Nitrate and Phosphorus Control via Phytoplankton Additions?

AlgaeBarn

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ns, 2-Neon Gobies - about 20 inches total length in all and growing.) These fishes are fed at least 3x daily with frozen mysis, live adult brine shrimp and nauplii, frozen 'meaty' fish foods, an algae-based frozen food, two types flake foods, two types pellet foods. Nori seaweed (attached to a clip) is added in the morning for the Tangs. About 25 coral fragments have been added. These are fed ReefRoids and a similar product from Germany (Fauna Marin). These are soaked in Selcon, coral feeding stimulator and amino acid supplement from Polyp Lab, and a VitaChem product. Since some of the corals I have are omnivores, I add at least 250 milliliters of phytoplankton daily as well. This is added several times a day. The Goniopora specimens are growing as are all others - there are also some feather-dusters that arrived on the live rock that are demonstrating good growth. Since the protein skimmer would remove the phytoplankton, it is on a timer and runs only
FWIW, the people at Florida Farms told me to be careful not to cross contaminate my Nanno and Tetra or I'd end up with only Tetra.
Nanno can usually outcompete Tetra.
 
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salty joe

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Your light intensity and duration will effect the overall growth cycles of the culture from stationary to death phase so the amount of liquid you need to extract and the time you need to extract it will vary if your aim is to keep the culture in the exponential growth phase of it's life cycle. This can contribute to culture crashes long term.

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I've only been growing my Nanno and Tetra for a couple months. My plan is to have a regular routine for harvest. Barring contamination, am I setting myself up for a crash?
 

siggy

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Dana when I read your daily feeding regimen for what sounds like a few (9) fish, I was amazed at the quantity and all the added supplements. Could those be contributing to supplement the plankton and increasing diversity you are experiencing?
 
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Dana Riddle

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Could it be that by dosing phytoplankton, your benthic sponges are increasing and the sponges are filtering or consuming more nitrates and phosphates?
I believe there are a number of algae-consuming animals consuming it. I'm investigating the purchase of equipment to test for Total Nitrogen and Total Phosphorus and look at their fates. This will be a long-term project!
 

hart24601

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Isn’t this technique fairly similar in principle to carbon dosing? You are adding the organisms, which is optional in carbon dosing (being carbon limited the bacteria grow fast enough when supplemented), but those organisms are consuming nutrient quickly and are then exported via the skimmer (at night here) or being consumed in the tank. Seems like the same theory of export. I carbon dose small amounts not for nutrient reduction but to feed the tank in the same way as I notice filter feeders and sponges really take off. I even have done low levels of carbon dosing in skimmerless sytems as it seem the system consumes a great deal of the populations dosing supports.
 
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Dana Riddle

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Dana when I read your daily feeding regimen for what sounds like a few (9) fish, I was amazed at the quantity and all the added supplements. Could those be contributing to supplement the plankton and increasing diversity you are experiencing?
Quite possible. As I mentioned, I'd like to investigate the fates of Total P and Total N in this aquarium. When subtracting orthophosphate and inorganic nitrogen species, when can began to understand what's going on in the tanks.
 
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Dana Riddle

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Isn’t this technique fairly similar in principle to carbon dosing? You are adding the organisms, which is optional in carbon dosing (being carbon limited the bacteria grow fast enough when supplemented), but those organisms are consuming nutrient quickly and are then exported via the skimmer (at night here) or being consumed in the tank. Seems like the same theory of export. I carbon dose small amounts not for nutrient reduction but to feed the tank in the same way as I notice filter feeders and sponges really take off. I even have done low levels of carbon dosing in skimmerless sytems as it seem the system consumes a great deal of the populations dosing supports.
Sounds like your technique exports nutrients via bacterial populations. Many roads lead to Rome.
Hey @Dana Riddle. This brings me to a question I haven't asked yet because I thought it was just rubbish. With the findings of you adding phytoplankton to your build and seeing nitrate and phosphate lower brought me to ask. I recently started dosing algae Barn phytoplankton. After about a week I started noticing dinoflagellates in my sand bed. They are starting to spread to the rocks now. Do you think dosing the phyto could have brought this on. I thought I was crazy but if the phyto is lowering my nutrients and allowing the dinos to thrive ot makes more sense. Sorry if this isnt appropriate for this thread but I thought it fit.
I'm not afraid to say I don't know. I haven't had any issues with nuisance outbreaks in the DT, although there is some cyano in the sump.
 
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Dana Riddle

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following, I would like to know a little more about your phyto culturing do you have power heads in it? And what are you using for light?
A little background - I bought a beautiful Goniopora specimen from a LFS, and they were selling pints of microalgae they feed them. On a lark, I threw together an algae culture system. See photo. The upper tank uses a 9-watt 'grow' LED lamp, while the lower tanks are lighted by an old BuildMyLED strip I had laying around. A Luft air pump provides circulation. This setup works for me.

algae culture.jpg
 

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A little background - I bought a beautiful Goniopora specimen from a LFS, and they were selling pints of microalgae they feed them. On a lark, I threw together an algae culture system. See photo. The upper tank uses a 9-watt 'grow' LED lamp, while the lower tanks are lighted by an old BuildMyLED strip I had laying around. A Luft air pump provides circulation. This setup works for me.

algae culture.jpg
I will read up on this more, but I wonder if a large media reactor in the sump could grow and drip a concentration daily to the system?
 

neilp2006

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Are you culturing phyto or buying it by the bottle? I paid $10 or the initial culture and about that for the Gulliard's formula and presently have 60 gallons (!) under culture. Some of that will be dedicated to rotifer culture - have rotifer eggs but haven't had time to hatch them yet.
And I thought my 6 gallons was good going, lol. But I’m only feeding 3 gallons of pods not dosing my DT. No point- no corals yet. But I will once I do.
 
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Dana Riddle

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And I thought my 6 gallons was good going, lol. But I’m only feeding 3 gallons of pods not dosing my DT. No point- no corals yet. But I will once I do.
I'll continue dosing the tank with green water until I have a valid reason to stop. You likely know this already, but it's a misconception that corals don't feed on microalgae. Makes me wonder what success could be had with Dendronephthya if green water is heavily dosed.
 

neilp2006

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I use a continuous in tank culture, basically consists of a reservoir in the refugium area that pulls 3ml of tank water every 60 minutes by a doser and den it drops 3 ml of phytoplankton in the tank by gravity. Also got the doser set to drop 2ml of fertiliser every 7 days. Basically a full automated phytoplankton system the only labour I got to do is to is to adjust salinity every 14 days to compensate evaporation.

Looks a bit like this wend it was connected to a continuous rotifers culture.



I was able to go as high as 9ml per hour (216ml per 24h) but had to bring it down again due to not be able to increase nitrates and dinos were just setting in at 0 readings.

At the time I done this sketch I was using a reservoir with a lower salinity to make it all work.

I just find it stress free also don’t really have space in the apartment to have a normal culture going [emoji23]
What vessels are you using? 2 liter soda bottles?
 

Da8

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Could it be that by dosing phytoplankton, your benthic sponges are increasing and the sponges are filtering or consuming more nitrates and phosphates?
That's it, but better explained in the next quote.


Phytoplankton are primary producers and therefore the base of the ecosystem for all aquatic environments. Being autotrophic primary producers they produce all their nutritional requirements from abiotic energy sources. Heterotrophs (predators) consume these organisms to gain biomass which is then transferred up to food web i.e. algae>zooplankton>small fish>large fish etc. Basically any organism that can feed off them directly or indirectly through other organisms that feed off them that can then be consumed by the final predator will have benefit.

This is my main reason for my beleif in adding phytopacton daily to the tank.
(you can see my tank in my post in order to see the results. a.k.a A picture is worth a thousand words )

I dose 16ml of easy booster in 4 doses of 4 ml. Still trying to figure out which is the best part of the day to add them.
@Dana Riddle this maybe has some importance due to the activity of certain organisims during some parts of the photopeiod as happens with AA.

I present you easy booster for those who don't know the product. I think it's worth each cent, and I've using it for years.

It stimulates the growth of all minor organism , which then consume N and P for living and that are consumed by bigger predators.
The success rate of Non photosintetic corals has increased greatly being able to maintain species which up to then, where almost impossible like dendronephtya.

EasyBooster are marine microalgae and other marine minerals delivering all the essential vitamins, fatty acids, amino acids, proteins, and other bioactive compounds
It contains Isochrysis T-ISO (33%), Nannochloropsis (31%), Tetraselmis (18%), and Phaeodactylum (18%).



It can either be used manually with single dose packets or with a doser, which makes everything more comfortable.

I'm sure by the time you try it, you gonna love it.
 

John Hanna

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@Dana Riddle where did you source your PAM meter from? I use to have access to a pocket pam but didn't take note of where it was sourced from or if it's still available. From memory I think it was Gademann Instruments.
 
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Dana Riddle

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@Dana Riddle where did you source your PAM meter from? I use to have access to a pocket pam but didn't take note of where it was sourced from or if it's still available. From memory I think it was Gademann Instruments.
I have two PAM fluorometers, both from Walz in Germany - a Teaching PAM (old, DOS-based) and the newer Windows Junior PAM.
www.walz.com
 

erk

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@Dana Riddle have you noticed an increase in your pH since dosing phyto?
 

Mark Gray

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A little background - I bought a beautiful Goniopora specimen from a LFS, and they were selling pints of microalgae they feed them. On a lark, I threw together an algae culture system. See photo. The upper tank uses a 9-watt 'grow' LED lamp, while the lower tanks are lighted by an old BuildMyLED strip I had laying around. A Luft air pump provides circulation. This setup works for me.

algae culture.jpg
Thanks for the response, I have not tried to grow green water. I have one more question. I would really like to give this a try, but I am wondering if you think it would do ok in a non heated or cooled garage. I also live in Georgia and I think my wife would flip if I did this in the house. and at least for right now I am doing everything I can to keep her happy.
 
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Dana Riddle

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Thanks for the response, I have not tried to grow green water. I have one more question. I would really like to give this a try, but I am wondering if you think it would do ok in a non heated or cooled garage. I also live in Georgia and I think my wife would flip if I did this in the house. and at least for right now I am doing everything I can to keep her happy.
Hello from Dallas Georgia! If I recall correctly, Martin Moe published a photo of green water/rotifer cultures in kiddie pools outdoors in Florida. Worth a try.
 
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Dana Riddle

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@Dana Riddle have you noticed an increase in your pH since dosing phyto?
I can't say. I was using a Seneye to monitor pH and changed slides. According to it, the pH actually dropped. Unfortunately, my lab's pH probe failed to calibrate during this episode, so I can't confirm. Time to bite the bullet and by a new Hach probe for the HQ40 data logger.
 
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