William Robinson
Active Member
Disclaimer: This thread is not to prove anything one way or another. It is "food for thought" after 15 years in the hobby and hundreds of dives in locations around the world. Please keep it civil and read it as just that, "food for thought". A good toilet read? lol
This is a topic I've seen go back and forth. Many saying explosions in population are due to over feeding which of course this does not help keep them from multiplying. the true question is are they really harmful or are the just a nuisance to the eye.
The reason of posting this question is while diving many of the "artificial" reefs or man made reefs (scuttled vessels) off the coast of Panama City, FL I have made a point to inspect coral, rock and whatever I could find to see what was actually there, the density of the population which is important when discussing out reef tanks and what exactly they look like (Species differences, only visual indicators. I was stationed at Fort Rucker, Alabama while in helicopter flight school and had the opportunity to dive every single weekend almost for 2 years with a friend of mine and his awesome vessel covering more than 100 sites. I am no expert on species so only visual differences from what is in our tanks)
Here is what I discovered/observed;
1. The species is visually consistent with what I/we find in our home aquariums originating in the Pacific as "most" (Not all, so dont get too excited) of our SPS and LPS originate from.
2. The population density per square foot which was a ROUGH estimate as the surfaces in our aquariums are vastly more porous than what is encounter on wrecks. Meaning 1sqft on the dive was more accurate then what I count in my tank due to the "perfect reef rock" being what we traditionally keep. Anyhow, in the tank I did find there to be more than in the ocean per square feet. on average a ratio of about 1 to 3. For every 1 I found on the wreck, there were 3 in my tank in the same space.
Now consider this, the ocean isn't perfect. In many way our tanks are "more perfect" than the actual sea water. We only supply the best of the best in most cases and control the environment rigorously. Is the snail "infestation" mother nature truly just taking its course. Are they doing their part in filtering overfed tanks and removing wasted food? Are they harming the environment in which they live? Notice I said "harming the "environment", not are they harming our inhabitants. We'll get to the inhabitants. Or, is mother nature in our contained ecosystem doing its best to maintain a balance regardless of our misguided efforts in the pursuit of the ideal aquarium in each of our minds. There are VERY FEW of us that actually keep tanks that are perfect examples of specific regions or reefs in the world. To do this you would need to target a specific reef, at a specific depth, specific lighting and the exact creatures found in the location. I would be EXTREMELY impressed if anyone reading this could say "thats me!". If it is you, then you are owed a tremendous aware that R2R needs to create...lol
3. We do not know the amount of waste these creature produce versus how much excess nutrients they remove. By removing them I am sure you would not disturb the balance of the ecosystem in your tank as the population and nutrient requirement of these creatures is immeasurably small.
4. But what about the argument they damage coral: I TOTALLY agree that the cause damage in coral skeleton growth so if you comment pointing that out expect to see a "see item 4 of the post". However, with proper feeding schedules of your tank, population management of the said "pest" is more easily controlled/avoided. These snail cast mucus nets that lay across rock and inhibit algae growth yes but I have not observed any interference of coraline algae. Only that of the green longer algaes. I also have not ever personally observed any coral retraction, stunting or any adverse reaction to a mucus net hitting a coral. These muscus nets are often only deployed when feeding from what I have observed in the home aquarium. Now on the reef itself I have noticed they can be more constant. Is this because food is scarce or constantly available in low quantity in the ocean? That's a question we will never know.
5. But they are just unsightly... Valid point, especially when it is a true infestation and not a normal (healthy?) population to a thriving ecosystem.
So this is the "food for thought" point of this thread. Not necessarily a question to be answered. If these snails are a normal part of a thriving ecosystem and not actually a "pest" then instead of eradicating them from our reefs where they perform a function should we do our best to maintain a proportionate healthy population as we do with algae and other life that is naturally occurring and must be properly managed.
About me (If you care): I am a hobbyist about 15 years give or take of continuously keeping reef aquariums which has been challenging considering military service. I currently have 4 running systems. 3 are mixed reef and 1 SPS dominate. I am new to dosing aquariums. I have previously kept up with water changes and adding supplements as needed. Which became quite a chore with 4 tanks. I started keeping a reef tank shortly after I got into diving. Being in the military has forwarded me the opportunity to dive all over the world in South Korea, Japan, Turkey, Florida, Caymans, Honduras, Ecuador, Vietnam, Mexico, Italy, Croatia, Indonesia, Malaysia and the Philippines. My experiences and observations of wildlife in its natural state versus how we keep our aquariums is what lead me to the writing this thread. I've also used aquarium equipment from around the world. RO/DI is not something you find easily in some of the countries I was in when I started out so I often went against the normal practices using what was available and finding solutions to work within what was available. I can tell you now Italy was by far a hard place to have a reef aquarium around the early 2000's... I could write a book on homemade equipment from "my dark ages"
This is a topic I've seen go back and forth. Many saying explosions in population are due to over feeding which of course this does not help keep them from multiplying. the true question is are they really harmful or are the just a nuisance to the eye.
The reason of posting this question is while diving many of the "artificial" reefs or man made reefs (scuttled vessels) off the coast of Panama City, FL I have made a point to inspect coral, rock and whatever I could find to see what was actually there, the density of the population which is important when discussing out reef tanks and what exactly they look like (Species differences, only visual indicators. I was stationed at Fort Rucker, Alabama while in helicopter flight school and had the opportunity to dive every single weekend almost for 2 years with a friend of mine and his awesome vessel covering more than 100 sites. I am no expert on species so only visual differences from what is in our tanks)
Here is what I discovered/observed;
1. The species is visually consistent with what I/we find in our home aquariums originating in the Pacific as "most" (Not all, so dont get too excited) of our SPS and LPS originate from.
2. The population density per square foot which was a ROUGH estimate as the surfaces in our aquariums are vastly more porous than what is encounter on wrecks. Meaning 1sqft on the dive was more accurate then what I count in my tank due to the "perfect reef rock" being what we traditionally keep. Anyhow, in the tank I did find there to be more than in the ocean per square feet. on average a ratio of about 1 to 3. For every 1 I found on the wreck, there were 3 in my tank in the same space.
Now consider this, the ocean isn't perfect. In many way our tanks are "more perfect" than the actual sea water. We only supply the best of the best in most cases and control the environment rigorously. Is the snail "infestation" mother nature truly just taking its course. Are they doing their part in filtering overfed tanks and removing wasted food? Are they harming the environment in which they live? Notice I said "harming the "environment", not are they harming our inhabitants. We'll get to the inhabitants. Or, is mother nature in our contained ecosystem doing its best to maintain a balance regardless of our misguided efforts in the pursuit of the ideal aquarium in each of our minds. There are VERY FEW of us that actually keep tanks that are perfect examples of specific regions or reefs in the world. To do this you would need to target a specific reef, at a specific depth, specific lighting and the exact creatures found in the location. I would be EXTREMELY impressed if anyone reading this could say "thats me!". If it is you, then you are owed a tremendous aware that R2R needs to create...lol
3. We do not know the amount of waste these creature produce versus how much excess nutrients they remove. By removing them I am sure you would not disturb the balance of the ecosystem in your tank as the population and nutrient requirement of these creatures is immeasurably small.
4. But what about the argument they damage coral: I TOTALLY agree that the cause damage in coral skeleton growth so if you comment pointing that out expect to see a "see item 4 of the post". However, with proper feeding schedules of your tank, population management of the said "pest" is more easily controlled/avoided. These snail cast mucus nets that lay across rock and inhibit algae growth yes but I have not observed any interference of coraline algae. Only that of the green longer algaes. I also have not ever personally observed any coral retraction, stunting or any adverse reaction to a mucus net hitting a coral. These muscus nets are often only deployed when feeding from what I have observed in the home aquarium. Now on the reef itself I have noticed they can be more constant. Is this because food is scarce or constantly available in low quantity in the ocean? That's a question we will never know.
5. But they are just unsightly... Valid point, especially when it is a true infestation and not a normal (healthy?) population to a thriving ecosystem.
So this is the "food for thought" point of this thread. Not necessarily a question to be answered. If these snails are a normal part of a thriving ecosystem and not actually a "pest" then instead of eradicating them from our reefs where they perform a function should we do our best to maintain a proportionate healthy population as we do with algae and other life that is naturally occurring and must be properly managed.
About me (If you care): I am a hobbyist about 15 years give or take of continuously keeping reef aquariums which has been challenging considering military service. I currently have 4 running systems. 3 are mixed reef and 1 SPS dominate. I am new to dosing aquariums. I have previously kept up with water changes and adding supplements as needed. Which became quite a chore with 4 tanks. I started keeping a reef tank shortly after I got into diving. Being in the military has forwarded me the opportunity to dive all over the world in South Korea, Japan, Turkey, Florida, Caymans, Honduras, Ecuador, Vietnam, Mexico, Italy, Croatia, Indonesia, Malaysia and the Philippines. My experiences and observations of wildlife in its natural state versus how we keep our aquariums is what lead me to the writing this thread. I've also used aquarium equipment from around the world. RO/DI is not something you find easily in some of the countries I was in when I started out so I often went against the normal practices using what was available and finding solutions to work within what was available. I can tell you now Italy was by far a hard place to have a reef aquarium around the early 2000's... I could write a book on homemade equipment from "my dark ages"
