new/potential lionfish owner to be aware of as I think stories like this are important to share with others as warnings and something to be aware of.

Thanks for reading yall :)

Glad to hear ya pulled through.
I guess different people have different reactions. Like a bee sting. I had two spines under my fingernails. Really really burned. The only thing that helped was hot water.

 

[Slocke]

I'm not so sure you necessarily develop resistance. I know someone who has been bitten so many times by rattlesnakes (job hazard) that they can't administer antivenom anymore. He was advised that if he was bitten again he would probably die.

Thats crazy. Makes my stung story sound pedestrian.

That’s how they cure allergies though. A doctor administers small doses of the venom regularly until the reactions lessen to normal or less then normal levels. I had that happen naturally to me. Wasp stings now hardly affect me. I get a small mosquito bite bump that’s it.

I don’t know what’s with your friend but if I were to guess it sounds like the bites have done actual damage to them so it’s more than just the “overreaction” that occurs from a sting allergy.

 

[Oiseaufeu]

Thats crazy. Makes my stung story sound pedestrian.

That’s how they cure allergies though. A doctor administers small doses of the venom regularly until the reactions lessen to normal or less then normal levels. I had that happen naturally to me. Wasp stings now hardly affect me. I get a small mosquito bite bump that’s it.

I don’t know what’s with your friend but if I were to guess it sounds like the bites have done actual damage to them so it’s more than just the “overreaction” that occurs from a sting allergy.

Maybe the friend developped an aquaintance to the anti venom. It happens with a bunch of medications like adderal. Everyone will be affected by a rattlesnake’s venom.

 

[Reefering1]

Yeah Im looking into them. Stupid part is Im allergic to latex, so getting gloves is tricky since thats a main part in rubber. Maybe my boyfriend was right and I do have a Gypsy curse! -.-

I'm allergic to latex... That's a good one, I'll try that line next time;-) although probably won't work, a little extra swelling probably won't be the worse thing. Lol Sorry civilized people, carry on

 

[carbasaurus]

I would most definitely NOT go with the repeated exposure to desensitize route. Desensitization for certain allergies is done in a very controlled manor under the care of an allergist with careful dosing of the allergin done over time. There is virtually zero chance you will find someone who does that with fish venom and to try to do it on your own is a generally bad idea. Best option. Re-home. Second best option: have someone else do the intank maintenance. Third best option, sturdy gloves (but no gaurantee the spine won’t pierce them. So keep the epi pen handy)

 

[littlefoxx]

I would most definitely NOT go with the repeated exposure to desensitize route. Desensitization for certain allergies is done in a very controlled manor under the care of an allergist with careful dosing of the allergin done over time. There is virtually zero chance you will find someone who does that with fish venom and to try to do it on your own is a generally bad idea. Best option. Re-home. Second best option: have someone else do the intank maintenance. Third best option, sturdy gloves (but no gaurantee the spine won’t pierce them. So keep the epi pen handy)

Oh yeah in no way was I considering the exposure thing!! Once was enough for me! And yes thats the hard decision Im trying to make as far as re home. I do love him and my fuzzy. The fuzzy is my favorite fish cant imagine my tank without her

 

[Slocke]

I would most definitely NOT go with the repeated exposure to desensitize route. Desensitization for certain allergies is done in a very controlled manor under the care of an allergist with careful dosing of the allergin done over time. There is virtually zero chance you will find someone who does that with fish venom and to try to do it on your own is a generally bad idea. Best option. Re-home. Second best option: have someone else do the intank maintenance. Third best option, sturdy gloves (but no gaurantee the spine won’t pierce them. So keep the epi pen handy)

I was joking. Hopefully that’s obvious. Allergies are not to be messed with

 

[littlefoxx]

I was joking. Hopefully that’s obvious. Allergies are not to be messed with

Oh I knew you were joking! Just re assuring the one who asked that I wasnt actually going to get my lions to sting me over and over again lol

 

[AvidReefer]

Omg! I hope you’ll get better soon! I would put quite thick gloves on when working in the tank. This was just a self defense move as it felt threatened by your hand.

^^This^^
I'm setting up a pred tank, this is scary.
Does anybody know of any reef safe venomous fish sting-proof gloves?

 

[littlefoxx]

^^This^^
I'm setting up a pred tank, this is scary.
Does anybody know of any reef safe venomous fish sting-proof gloves?

Yes it was very scary! Thats why I posted because most people are not allergic to lionfish stings like me, and just wanted to share this and what symptoms I had in case anyone else finds out the hard way they are deathly allergic to lionfish venom