Mantis shrimp

[littlefoxx]

Okay so first time I saw a picture of one of these I screamed. Thought they were so freaking creepy. But been seeing lots of posts about them recently and saw one at the Aquarium when I went. Kinda thought they were cool. The one I saw was a peacock. I was interested in the colors and while it is still kinda creepy, its cool. Been considering keeping one actually.

Currently looking at a 20 gallon long tank with a HOB filtration by fluval. Is this a good set up for one of these guys? Still not 100% sold on one yet. Ive read they break glass??? Is this a concern people who have them have in their tank? Obviously this would be just a tank for one of them but I dont want to come home to a broken tank cause it punched through the glass…

And as far as rock, is it better to get arches and caves or just random rock and let the shrimp do its thing?

 

[ISpeakForTheSeas]

Currently looking at a 20 gallon long tank with a HOB filtration by fluval. Is this a good set up for one of these guys? Still not 100% sold on one yet. Ive read they break glass??? Is this a concern people who have them have in their tank? Obviously this would be just a tank for one of them but I dont want to come home to a broken tank cause it punched through the glass…

And as far as rock, is it better to get arches and caves or just random rock and let the shrimp do its thing?

20 gallons might be too small for a Peacock Mantis (I'll defer to others here), but you could fit a smaller mantis in there comfortably. They can break glass, but it's rare (acrylic tanks are recommended) - see the quote below. I know a lot of people like to set up PVC burrows for them, but I'd imagine you could let it do it's own thing too (you'd need to provide some sand, rubble, and rocks of various sizes for it to build with).

It’s extremely rare for mantis shrimp to break glass - it can happen (and has happened to some unlucky people in the past), but my understanding is that it basically only happens if there’s an issue with the mantis’ burrow that leaves the mantis trying to expand its burrow by digging through the glass (which they attempt to do by repeatedly striking it), or in unlikely accidents, such as when someone unintentionally baits the mantis to strike at food outside of the tank. Again, it’s extremely rare, but many people recommend acrylic tanks for mantis shrimp specifically because of this issue.

o_scyllarus

 

[Fish Fan]

I have a smaller, N. wennerae, not a Peacock, but my feeling would be that 20 gallons is a bit small for a peacock that gets up around 6”, if I’m not mistaken.

I’m also like 99% sure Peacock’s need some PVC pipe to act as a borrow. I believe with this species you need to consider their borrowing habitats.

If a 20 gallon is the largest tank you can use here, there are other species of Mantids you could choose from.

Our recent resident expert seems to be @Stomatopods17 . Maybe he‘ll stop by with some solid advice for you.

I can say these are cool critters and well worth considering keeping them.

 

[shrimpnreefdude]

We recently found a mantis shrimp in our live rocks. Ours happens to be a N. wennerae like @Fish Fan mentioned above. We love our little guy. Mine is definitely very shy and we've only seen him a couple times.

A mantis shrimp from the research I've seen requires a much larger tank, at least a 40 gallon with a plan to get something bigger though.

 

[The_Paradox]

I kept them over the years with success. Always in glass tanks with no issues. The biggest problem I see with your plan is filtration. These guys eat a lot and are messy. Not saying it’s 100% necessary but I would not want to keep one in any tank without a skimmer.

 

[Fish Fan]

We recently found a mantis shrimp in our live rocks. Ours happens to be a N. wennerae like @Fish Fan mentioned above. We love our little guy. Mine is definitely very shy and we've only seen him a couple times.

A mantis shrimp from the research I've seen requires a much larger tank, at least a 40 gallon with a plan to get something bigger though.

Cool! Fellow N. wennerae fan I ordered mine along with some rock and sand from Tampa Bay Saltwater. I have mine in an IM Nuvo Fusion 10 gallon, and I think it’s pretty much ideal for him. He’s a pretty reclusive dude, I only very, very rarely see him fully exposed on the rock or less frequently roaming the sand bed, but occasionally he surprises me. Mine mostly hangs out in and peaks out from the rocks.

I was easily able to get mine to take a variety of frozen food from some forceps, which is pretty cool. Reclusive, but dang interesting critter for sure!

 

[vetteguy53081]

Okay so first time I saw a picture of one of these I screamed. Thought they were so freaking creepy. But been seeing lots of posts about them recently and saw one at the Aquarium when I went. Kinda thought they were cool. The one I saw was a peacock. I was interested in the colors and while it is still kinda creepy, its cool. Been considering keeping one actually.

Currently looking at a 20 gallon long tank with a HOB filtration by fluval. Is this a good set up for one of these guys? Still not 100% sold on one yet. Ive read they break glass??? Is this a concern people who have them have in their tank? Obviously this would be just a tank for one of them but I dont want to come home to a broken tank cause it punched through the glass…

And as far as rock, is it better to get arches and caves or just random rock and let the shrimp do its thing?

20 long to 40 breeder preferably for them with caves and hiding structure. I had mine in a 40 breeder and it did well in there. They pack a punch but ive yet to see anyone make mention of a broken tank by one

 

[TripFamAZ]

I have a peacock we named him Ralph. I started with a 24 gallon but very quickly upgraded to a 50 long. A protein skimmer is a very good idea.
Mine has never attempted to break the glass. Keep lots of rocks/pebbles, frag rock and shells for him to keep busy with and make things how they like them. I would consider a pvc burrow as my guy loves his. He has two options but only uses one as his regular home.
I will say I find them SO fun to own. They are like little puppies and learn to recognize and interact with you to a certain extent.

 

[Fish Fan]

20 long to 40 breeder preferably for them with caves and hiding structure. I had mine in a 40 breeder and it did well in there. They pack a punch but ive yet to see anyone make mention of a broken tank by one

Strangely, in my research many people suggested that these animals can break glass, but has anyone really experienced this? I don’t know why my guy would suddenly bash the glass when he can smash rock and critters and whatever else he wants. Personally, I’m not worried about them breaking the glass….. Maybe I’ll live to regret that….. If anyone is worried, simply put a piece of acrylic down under the sand bed.

 

[Fish Fan]

I have a peacock we named him Ralph. I started with a 24 gallon but very quickly upgraded to a 50 long. A protein skimmer is a very good idea.
Mine has never attempted to break the glass. Keep lots of rocks/pebbles, frag rock and shells for him to keep busy with and make things how they like them. I would consider a pvc burrow as my guy loves his. He has two options but only uses one as his regular home.
I will say I find them SO fun to own. They are like little puppies and learn to recognize and interact with you to a certain extent.

Very cool dude!!!

I don’t regret my N. wennerae acquisition, which was an easy find at TBS. But in retrospect I would have rather had the Peacock. Although I think these dudes need about 40 gallons as a minimum, they do make for an impressive setup with their size, active lifestyle, and coloration.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Strangely, in my research many people suggested that these animals can break glass, but has anyone really experienced this? I don’t know why my guy would suddenly bash the glass when he can smash rock and critters and whatever else he wants. Personally, I’m not worried about them breaking the glass….. Maybe I’ll live to regret that….. If anyone is worried, simply put a piece of acrylic down under the sand bed.

Been around mantis near 30 years and had LFS and attended many shows and never heard of any incidents. The warnings are due to force of their punch

 

[Fish Fan]

Been around mantis near 30 years and had LFS and attended many shows and never heard of any incidents. The warnings are due to force of their punch

Right, they do pack a punch, but if these animals were breaking tanks left and right I am sure someone would have posted pics by now. Again, not saying it can’t happen, but I personally am not terribly worried about a Mantis breaking a tank.

 

[Tired]

The reason why a mantis might potentially break the glass is because they break their way through rocks to dig burrows. Theoretically you could have a mantis that encounters a wall and treats said wall like it would any other barrier- namely, by experimentally smashing. It wouldn't be about food, it would be an attempt to burrow through.

That said, yeah, it's not common. Partly because you need a darned big mantis to hit that hard, and people tend to keep the smaller ones.

I've got a little hitchhiker gal I'm keeping in a breeder box until the weather warms up enough for me to ship her off to her forever home. Cutest little thing- I love watching her poke her eyeballs out of a den (hers are bits of silicone straws, as she's too tiny for PVC) to see what I'm doing. If I had anywhere for another setup, I'd absolutely be keeping her.

 

[littlefoxx]

I kept them over the years with success. Always in glass tanks with no issues. The biggest problem I see with your plan is filtration. These guys eat a lot and are messy. Not saying it’s 100% necessary but I would not want to keep one in any tank without a skimmer.

Yeah I was a little worried about that part. Do you think an oversized HOB system would help at all?

I have a peacock we named him Ralph. I started with a 24 gallon but very quickly upgraded to a 50 long. A protein skimmer is a very good idea.
Mine has never attempted to break the glass. Keep lots of rocks/pebbles, frag rock and shells for him to keep busy with and make things how they like them. I would consider a pvc burrow as my guy loves his. He has two options but only uses one as his regular home.
I will say I find them SO fun to own. They are like little puppies and learn to recognize and interact with you to a certain extent.

Oh wow yeah he is huge. 20 gallons probably is too small. Maybe Ill look at a smaller species, but boy these guys are cool looking!

Been around mantis near 30 years and had LFS and attended many shows and never heard of any incidents. The warnings are due to force of their punch

Oh good lol I just was like what the F when I read they can break glass!

I have a smaller, N. wennerae, not a Peacock, but my feeling would be that 20 gallons is a bit small for a peacock that gets up around 6”, if I’m not mistaken.

I’m also like 99% sure Peacock’s need some PVC pipe to act as a borrow. I believe with this species you need to consider their borrowing habitats.

If a 20 gallon is the largest tank you can use here, there are other species of Mantids you could choose from.

Our recent resident expert seems to be @Stomatopods17 . Maybe he‘ll stop by with some solid advice for you.

I can say these are cool critters and well worth considering keeping them.

Ah I will look and see if I can do bigger or maybe do a smaller species. It kinda looks like a longer tank is a better option for them though based on how they move?

 

[The_Paradox]

Yeah I was a little worried about that part. Do you think an oversized HOB system would help at all?

I mean you could get by on straight water changes it just depends how much maintenance you are willing to do. I would do a canister filter before I did a HOB. Even a HOB skimmer would help a lot with the biofilm that’s going to build up quick.

 

[Fish Fan]

I mean you could get by on straight water changes it just depends how much maintenance you are willing to do. I would do a canister filter before I did a HOB. Even a HOB skimmer would help a lot with the biofilm that’s going to build up quick.

^This. The point is, any Mantis is a ridiculously messy and wasteful eater, and you’re going to be dealing with elevated nutrients. How you choose to export them is up to you - skimmer, refugium, water changes, etc. Just know that these little spuds love to hunt, kill, and eat like half of the prey item. The other half the discard or even burry.

 

[ISpeakForTheSeas]

Yeah, the breaking glass thing is really more an extreme, rare event with big specimens of large species (likely with thin glass or unnoticed structural integrity issues with the glass beforehand in at least some of the cases as well) - there are a handful of instances (see the quote and link below), but they're so uncommon as to be extreme statistical outliers.

So, the acrylic recommendation is more for peace of mind than anything.

True or False: Can Mantis Shrimp Crack Glass?

Is this a myth or can a mantis shrimp really crack a glass tank? Source

www.reef2reef.com

oh hate mantis shrimp, my father had on in some living rock years ago and it grew and ended up striking at something on the glass , and cracked the 8mm glass. what a performance

 

[Fish Fan]

Statistical outlier, perfectly said!

 

[littlefoxx]

I mean you could get by on straight water changes it just depends how much maintenance you are willing to do. I would do a canister filter before I did a HOB. Even a HOB skimmer would help a lot with the biofilm that’s going to build up quick.

Gotcha, Ill look into this! Might be a down the road project, I think my boyfriend might go a little nutty with a 4th tank lol

^This. The point is, any Mantis is a ridiculously messy and wasteful eater, and you’re going to be dealing with elevated nutrients. How you choose to export them is up to you - skimmer, refugium, water changes, etc. Just know that these little spuds love to hunt, kill, and eat like half of the prey item. The other half the discard or even burry.

I did not realize they had that heavy of a bioload when it came to being a messy eater!

 

[Stomatopods17]

Glass breaks are something reported from labs mostly.

They technically can but not likely they will for myth busters, its an impressive feat to talk about. Pistol shrimp get demonized too for shooting hot sun bubbles but are one of the more peaceful of inverts you could have, I think nat geo really hurt their rep with their staged skunk cleaner killing when that will never actually happen.

Back on topic to glass breaks; It has happened, mainly in reused tanks through generations of wear and tear with large smashers, (we're talking 20 year old tanks with probably several generations of large smashers, most home aquariums the silicone gives out before then), the overnight cases are from small containers not made of glass.. I can personally advocate for 3 cases of N.wennerae, one of the weaker species, breaking out of kritter carriers and betta breeders (usually these are made of hard plastic) via the corners shattering, but obviously thats something I wake up to not something i put them in and expect an immediate result. Majority of the time even if you watched them they'd focus on your presence and not hit it.

The main way it happens is smasher's brains can't process the material of a hard surface so when they're burrowing, they tend to really wack at it for hours and commit to one spot. Waving your finger infront of the glass won't make it jump out and face hug you, but when they hit the same spot 50 times commiting to dig deeper, that's why there's a warning label. The solution is just laying a sheet of pexi/acrylic to the bottom of any aquarium you intend to keep a mantis in, this way when they dig a burrow and start hitting the bottom the glass is shielded from a more absorbent material. Full acrylic tanks can work too, but; they're painful to clean without scratching (not to mention cleaning is already awkward when having to quickly do it with a mantis), small thin acrylic can still crack at the seams its not bulletproof, and most importantly, cost too much. If you notice any spots they uncomfortably hit a lot, you can use something magnetic to put an acrylic shield there, considering doing the same for where my powerhead is cause my one O. scyllarus frequently hits the upper corner around it.

____

As for other stuff: 20L is too small, 29 standard is what i'm using but wouldn't recommend, 40 breeder is the nice sweet spot for water quality and space. If you intend to get an O. Scyllarus (true peacock mantis) be sure to do your research on IDing them and get from a reputable source, many gotten their mantis species either unintentionally or mislabeled and a quick skim will show that's still true even this week alone, ask pictures and ID yourself before buying, especially since O. scyllarus requires more commitment in the setup alone.

Burrows are the biggest killer to large odontodactylus, U shaped burrows that are pitch black inside are necessary. Can be done with PVC but IME the most success i've had was aquacultured rock shaped like a tunnel with sand exposed, and a TON of rubble/sledge hammered rock, and frequent feedings of snails and clams to add building material naturally.