Metal Halide For 30" Deep Tank

[Hydrahawk]

For those of you MH gurus out there, planning on a new 28-30" deep system. Will a 3 light 250w MH setup be sufficient for a predominate SPS tank or do I need 400w system? Planning on running a combination of MH, AI Hydra 52s and possibly Reef Brite strips.

 

[Subsea]

Not familiar with the led lights. I operated 30” deep 150G tank with 1000W of MH. It was plenty bright enough for the softies & macros.

 

[oreo54]

For those of you MH gurus out there, planning on a new 28-30" deep system. Will a 3 light 250w MH setup be sufficient for a predominate SPS tank or do I need 400w system? Planning on running a combination of MH, AI Hydra 52s and possibly Reef Brite strips.

Full tank dimensions would help..
3 250 mh's over 48" is not the same as over a 96" Nor over 24" vs 36" wide.

Anyways also depends on the reflectors.

 

[X-37B]

3 would work for a 6' system or smaller.
This was my old 120 running 2 250 watt 14K. Never tested par. 12" from the surface and 22" to the bottom and you can grow anything from the bottom up.
400's would be better if you Can manage the heat.
3 250's in ReefBrite fixtures will work well.

 

[Hydrahawk]

I'm thinking the dims will be 84x30x28-30. Was planning a chiller in the build also. Looking into getting the MH in a lumen bright mini reflector.

 

[rtparty]

Bulb, ballast, and reflector combo play into this more than 250 or 400w. You will need some big - think 20x20 - reflectors to have enough spread and 400w would be better to really punch through the 30" of water. So you will have to see what setup you can find and go from there. The Reef Brite fixtures are mediocre IME. Nothing like the good reflectors from 15-20 years ago

 

[56longroof]

I have 2 250W over my 30" deep tank. But I also have another 300 watts in T5 and pc bulbs. The light is 9" above the water and is over 900 par at the waters surface.

 

[Jamie814]

Bulb, ballast, and reflector combo play into this more than 250 or 400w. You will need some big - think 20x20 - reflectors to have enough spread and 400w would be better to really punch through the 30" of water. So you will have to see what setup you can find and go from there. The Reef Brite fixtures are mediocre IME. Nothing like the good reflectors from 15-20 years ago

I really miss the MH days the natural shimmer and look just can not be beat by LED. I would love to go back to MH but finding bulbs/ballast for reef keeping just seems like a PITA

Where do you source them from now?

Why is there so much available when it comes to MH in the hydroponics industry yet? Why have they not made the switch?

Would something like this work for the OP?

OG Vertical Reflector

 

[mtraylor]

For those of you MH gurus out there, planning on a new 28-30" deep system. Will a 3 light 250w MH setup be sufficient for a predominate SPS tank or do I need 400w system? Planning on running a combination of MH, AI Hydra 52s and possibly Reef Brite strips.

Well I ran MH's for many years so I guess that puts me in the Guru category and for the 84x30x28-30 aquarium. I would plan on a setup of 3x 400watt setup with some type of supplement lighting for actinics. T5's, Led strips, etc. You will need a chiller as well.

Without getting into more details. Is there a reason you want to go MH route? IMO, its a waste of electricity and certainly the corals and fish really do not look better (Subjective). Led's will do the job just as well allot cheaper and IMO they look better (Subjective).

My aquarium has similar dimensions and the MH's are just not needed. I have same aquarium now which originally had MH's on it 3x400W Mh's and 360watss of actinics, a chiller and you can see in build thread the conversion over to led's many years ago ghl mitras and now I run orpheks. The orpheks are more powerful than the MH's with less electricity draw. I have power meter. Not to mention the colors are off the chain! Anyway. Just dropping my 2cents worth.

If you just like the shimmer and nostalgia of MH's. Rock on. Nothing wrong with them. They get the job done, but in todays market trying to find bulbs and just the sheer price of electricity. I would never run them again. It would be like running 120watt incandescent can light bulbs in the house when you could simply run some 18watt led bulbs that give off more lumens than the old school bulb which also gives off excessive heat.

 

[t5Nitro]

I'll take the reverse opinion to the above poster. I had halides, then converted to all LED, now it's back to primary halide with LED bar as a supplement. You can't beat the halides. I do want to try ATI stratton LED fixtures at some point. I would run 400 watt lights over a tank that deep. I use 400 watt halides now on a tank 22" deep, and it works really well.

Dave at aquabright (previously at Hamilton) is really helpful and a ton of information if you want to run anything by him. Very responsive to emails.

I would argue that good bulbs are not hard at all to find, but the reflectors might be a difficult find unless you're getting some secondhand.

 

[Ancient Mariner]

My tank is 24" deep (and 36" long). I run 2 400w metal halides mounted just 6 inches above the water surface. I can grow scrolling montipora at the bottom. Moderate light acropora like A. carduus, A.echinata, and ORA Pearlberry have done well at the bottom but high light acropora have to be at about mid level. And then they really take off as they reach the surface!

 

[mtraylor]

I'll take the reverse opinion to the above poster. I had halides, then converted to all LED, now it's back to primary halide with LED bar as a supplement. You can't beat the halides. I do want to try ATI stratton LED fixtures at some point. I would run 400 watt lights over a tank that deep. I use 400 watt halides now on a tank 22" deep, and it works really well.

Dave at aquabright (previously at Hamilton) is really helpful and a ton of information if you want to run anything by him. Very responsive to emails.

I would argue that good bulbs are not hard at all to find, but the reflectors might be a difficult find unless you're getting some secondhand.

Yeah its all subjective as to what some people like the look of, but i find the lighting to be just the final tweak of coral color and that is it. Water quality is number one. I find that being able to change the spectrum throughout the day just like the sun gives better results than a constant MH> My aquarium is just as deep and the proof is in the pudding that there are no issues as you can see in the build thread. This old thread starts off with GHL first gen mitras and the journey to the Orpheks which is the best lighting setup I have ever had and that includes the MH's.

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/mtraylors-255.431769/

 

[DIYreefer]

The Reef Brite fixtures are mediocre IME. Nothing like the good reflectors from 15-20 years ago

I’ve still got a few old Lumenarc Elite reflectors that I refuse to get rid of. One of these days I will set up a system that I can use them on… hopefully!

 

[Hydrahawk]

Well I ran MH's for many years so I guess that puts me in the Guru category and for the 84x30x28-30 aquarium. I would plan on a setup of 3x 400watt setup with some type of supplement lighting for actinics. T5's, Led strips, etc. You will need a chiller as well.

Without getting into more details. Is there a reason you want to go MH route? IMO, its a waste of electricity and certainly the corals and fish really do not look better (Subjective). Led's will do the job just as well allot cheaper and IMO they look better (Subjective).

My aquarium has similar dimensions and the MH's are just not needed. I have same aquarium now which originally had MH's on it 3x400W Mh's and 360watss of actinics, a chiller and you can see in build thread the conversion over to led's many years ago ghl mitras and now I run orpheks. The orpheks are more powerful than the MH's with less electricity draw. I have power meter. Not to mention the colors are off the chain! Anyway. Just dropping my 2cents worth.

If you just like the shimmer and nostalgia of MH's. Rock on. Nothing wrong with them. They get the job done, but in todays market trying to find bulbs and just the sheer price of electricity. I would never run them again. It would be like running 120watt incandescent can light bulbs in the house when you could simply run some 18watt led bulbs that give off more lumens than the old school bulb which also gives off excessive heat.

I'd ran MH before and really like the look. First one I had was a (forgot the manufacturer and model) DE 75w 0K bulb over a 12 nanocube, boy did it heat up that little tank. Didn't like the color and the 14K was available so I went with the Phoenix 14K. When I upgraded to a 60g cube, I went with a Hamilton Tech DE 250w 14K with a pair of PC actinic lights (still has it sitting in the garage somewhere). The next system was a 40G Breeder, had T5s but I was poorish back then and didn't want to buy new bulbs every 10-12 months and LED were coming out so I splurge on a pair of AI Sol Blues, and what a technological leap! Change the temperature whenever you want, little heat compare to MH and T5; then you realize you can't go 100% or else the lenses are toast. Current system is a 120, bought it used as a whole package and it came with T5 hybrid fixture so I mounted AI 26s on them.

 

[A. grandis]

I'm thinking the dims will be 84x30x28-30. Was planning a chiller in the build also. Looking into getting the MH in a lumen bright mini reflector.

I would use 400W lamps for a 30" deep tank in a wider reflector, not the lumen Bright mini because of the width of the tank. Sometimes you find some nice used fixtures that will cover the surface area way better for your case. Also, try to look for horticulture fixtures. Keep in mind that everything in a system needs to be within it's limits or specially it's needs of that system to give you the best results. I would also use T5s as a supplementation instead of any LEDs. The coverage and uniformity of a richer spectrum from T5s makes a huge difference for the results in the long run IMO. Make sure you find the right ballasts for the bulbs you choose!
Last but not least, forget about "measuring PAR". You won't need to do that with halides and/or T5s.
It's just a total shame that we still don't have a line of options for aquarium metal halide gear!

 

[mtraylor]

I'd ran MH before and really like the look. First one I had was a (forgot the manufacturer and model) DE 75w 0K bulb over a 12 nanocube, boy did it heat up that little tank. Didn't like the color and the 14K was available so I went with the Phoenix 14K. When I upgraded to a 60g cube, I went with a Hamilton Tech DE 250w 14K with a pair of PC actinic lights (still has it sitting in the garage somewhere). The next system was a 40G Breeder, had T5s but I was poorish back then and didn't want to buy new bulbs every 10-12 months and LED were coming out so I splurge on a pair of AI Sol Blues, and what a technological leap! Change the temperature whenever you want, little heat compare to MH and T5; then you realize you can't go 100% or else the lenses are toast. Current system is a 120, bought it used as a whole package and it came with T5 hybrid fixture so I mounted AI 26s on them.

This is subjective of course. But the shimmer of the MH is the best. The glooming shimmer across the reef and fish is hands down tranquil to watch. Its the one thing I tried for a while to accomplish with the switchover to led. I gave up on that. I know kessil's offer shimmer but its not the same. Its really harsh and sharp.

I was a 20k radium bulb guy. I had tried allot of them. there was an aquamax back in the day that looked like the 20k radium for a little cheaper, but it didn't last as long. So I switched back. The ushio 10k were nice too. The best fixtures were the sfiligio's IMO. The reflectors and setup was just so nice, but the price was high.

 

[A. grandis]

This is subjective of course. But the shimmer of the MH is the best. The glooming shimmer across the reef and fish is hands down tranquil to watch. Its the one thing I tried for a while to accomplish with the switchover to led. I gave up on that. I know kessil's offer shimmer but its not the same. Its really harsh and sharp.

I was a 20k radium bulb guy. I had tried allot of them. there was an aquamax back in the day that looked like the 20k radium for a little cheaper, but it didn't last as long. So I switched back. The ushio 10k were nice too. The best fixtures were the sfiligio's IMO. The reflectors and setup was just so nice, but the price was high.

That fixture was the Sfiligoi. Very nice fixture!
We still have a similar system available, the Giesemann Spectra. We need to special order from Germany, though.
Lumenarc was the one I liked for most applications back in the day.
We had so many options back in the day! We were spoiled and didn't know.

 

[mtraylor]

That fixture was the Sfiligoi. Very nice fixture!
We still have a similar system available, the Giesemann Spectra. We need to special order from Germany, though.
Lumenarc was the one I liked for most applications back in the day.
We had so many options back in the day! We were spoiled and didn't know.

Yeah that was it. The sfiligoi. Not only was it the one of top performers if not the best. It looked like jewelry compared to allot of the offerings.

 

[A. grandis]

Yeah that was it. The sfiligoi. Not only was it the one of top performers if not the best. It looked like jewelry compared to allot of the offerings.

The limitations of such type of fixtures are the dimensions of the tank you can use because of the unique dimensions of those fixtures. The 4 foot Sfiligoi or Spectra, for example, are great for a 75 gallon (48"X18"X21") or a 120 gallon (48"X24"X24") traditional over the counter tanks. It works so great! Lovely! The Sfiligoi was indeed very special!

 

[Hydrahawk]

I would use 400W lamps for a 30" deep tank in a wider reflector, not the lumen Bright mini because of the width of the tank. Sometimes you find some nice used fixtures that will cover the surface area way better for your case. Also, try to look for horticulture fixtures. Keep in mind that everything in a system needs to be within it's limits or specially it's needs of that system to give you the best results. I would also use T5s as a supplementation instead of any LEDs. The coverage and uniformity of a richer spectrum from T5s makes a huge difference for the results in the long run IMO. Make sure you find the right ballasts for the bulbs you choose!
Last but not least, forget about "measuring PAR". You won't need to do that with halides and/or T5s.
It's just a total shame that we still don't have a line of options for aquarium metal halide gear!

So you think the Lumen bright large reflector will do, 20x20?

The limitations of such type of fixtures are the dimensions of the tank you can use because of the unique dimensions of those fixtures. The 4 foot Sfiligoi or Spectra, for example, are great for a 75 gallon (48"X18"X21") or a 120 gallon (48"X24"X24") traditional over the counter tanks. It works so great! Lovely! The Sfiligoi was indeed very special!

I am planning on a diy light rack. So 3 x 400W SE MH with 14K bulb, 4 x Hydra 52 and 2 x Reef Bright Strips