NoPox and Red Sea's Accelerated Growth program

[nrupaw]

In an effort to bring Nitrates down, i decided to give No3 Po4-X a shot. After a month or so of using, my nitrates are down from 25 to 2. No complains there. However it also bought my P04 down to near undetectable levels. Right now reading 0 via Hanna Phosphorus ULR.

I was aiming for Red Sea's accelerated growth settings which recommend N03 to be at 1-2ppm, and P04 at 0.1 to maintain a relatively high population of Zooxanthellae that will provide enough energy to the corals for growth.

How do i bring P04 closer to 0.1ppm without increasing Nitrates too?

 

[ahammer]

Remember test kits have margins of error as well, if concerned I personally would add a little extra food to solve the issue.

 

[nrupaw]

Remember test kits have margins of error as well, if concerned I personally would add a little extra food to solve the issue.

Not too worried about the test kits. But I can understand a Hanna 713 having some margin of error for detecting low phosphates because it reads in ppm, but 736 reads in ppb and has much great accuracy. Even with a margin of error accounted for, my P04 is still much lower than what i need it to be.

 

[smokin'reefer]

I have same concerns in my tank. I've been overfeeding but haven't had much effect except some hair algea. I've read that if you have some types of algae it actually consumes the phosphates and gives a false reading. Following along to see what else is offered up.

 

[nrupaw]

I have same concerns in my tank. I've been overfeeding but haven't had much effect except some hair algea. I've read that if you have some types of algae it actually consumes the phosphates and gives a false reading. Following along to see what else is offered up.

Well, all algae takes up phosphastes. Hobbyist level P04 tests just approx measures the free phosphastes in water vs actual. Best way i can explain it is, if you have any algae in your tank, you have phosphates. Best and most reliable P04 test

 

[smokin'reefer]

Good to know. At least some of this massive amounts of info is starting to sink in.

 

[GoVols]

Well, all algae takes up phosphastes. Hobbyist level P04 tests just approx measures the free phosphastes in water vs actual. Best way i can explain it is, if you have any algae in your tank, you have phosphates. Best and most reliable P04 test

+1
I had hair algae on my old live rock for months but no where else. My hanna checker showed phos was in check. Well my old live rock was leaching phos and the hair algae was holding in the leaching phos and not letting the phos get in the water column. Thus tricking the hanna checker. So I started tumbling GFO in it's own reactor and within two weeks the hair algae was gone and has never returned.

 

[SPR1968]

In an effort to bring Nitrates down, i decided to give No3 Po4-X a shot. After a month or so of using, my nitrates are down from 25 to 2. No complains there. However it also bought my P04 down to near undetectable levels. Right now reading 0 via Hanna Phosphorus ULR.

I was aiming for Red Sea's accelerated growth settings which recommend N03 to be at 1-2ppm, and P04 at 0.1 to maintain a relatively high population of Zooxanthellae that will provide enough energy to the corals for growth.

How do i bring P04 closer to 0.1ppm without increasing Nitrates too?

I have followed the accelerated growth parameters for around 7 months and it certainly works as far as coral growth goes, they really do grow. Not sure SPS are to keen as I only have a few and I believe they can brown due to the increase in zooxanthelia. But LPS and my soft corals loved it to the point I was having to frag some of them!

I also dose NoPox but what I did notice in my tank was that although the nitrates were kept in check, originally at between 1-2ppm, the phosphate gradually increased and this seemed to coincide with an outbreak of hair algea which gradually got worse and worse on the live rock. And I was feeding the fish once a day lightly.

Phosphate peeked at 0.16ppm at which point with the hair algea I had to do something to stop it taking over the tank, so I purchased a Deltec FR509 reactor and started running Rowaphos GFO. Within a week this had reduced phosphate to <0.04 and it remains in check. I have the Red Sea Pro and Hanna testers and from what I believe your unlikely to have 0 phosphate even though the checker says you have. I can now feed the fish a lot more without affecting parameters.

Just to go on a bit further, I started scrubbing the hair algea with a toothbrush and when I checked my Nitrate a few days after it had shot up to 15-20ppm and I've been slowly dragging it back down over the last month or so and currently sitting at somewhere just above 5ppm. The hair algea has not completely gone as yet but it's under control and I've also just added a small bag of Purigen to pull out a few more nutrients. The later is just a bit of a trial.

Having spent hours reading about phosphate etc the general recommendations (apart from Red Sea with their accelerated growth) seems to be around 0.03ppm and any higher levels can lead to algea problems, which is exactly what I found.

I'm by no means an expert on these things as yet, but I'm just telling you my experience in allowing the phosphate to rise above the general 'normal' recommendations. So if you follow it just keep an eye out for nuisance algea issues. It was very slow in my tank over a month or so before I realised something was wrong.

I'm currently dropping back down to normal levels as recommended on here simply because I don't want to take any chances with algea outbreaks because of high phosphate levels.

 

[GoVols]

I have followed the accelerated growth parameters for around 7 months and it certainly works as far as coral growth goes, they really do grow. Not sure SPS are to keen as I only have a few and I believe they can brown due to the increase in zooxanthelia. But LPS and my soft corals loved it to the point I was having to frag some of them!

I also dose NoPox but what I did notice in my tank was that although the nitrates were kept in check, originally at between 1-2ppm, the phosphate gradually increased and this seemed to coincide with an outbreak of hair algea which gradually got worse and worse on the live rock. And I was feeding the fish once a day lightly.

Phosphate peeked at 0.16ppm at which point with the hair algea I had to do something to stop it taking over the tank, so I purchased a Deltec FR509 reactor and started running Rowaphos GFO. Within a week this had reduced phosphate to <0.04 and it remains in check. I have the Red Sea Pro and Hanna testers and from what I believe your unlikely to have 0 phosphate even though the checker says you have. I can now feed the fish a lot more without affecting parameters.

Just to go on a bit further, I started scrubbing the hair algea with a toothbrush and when I checked my Nitrate a few days after it had shot up to 15-20ppm and I've been slowly dragging it back down over the last month or so and currently sitting at somewhere just above 5ppm. The hair algea has not completely gone as yet but it's under control and I've also just added a small bag of Purigen to pull out a few more nutrients. The later is just a bit of a trial.

Having spent hours reading about phosphate etc the general recommendations (apart from Red Sea with their accelerated growth) seems to be around 0.03ppm and any higher levels can lead to algea problems, which is exactly what I found.

I'm by no means an expert on these things as yet, but I'm just telling you my experience in allowing the phosphate to rise above the general 'normal' recommendations. So if you follow it just keep an eye out for nuisance algea issues. It was very slow in my tank over a month or so before I realised something was wrong.

I'm currently dropping back down to normal levels as recommended on here simply because I don't want to take any chances with algea outbreaks because of high phosphate levels.

+1

And a Rowaphos junkie over here

 

[jtdesotel]

I'm curious, how many of you run GFO as well as NoPox? I removed my GFO and started dosing NoPox about a month ago, would I get better results using the GFO as well as the NoPox?

 

[SPR1968]

I'm curious, how many of you run GFO as well as NoPox? I removed my GFO and started dosing NoPox about a month ago, would I get better results using the GFO as well as the NoPox?

I would run with NoPox alone for a bit longer to start with and see how you get on with it. It needs a certain amount of phosphate and time to work correctly. I used it for probably 7 months from starting new tank but it's then the phosphate started to creep up. I was told to wet skim, which I do anyway, but it didn't make any difference and I had hair algea breakout and that's why I turned to Rhowaphos.

I asked a similar question to you, can you run with both together, and the answer is yes as many do. If you find like I did that the nitrate is fine but the phosphate is not, then use a GFO as well if you need to.

The other problem was I was barely feeding my fish whereas now I can feed them like pigs and the phosphate doesn't move currently <0.04

It's basically carbon dosing in a fancy pot and there are many articles about that etc

 

[BlueCursor]

For me to keep algae at bay I have to have nitrates much higher than phosphates. NO3 at 5 and PO4 at 0.05 and I have no algea. NO3 at 1 and PO4 at 0.05 and I will have algae issues.

 

[jtdesotel]

Thanks man, I appreciate the info and the detailed response!!!

I would run with NoPox alone for a bit longer to start with and see how you get on with it. It needs a certain amount of phosphate and time to work correctly. I used it for probably 7 months from starting new tank but it's then the phosphate started to creep up. I was told to wet skim, which I do anyway, but it didn't make any difference and I had hair algea breakout and that's why I turned to Rhowaphos.

I asked a similar question to you, can you run with both together, and the answer is yes as many do. If you find like I did that the nitrate is fine but the phosphate is not, then use a GFO as well if you need to.

The other problem was I was barely feeding my fish whereas now I can feed them like pigs and the phosphate doesn't move currently <0.04

It's basically carbon dosing in a fancy pot and there are many articles about that etc

 

[BlueCursor]

NoPox is ethanol dosing, and it's about the same price as a liter of Vodka when you consider you have to dose 2.5 times the vodka to get the same amount of ethanol as NoPox. Plus people under 21 can by NoPox. NoPox is denatured, so try to drink it! You will go blind.

 

[GoVols]

NoPox is ethanol dosing, and it's about the same price as a liter of Vodka when you consider you have to dose 2.5 times the vodka to get the same amount of ethanol as NoPox. Plus people under 21 can by NoPox. NoPox is denatured, so try to drink it! You will go blind.

So are you saying take a drink of Vodka while dosing your reef with NoPox?

 

[Rick Mathew]

So are you saying take a drink of Vodka while dosing your reef with NoPox?

If you did that enough you may not care what the numbers are

 

[GoVols]

If you did that enough you may not care what the numbers are

lol,
Tru Dat, Tru Dat

 

[roberthu526]

Haha this is a happy thread. I need to have some tonight.

However, I have been dosing NOPOX for 20 days and while it brought down my nitrate from 20 to 1 ppm, my phosphate kept swinging between 0.2 and 0.4 ppm read from Hanna ULR checker. The weirdest thing is I am running GFO in to BRS reactors, one with carbon and regular GFO mix and the other with just high capacity GFO. My tank is 125G with a 30G refugium, I assume rock takes about 30G so the total volume is say 125G. I am dosing 10ml NOPOX daily, running 1 cup of regular GFO mixed with 1 cup of 0.8 carbon and another cup of high capacity GFO. Yet my phosphate doesn't seem to move at all, one day it's 0.15 ppm and the next day it's 0.4 ppm, and one more day it goes to 0.3 ppm. I am just totally lost.... My nitrate on the other hand stays at 1 ppm for weeks without moving. My frogspawns and hammers all receded within a month and the only LPS I have left now are a few Duncans which aren't doing great either. They were doing fine before I started carbon dosing. I now regret going this route to combat algae....

Has anyone experienced the same thing?