My new tank build... from zero, thoughts?

[RabidDragon]

Hello everybody,

History: When I was younger (40 years ago) I had fresh water tanks for years but grew bored with them and wanted to move to salt water but the cost and life in general prohibit me from doing so. I now am in a position get a salt tank. I want to skip tendency to go smaller and progress to larger tanks and just get the larger tank and save $$ in the long run.

I'm looking at setting up a mixed reef tank, I am starting from zero. I want to be able to look everywhere and see something different, the more variety the better.... and of course I would prefer not spending 2 hours a day in maintenance.

Ok, so I've been spending a lot of time researching and trying to decide what I want to do, here is what I've come up with:

I'm looking at:

Tank: WaterBox 220.6: which is a 167g display tank, dimensions: 72", 25", 23" with a 37g sump with refugium, 11g ATO
pumps: 2 X COR-15 Intelligent Return Pump (1500 GPH) - Neptune Systems
Fleece Roller: ClariSea SK-5000 Automatic Filter System
PowerHeads: 2 X VorTech MP40QD - Mobius Ready QuietDrive Propeller Pump - EcoTech Marine
Tank lights: 3 X REEFLED 90 LED LIGHT FIXTURE - RED SEA (I like the recessed lights to avoid excess light spilling into the room)
mounts: 3 X REEFLED 90 MOUNTING ARM - RED SEA
Refuge light: H160 Tuna Flora LED Algae Grow Light - Kessil
Mount: A-SERIES GOOSENECK (TANK MOUNT) - KESSIL
controller: APEX CONTROLLER SYSTEM - NEPTUNE SYSTEMS (not sure with the chosen options I will get much functionality with this... ???)
heater: 2 X 600W TITANIUM AQUARIUM HEATER SYSTEM - WIFI - BULK REEF SUPPLY (overkill? perhaps 2 300w is enough?)

• Do I really need a protein skimmer with the refugium and fleece roller?

Rock: 150 lbs, AQUARIUM DRY LIVE ROCK
Sand: 5X 20 lb. Special Grade Arag-Alive! Reef Sand - CaribSea

Testing: Hanna: Alk, Ca, Phos, Salinity, pH.

• I'm a laboratory scientist by profession.

I plan on using a bacterial booster to jump start the cycle, adding in cocopods to my tank and refugium as well after the cycle.

Future:

• auto feeder
• UV sterilizer?
• Seneye?
• Neptune Dosage pumps?..... Triton method

Any obvious incompatibilities? oversights? before I drop $8.5k while the holiday sales are up...

In advance: I appreciate your thoughts and experience with any advice!

Thanks,

 

[Smprc]

Your tank choice is very close to mine. I have a 72x24x24 peninsula. You are starting off with very nice and great equipment. Personally, I would get a skimmer. I don't think you "need" one, however, I still pick up what my filter socks and my refuge don't take up. My NO3 and PO4 are pretty low. If you want to lower the maintenance you will need to dose eventually and a dosing unit will be something you want, not because you need it but because its convenient. I am not sure if 2 MP40's will be enough flow. Hopefully others will chime in. I use 2 large gyres, they move large amounts of water. Did you decide on 2 return pumps for redundancy? Or to increase turn over? Are you planning on QT'ing and being diligent on that? Not that a UV is a perfect solution, but if you know your QTing is not going to be the best, you might want to start with a UV, plus its great to help with uglies early on. Other tid bit, plan on knowing that your refuge will not grow much at the beginning. You don't need to set that up right away, until you begin to stock the tank. I couldn't grow chaeto at the beginning and quite frankly...no fish to feed...no food for the refuge. I am also assuming you already have plans for a RODI unit...didn't see it on your list...that is kind of a must if you plan on adding corals. I can keep going but this is something to start.

 

[sunken3]

oh fun stuff..

well if you haven't already, watch a ton of the BRS youtube stuff (as well as most the others out there) - they are worth it. for example, before you buy 150lbs of rock, look at the BRS aquascaping video on negative space... i am redoing my 250g just because i like it so much. you can always drop a few brightwell xport bricks in the sump to make up for the bio load.. as long as you have some hiding places for fish, the more water (less rocks) the more space they have to swim, and your corals have to grow.

i would definitely recommend an apex - get the full system (not the lite or XL..) you'll end up wanting to add stuff later.

testing, hanna ULR phosporus checker is great. milwaulkee digital refractometer, nyos nitrate... (these i have found to be the easiest - therefore best)

ph with a double junction apex probe

alk, ca, mag with a neptune trident... (so worth the $$)

i like the neptune ato feeder,.

i like UV,

i personally wouldn't get the seneye. apex is better (or other testing) - you need to either connect it to a laptop everytime to use it, or spend $250 for the wifi module. if you're thinking of it for the par meter, money better sent on an apogee.

 

[sunken3]

i dont have a fleece roller - but if i was buying a new system (sump), that would be a must have... filter socks suck... so much work... ugh (but i have 3 on my main tank, 2 on my second tank, and 1 on my frag tank).. the cost... and the cleaning.. fleece me up!

 

[RabidDragon]

Smprc:
2 large gyres? is that a specific brand, model?
2 return pumps for redundancy yes.
QT'ing, Yes I was planning on doing this, its my understanding that it didn't take much: a cycled rock preferably, an airstone/air pump and heater with a simple container... say a 10 gallon cheap tank and water changes.
I already have and use the 7 stage RODI BRS system, forgot to mention that. Bought it a few weeks ago.

Sunken3:
I've watched a ton of YouTube vids which include the vast majority of BRS's 52 week - 5 minute vids over the past 2 months.
150lbs of rock: I also watched several videos on rock scaping including BRS's that glued rocks together to form... rock trees? 150 is too much rock for this for a 160 tank? their guide was about 1lbs per gallon if I recall correctly, this is excessive? I wouldn't know until I started making my rock scape/tree.
I'll look at the test kits.
Seneye, I liked the continual monitoring and PAR meter but am very concerned about the negative reviews around the webapp and connectivity issues....

Thanks!

 

[sunken3]

i have 4 gyres - 2 maxspect and 2 icecap (i think made by maxspect). i like the icecap better - because they are also several years the newer model - which may be why. i also have the ecotech vortech - it is way more money than it should be, but they are great pumps and push a ton of flow. if money was not an issue - i would just get all vortechs.

on the rockwork, ya, no idea on the real lbs until you're done - i am just saying, maybe stick some xport bricks in the sump... and only use the rock work for art vs a rock wall.

ya, i almost got a seneye.. but the reviews are not so good - its not cheap. the slides are a monthly expense. also, the par meter is supposed to be pretty good, but only in perfect conditions.. lastly. the "hook it up to a laptop to use" just was an issue for me.

 

[RabidDragon]

i would definitely recommend an apex - get the full system (not the lite or XL..) you'll end up wanting to add stuff later.

Sunken3, which version are you recommending? there are many options. I was looking at the version that is currently $719 with thoughts of adding the auto feeder and dosage pumps later... perhaps others... Trident?

 

[Smprc]

The gyres are Maxspects xf280. I agree with sunken, filter socks are no fun. Make sure that you have room in the cabinet for all these goodies. Large sumps, Fresh water container for ATO, dosage containers...that all takes up room and of course plumbing.

 

[sp1187]

no live/dry rock.
DIY aquascape with pvc and 2 part putty.

 

[RabidDragon]

The gyres are Maxspects xf280. I agree with sunken, filter socks are no fun. Make sure that you have room in the cabinet for all these goodies. Large sumps, Fresh water container for ATO, dosage containers...that all takes up room and of course plumbing.

I've updated my build plan to 2 XF280 GYRE PUMP WITH CONTROLLER (6000 GPH) - MAXSPECT with increased flow to boot by removing the MP40's. Thanks.

no live/dry rock.
DIY aquascape with pvc and 2 part putty.

I assume you are referring to the QT tank? this system wouldn't have any bio cycle without it, just replace a couple gallons daily?

 

[sunken3]

I've updated my build plan to 2 XF280 GYRE PUMP WITH CONTROLLER (6000 GPH) - MAXSPECT with increased flow to boot by removing the MP40's. Thanks.



I assume you are referring to the QT tank? this system wouldn't have any bio cycle without it, just replace a couple gallons daily?

i actually like the ecotech mp40s more than the gyres... (i have both).

 

[Smprc]

as a heads up...the xf280's are an older model. They have the xf350s, cheaper and newer. Might want to check them out. They push slightly less water, but honestly, I can't run my xf280's at constant 100%, it blows the sand all over the place. I have them at random with a peak of 70%.

Sunken, do you think the mp40s is enough flow for that size tank? He might have to upgrade to the 60's. I am fairly confident that 2 mp40s would not provide enough flow in my tank.

 

[sunken3]

Sunken3, which version are you recommending? there are many options. I was looking at the version that is currently $719 with thoughts of adding the auto feeder and dosage pumps later... perhaps others... Trident?

i was thinking get the regular instead of the EL (i had accidently called it the XL previously). depends on what you wish to monitor. I really like the Trident, I have a DOS for AWC - ph, temp, orp, and conductivity probes - though the last really just to monitor for weird swings. I am not sure I 100% would rely on the conductivity probe by itself, but with a refractometer to validate a weird swing or something - it could be helpful to tell you if something happened in the tank and your ATO just dumped a bunch of freshwater in or something. i use the auto feeder - i used to use their AI light module, but went back to AI's when they brought of WIFI with their lights. i have the leak kits, but i am not too happy with those.. the salty air seems to rust their contact plates and they gives false readings often.

 

[sunken3]

as a heads up...the xf280's are an older model. They have the xf350s, cheaper and newer. Might want to check them out. They push slightly less water, but honestly, I can't run my xf280's at constant 100%, it blows the sand all over the place. I have them at random with a peak of 70%.

Sunken, do you think the mp40s is enough flow for that size tank? He might have to upgrade to the 60's. I am fairly confident that 2 mp40s would not provide enough flow in my tank.

well i have both - i have mp 20's and 40's.. never had the 60's (they are just so pricey). my 40's are tuned way down. if i turned them on full i am pretty confident that they'd blow my fish to the other wall. (but similar with the gyres - though they are higher up on the tank wall and would likely soak my lights). my tank is 72*28*28 (about 240 gallon) - 350 with all thats connected.

 

[schuby]

I'm on my 2nd tank now. 140gal with 39 gal sump. I chose to go as homogeneous as possible. I work in IT with servers and software programming. I know that things from different vendors that are supposed to work together don't, especially software-wise. To this end, I have everything Apex except my lights, skimmer, and chiller: full controller w/probes, 2x Cor20s, 2x flow meters, ATK, 2x WAVs, EB832, EB8, 2x DOS, & DDR. Yes, I have complete control, but what I consider most valuable is the visibility from the probes and flow meters. Just because the power is on doesn't mean the tank is operating normally.

Don't expect to get 1500 gph from each pump. Using larger pipe, say 1" instead of 3/4", will yield higher flowrate, if you have a choice.

If you can add even one piece of live rock from the ocean, it will save you much heartache/frustration and will tremendouslyincrease your likelyhoodof long-term success. That bacteria, microfauna, and other biodiversity will never be available from a bottle. The risk of a dangerous hitchhiker pales with the benefit.

One last thing,if you run macro-algae in your refugium, don't let your trace iron go to zero. The macro-algae will die, releasing all the consumed phosphate and nitrate back into your tank. The excessive phosphate will bind to the dry rock and will be difficult to remove.

 

[sp1187]

I've updated my build plan to 2 XF280 GYRE PUMP WITH CONTROLLER (6000 GPH) - MAXSPECT with increased flow to boot by removing the MP40's. Thanks.



I assume you are referring to the QT tank? this system wouldn't have any bio cycle without it, just replace a couple gallons daily?

nope. the display tank.

 

[laverda]

If your worried about redundancy I would not go with “2 X COR-15 Intelligent Return Pump (1500 GPH) - Neptune Systems” it is my understanding if your Apex or EB 832 fails neither pump will work. There are more reliable less expensive pumps available. I personally no longer rely on my Apex for any critical functions.