Need some Help Please.

[melypr1985]

So you may need to widen the spectrum of your antibiotics, to do that you can add kanaplex to what your using now. Then again, i would do a fresh water dip first to rule out Flukes. Just remember, that yes a dip can be stressful on the fish but if you follow the directions from humblefish above on the dip then you shouldn't have any problems. Usually only a fish that was already too far gone will die in a fw dip.

 

[Slacktide207]

I know how stressful it is to see your fish sick

 

[Budman's Corals]

Yeah they my favorite. Can I do a fresh water dip in the middle of this furan treatment?

 

[melypr1985]

I have never done one in the middle of a treatment before, but I would at least do it before your next dose. I dont see a reason not to at the point.
I mention it because most bacterial infections set in because there is a open wound on the fish somewhere. Like Flukes or ick or velvet creating tiny holes in their skin to get infected. If there is Flukes in there, then you should cure them first, then the infection that followed. Otherwise the fish will still decline in health no matter what else you do.

 

[Budman's Corals]

He did have this like 2 weeks prior to his eyes problem. It was healing fine though and now it's fully healed

 

[Slacktide207]

A PVC fitting to hide in would be good if you don't already have one.

 

[jlmfishlady]

Have a Orange Shoulder Tang that over night his eyes turne clear or silver,not cloudy at all everything else on his body looks perfect just hes been in 1 spot for 3 days and he acts blind i did move some rock work about 3days prior to him having this problem and this morning my Purple Tang has the same symptom

Anyone else have this problem Trying to figure out what it could be

Moving rocks will stir up all the gunk, causing levels to rise. My 1st thought is to do a 20 to 25% water change immediately. A repeat will likely be needed in several days. In the 15+ years of experience, I have found that anytime fish or corals exhibit signs of illness.....check water quality and start there. I would only medicate 3 days post water change if no improvement is seen.

 

[Humblefish]

So you may need to widen the spectrum of your antibiotics, to do that you can add kanaplex to what your using now. Then again, i would do a fresh water dip first to rule out Flukes. Just remember, that yes a dip can be stressful on the fish but if you follow the directions from humblefish above on the dip then you shouldn't have any problems. Usually only a fish that was already too far gone will die in a fw dip.

^^I would listen to this nice lady. If flukes are present, that means a very different treatment from the antibiotics you are currently using. You would use Prazipro to treat flukes, but it is dicey mixing prazi with other meds due to the Oxybispropanol it contains. Only copper seems to be safe to mix it with.

If you follow the instructions I posted previously on doing a FW dip, the fish will be fine afterwards. Use a dark bucket and look for tiny white specks falling out of the fish (especially out of the gills.) If no flukes are present, I suggest adding these two medications to the Furan-2 you are already using: Kanaplex & Metroplex. Some strains of bacterial infections are very nasty. They require broader treatment and it can take up to 10 days of continuous treatment before the fish shows signs of recovery.

 

[Slacktide207]

I know you are being bombarded with what to do and by no means do I know what your fish has, just some info on what I have done in the past for ich and a flat worm explosion in my tanks. (I used a 50 gallon rubber made tote for larger fish with PVC fittings) I used this process with great results, any info I feel is beneficial

Hyposalinity How-To

Hyposalinity or Hypo, is the process of gradually lowering the salinity of your water to a range of 12-14%, or to a specific gravity of 1.008-1.010, 1.009 being the ideal level. Then holding it there for 4-6 weeks.

Hyposalinity will disrupt the life cycle of Marine Ich. If Ich cannot complete its 4-stage life cycle, it cannot continue to infect our fish. There are conflicting reports as to which part of the cycle is killed. Some say it will cause the Theront (free swimming/infective) stage to rupture, killing it. Some say it causes problems in the Tomont (encysted/reproductive) stage. Tomonts need a higher osmotic pressure to finish the reproductive cycle; at a specific gravity of 1.009 they cannot complete their part of the cycle. They die, never to emerge. Whichever the case, hyposalinity works.

Hypo will also kill your inverts such as shrimp, snails, corals as well as live rock and live sand. So make sure you treat your fish in an appropriate area, i.e. in a Quarantine/Hospital tank.

Accurate measurement of salinity is essential to the success of this method. A refractometer is almost a MUST HAVE. I have checked my swing arm hydrometer against my refractometer and the difference is unacceptable. They are pretty close at a level such as 1.025 but nowhere near close at 1.009. If a refractometer is unavailable a floating glass hydrometer will work.

There should be no substrate in the tank during the procedure. A bare bottom tank gives the Tomonts less places to encyst. Also, it will make cleaning a bit easier. A few clean PVC fittings should be used for hiding places for the fish.

Starting with SW at a specific gravity of 1.025 @ 78-82*f, you will want to make a 1/5th total volume water change with clean, aged, treated, FRESH WATER every 12 hours until you reach 1.009. This will take approx 4-5 water changes depending on the volume being changed. Keep a close eye on the salinity during the whole process. Do not lower the specific gravity more than .005 at one time.You will probably see white spots on the fish within the first 7 days of the treatment. The move should be stressful enough to the fish to trigger an outbreak. It takes 3 to 7 days for mature Trophonts (parasitic stage) to exit the fish, with the peak being 3-5 days. Keep an eye on the fish.

The treatment should last 4-6 weeks or for 4 weeks AFTER the last spot was seen on a fish. Again, keep a close eye on ph and specific gravity. Keeping the tank covered helps keep specific gravity in check.

When you are convinced that your fish are Ich free, the salinity should be raised slowly. More so than when you lowered it. Again, treatment should last for 4 weeks AFTER the last spot was seen on a fish.

Raising the salinity should be a done slowly, 3 to 7 days is recommended. Using water of normal salinity (ex1.025) replace 1/6th of the water to raise it from 1.009 to 1.012. As the specific gravity creeps closer to 1.025 you will have to either adjust more water each time or use higher salinity water. When raising the salinity, no water should be discarded. You should raise the salinity of the water removed and then replace the water into the system.

Once you reach your desired specific gravity, you are done. Just reintroduce your fish as if it were the first time they were going into your tank.

I also found it very helpful to keep a daily log of what was happening. It wasn’t much, just a daily entry and a few quick notes.

All fish in the main tank must be treated in order for this process to work. If the main tank is left fish-less during this period, when the fish are reintroduced 6 to 8 weeks later, there will be no Ich in the system.

Most importantly, BE PATIENT.

WARNINGS……………….

It is a dangerous practice to mix copper treatments with hyposalinity treatments. Choose one or the other.

Marine invertebrates will die due to osmotic shock. Sharks and rays may not survive hyposalinity due to their unique method of osmoregulation

 

[joshkirkland83]

Id listen to humblefish. Hes never steered me wrong.

 

[Budman's Corals]

I'm doing the fw dip as soon as I get home its only matter time they will die of starvation if I don't do something quick, I don't wanna rush but as humble fish said it might relieve some stress and rule our flukes I will let yall know if I find flukes will be within the next 3 hours

 

[merlberg]

Have you lowered the salinity in the quarantine tank?

Should the salinity be lowered if using copper as well?

 

[melypr1985]

Should the salinity be lowered if using copper as well?

No ma'am

 

[Slacktide207]

No, one or the other for treatment

 

[Humblefish]

I'm doing the fw dip as soon as I get home its only matter time they will die of starvation if I don't do something quick, I don't wanna rush but as humble fish said it might relieve some stress and rule our flukes I will let yall know if I find flukes will be within the next 3 hours

The presence of the antibiotics could very well be suppressing the fish's appetite. But if you don't get whatever is causing the cloudy eyes under control (whether it's flukes or an infection), then the fish could permanently lose vision in one or both eyes. Losing vision in both eyes is a death sentence for a fish. So, it's a quagmire.

After you do the FW dip, let us know if you saw any flukes and we can tell you how to best proceed next.

 

[Humblefish]

Just my 2 cents on hyposalinity... it has been proven to treat ich and ich only. If it turns out to be velvet, and many times velvet looks like ich in the early stages, your fish will die in hypo treatment. This is why copper is a necessary evil IMO - it treats both ich and velvet. So you are covered both ways.

For those who wish to employ hypo to treat ich, here are 3 things you need to know:

1. Take a full 48 hours to gradually lower the SG down to 1.009. Treat for 30 consecutive days, and during that time the SG must always remain at 1.009. If it inches up even slightly, the 30 day clock restarts.
   
2. Because it is so imperative to hold the line at exactly 1.009 you need to use a perfectly calibrated refractometer and auto top off system when performing hypo. Some people like to drop it down to 1.008 to afford themselves a little wiggle room, but I know people who have lost fish that way.
3. "More recently, studies have demonstrated different salinity tolerances among strains of Cryptocaryon. Yambot (2003) described one Taiwanese outbreak occurring in sea bream Sparus sarba at a salinity of 5 g/L, and another outbreak in sea perch Lates calcarifer occurring at a salinity of 10 g/L. These two strains were successfully propagated in the laboratory at 7 and 10 g/L, respectively, and are well below previously documented preferred salinities." *

* Quoted directly from this link: https://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/fa164

 

[Budman's Corals]

I Did the Fw and noting came out in 4 minutes i did the purple tang since hes only had this problem 2 days . im assuming i would see something if it was flukes. now what do i do
Do i do the 3rd treatment of furan

 

[Humblefish]

I Did the Fw and noting came out in 4 minutes i did the purple tang since hes only had this problem 2 days . im assuming i would see something if it was flukes. now what do i do
Do i do the 3rd treatment of furan

Yes, as it is very likely you are dealing with a bacterial infection then. The cut on the tang (pic you posted above) lends weight to this theory as well and is probably where the infection started in the first place. It has now spread to his eyes and apparently even to some of your other fish.

I would treat with this combination of meds: Furan-2, Kanaplex and Metroplex (or Metro-MS). That is going to give you the widest possible spectrum of treatment. Even if you lose some of these fish (and I hope you do not), hitting them with everything but the kitchen sink gives them the best possible chance for survival at this point. I can tell you from experience that knowing you did everything you could to save a fish's life lessens the pain if it does indeed happen.

Are the eyes just cloudy or do they look swelled up as well?

 

[merlberg]

No ma'am

Ok

 

[Budman's Corals]

no fl

Yes, as it is very likely you are dealing with a bacterial infection then. The cut on the tang (pic you posted above) lends weight to this theory as well and is probably where the infection started in the first place. It has now spread to his eyes and apparently even to some of your other fish.

I would treat with this combination of meds: Furan-2, Kanaplex and Metroplex (or Metro-MS). That is going to give you the widest possible spectrum of treatment. Even if you lose some of these fish (and I hope you do not), hitting them with everything but the kitchen sink gives them the best possible chance for survival at this point. I can tell you from experience that knowing you did everything you could to save a fish's life lessens the pain if it does indeed happen.

Are the eyes just cloudy or do they look swelled up as well?

its funny sometimes the eye gets the black middle back and sometimes it goes away, the eyes are not puffy at all well might be just a little but i wen tahead and fw the orange also just casue it seemed the purple was swimming around better or lets say not swimming on bottom. they handled the fw fine breathing was heavy but only went 4 minutes,you would think i would of saw something by then correct.
ill try to take a pic of them now